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Pac-12 Expansion Preferences

Buffnik

Buffnik

Real name isn't Nik
Club Member
Junta Member
What school(s), if any, would you like to see the Pac-12 add?

Reading through various articles (Atlantic, SI, etc), here are the ones I've seen listed plus others I've seen on AB and other fan sites):

MWC
- San Diego State
- Fresno State
- UNLV
- Boise State
- Nevada
- Air Force

Big 12
- Houston
- TCU
- Texas Tech
- BYU
- Oklahoma State
- Kansas
- Iowa State

Other
- SMU
- Gonzaga (non-football)
- UC Davis
- UTSA
 
Fight CU said:
whErE is CoLorADo stAAAte...
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What's weird is that I haven't seen them mentioned. Early on, I often saw other P12 fan boards that were very high on CSU since it fit the paired rival model of the rest of the conference while being a good sized university with R1 research intensity, a solid academic rep, and only not AAU due to agg focus rather than not meeting general peer standards. I actually think that if Utah State had met the CSU standards we'd have had a decent chance of seeing a Pac-14 through those 2 schools.

At this point, though, it's about brands and market expansion to drive media revenue. Therefore, that old school approach seems dead since it's clearly net negative on revenue impact - duplicate market with the brand bringing nothing that drives national interest.
 
Buffnik said:
What's weird is that I haven't seen them mentioned. Early on, I often saw other P12 fan boards that were very high on CSU since it fit the paired rival model of the rest of the conference while being a good sized university with R1 research intensity, a solid academic rep, and only not AAU due to agg focus rather than not meeting general peer standards. I actually think that if Utah State had met the CSU standards we'd have had a decent chance of seeing a Pac-14 through those 2 schools.

At this point, though, it's about brands and market expansion to drive media revenue. Therefore, that old school approach seems dead since it's clearly net negative on revenue impact - duplicate market with the brand bringing nothing that drives national interest.
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it's a shame cause the stadium alone (incl shrubbery) warrants an SEC invite
 
San Diego State and Boise State - SoCal market, recruiting, good football and basketball, Idaho growing market, cripples mountain west to Big Sky, have to hold nose on academics for Boise

Houston, Texas Tech, TCU - moves into major Texas markets, good football, Academics are all ok

Kansas - excellent basketball, brings St. Louis market, good academics, easy W for Buffs football

I think those additions would push remaining Big 12 to look east for new schools. Remaining Mountain West schools wouldn’t have any draw at all, and I’d see Hawaii, New Mexico, and SJSU possibly dropping football altogether. PAC 12 would own 1/3rd of the country.
 
J.R. Ewing said:
USC/UCLA.
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I know this is a joke, but can we really discount this happening at some point in the future? The future of college football is so muddied right now that I wouldn’t completely discount any scenario.

short term, my choices would be BYU and KU.
 
SINKRATZ said:
Who the hell mentioned UC Davis? Setting aside the Dan Hawkins factor, that’s a school that brings zero to the table.
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I forget which site. The argument for them was not as a main option, but at the bottom as a possibility due to academics, UC system, and the Sacramento media market which is around #20.
 
Creebuzz said:
San Diego State and Boise State - SoCal market, recruiting, good football and basketball, Idaho growing market, cripples mountain west to Big Sky, have to hold nose on academics for Boise

Houston, Texas Tech, TCU - moves into major Texas markets, good football, Academics are all ok

Kansas - excellent basketball, brings St. Louis market, good academics, easy W for Buffs football

I think those additions would push remaining Big 12 to look east for new schools. Remaining Mountain West schools wouldn’t have any draw at all, and I’d see Hawaii, New Mexico, and SJSU possibly dropping football altogether. PAC 12 would own 1/3rd of the country.
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Schools dropping football (or football dropping to a lower level to be like Villanova) would be interesting.

If the Pac took non- football members, I'd jump at schools like New Mexico.
 
Buffnik said:
I forget which site. The argument for them was not as a main option, but at the bottom as a possibility due to academics, UC system, and the Sacramento media market which is around #20
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They are an FCS team with a stadium that fits something like 10,600. In order to move to the FBS a team needs to have 2 years average attendance above 15k. So it’s a non-starter and whoever posted them as a possibility in an article was really talking out their ass.
 
BuffinCali said:
Houston, BYU, Texas Tech, Boise State, Kansas, Oklahoma State (for a 16 team conference)
Add UNLV, TCU, Iowa State and San Diego State (for a 20 team conference)
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A great list, but I really do not see the P12 being able to poach B12 schools since it appears the $$$ is about a wash. Even more so the TX schools...none of the B12 TX schools are going anywhere. Only UT and aTm had the pull to get to a Power P5. The rest will band together like hostages on an airplane.

SMU is the play. Not B12, in the DFW and a decent team, with decent support. Couple that with SDSU, and you get back into SoCal.

My suspicion is the P12 is going to have to pick schools from G5 conferences.
 
At this point why does P12 want to expand?

Good money just became available. I see many of those teams as dilutive.

I’d be interested in best 2 Texas schools if B12 implodes (at a discount)
 
Houston, Texas Tech/SMU/TCU. Texas presence is most important for CU specifically.

Ok State, SDSU if expand by four.

KS for St Louis market, UC Davis for Sacramento/central Calif market. If go to 16.
 
If this is simply about the next 5 years or so, where everyone is trying to get into the P2, then give me SDSU and KU for 12 and UNLV and Nevada for 14. This scenario is purely from a perspective of whatever gives the Buffs the best chance at accumulating as many wins as possible to make bowl games and build the brand back up.

If you're asking about a scenario where the B1G and SEC are done expanding, or at least aren't interested in any of the programs you listed, then I'll take all 7 of the Big 12, SDSU, BSU, and maybe SMU to get to a 20 team western region conference that plays amongst itself as an obvious second tier of CFB, and has it's own 6 team playoff. However, in this scenario, I wouldn't be opposed to also including KSU and Baylor. Basically, a full on Big 12 and Pac 12 merger with some G5 additions to make 22-24 team league that is just satisfied competing on a lower level.
 
If money is relatively equal between Big 12 and Pac 10, how is ESPN not just directing a fully blown merger between the two? Or since ESPN may have to pay a premium for Pac 10 West Coast inventory, how is ESPN not directing top 6 Big 12 programs to the Pac 16 and just blowing up the Big 12?
 
The Alabaster Yak said:
If money is relatively equal between Big 12 and Pac 10, how is ESPN not just directing a fully blown merger between the two? Or since ESPN may have to pay a premium for Pac 10 West Coast inventory, how is ESPN not directing top 6 Big 12 programs to the Pac 16 and just blowing up the Big 12?
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If I'm coming from ESPN's perspective, I'm probably looking at how to blow up the Big 12, get the Pac to drop OSU/WSU, cherry pick some MWC and maybe AAC assets, and create the best Power 4 for tv ratings & timeslots with control of 3/4 (SEC, ACC, PAC). I don't know if they can pull that off, but it's very likely a much better ROI for them than a Power 5 would be. Especially since it looks like they'll have to make a Big East play now that they lost all that B1G hoops content.
 
Assuming that this round of realignment will only be in existence for 5-10 years until ND gives up their independence and the 40-50 team conference is formed, I would prefer SDSU and Boise. The only appeal any of the B12 schools has would be if it helps with recruiting in Texas. What might that get though, maybe a couple players a year?.

So keep it regional that makes some sense and hopefully in that 5-10 years CU can find a way to be something other than the dumpster fire they have been for the past 15 years.
 
BuffHerd said:
Houston, Texas Tech/SMU/TCU. Texas presence is most important for CU specifically.

Ok State, SDSU if expand by four.

KS for St Louis market, UC Davis for Sacramento/central Calif market. If go to 16.
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Having spent quite a bit of time in St. Louis, I don't think Kansas gets you that market. Almost everyone I met there was either an Illinois or Missou fan. It would pull in a good chuck of the Kansas City market through.

For my money, I'd take: SDSU, TCU, OK St., and Kansas.

If they go with more, probably UNLV and TX Tech
 
I'm liking the idea of taking SDSU & BSU for all sports and not expanding beyond 12 unless we can poach from the Big 12. Then, making offers for schools like UNLV & UNM for non-football but give some scheduling considerations to keep their football afloat.
 
Not really a fan of adding and just shutting it down or merging but if I had to pick, these would be the teams. I went with 4 to get to 14 and 2 additional if we want to go to 16:

- Oklahoma State
- San Diego State
- Houston
- TCU

- Kansas (really want to include these guys for bball but not sure it move the needle)
- SMU
 
Buffnik said:
If I'm coming from ESPN's perspective, I'm probably looking at how to blow up the Big 12, get the Pac to drop OSU/WSU, cherry pick some MWC and maybe AAC assets, and create the best Power 4 for tv ratings & timeslots with control of 3/4 (SEC, ACC, PAC). I don't know if they can pull that off, but it's very likely a much better ROI for them than a Power 5 would be. Especially since it looks like they'll have to make a Big East play now that they lost all that B1G hoops content.
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I don't see the Pac-10 kicking out any schools no matter how much ESPN might hypothetically want them to do so.

According to the bylaws chapter 2, section 4:

4. Termination, Suspension and Probation.
The Conference may place a member on probation or suspension, or terminate its membership, by vote of at least three-fourths of all the members of the CEO Group eligible to vote on the matter, for one or more of the following reasons: (6/10)
a. Materially violating the standards and requirements of the Conference, as set forth in this Constitution and Bylaws, or in the rules, regulations and policies adopted by the CEO Group; (6/10)
b. Violating rules and regulations of the NCAA, or becoming ineligible for active membership in Division I of the NCAA, by a written determination of the NCAA; or (6/10)
c. Withdrawing or attempting to withdraw from the Conference without complying with Section 3 above. (6/10)
Such disciplinary action may also include the assessment of financial penalties. No vote for probation, suspen- sion or termination shall occur unless the member subject to such action is notified, in writing, by the Commis- sioner of the alleged misconduct and is provided an opportunity to be heard at a meeting of the CEO Group. The CEO Group representative of the member charged with misconduct shall not be eligible to vote on any proposed disciplinary action The CEO Group shall adopt a Member Disciplinary Policy setting forth the pro- cedures such action will follow. (6/10)
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As I read this, not only would termination of conference membership require a three-fourths majority, it is limited to one of three reasons, none of which exist to my knowledge.
 
tsarbomba said:
They are an FCS team with a stadium that fits something like 10,600. In order to move to the FBS a team needs to have 2 years average attendance above 15k. So it’s a non-starter and whoever posted them as a possibility in an article was really talking out their ass.
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Their stadium can be easily expanded to 30-40K and has no running track.

Asking a FCS school to move up to the P12 would be too much at this point.
 
And for what teams we should add, it's not that complicated:

Phase 1:

1. San Diego State.
2. SMU if TCU does not come.

Phase 2:

1. UTSA.

Master Plan (with a future football stadium): https://www.utsa.edu/masterplan/pdf...ed that,U TSA Park West adjacent to Loop 1604.

UTSA just broke ground on their athletic training facility.

www.utsa.edu

UTSA breaks ground on facility to elevate athletics, provide public space

www.utsa.edu

2. Boise State.

Currently rated R2 for research. It's possible that the CHIPS Act could lead to a large new Micron plant in Boise which might indirectly benefit BSU.

 
I don't see anyway the Pac will be able to poach the B12 which eliminates Houston none of the other TX. B12 schools listed would move to a West Coast conference they don't fit culturally.
That leaves only two pieces of the Texas pie SMU & UTSA neither will accept a lower amount of revenue.
I'm waiting to see the outcome of the TV negotiations before looking at any expansion.
 
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