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What's our "rock bottom"?

Buffnik

Real name isn't Nik
Club Member
Junta Member
I'm wondering about what "rock bottom" means for CU football.

Is there a low the program can hit that would cause stakeholders to rally, refuse to accept it, and do what is necessary to be good or great again?

Or will it just be allowed to die since those who remember and most who of those who care are burnt out and finding they're happier if they stop caring so much?

Honestly, I think it's pretty much reached the point where it's not a bad cycle but a fact. CU football is dead.

I'm to the point where I think that CU should start talking to KU and other P5 schools that can't or won't commit to football to form a western version of the Big East. I think football has become a waste of time and money for the CU athletic department while the sport has become completely misaligned with university values.

So, at least for me as a fan and observer, I believe it hit rock bottom a long time ago, it's a grave, and I was unwilling to admit it to myself for a lot of years. It's past time for me to move on and focus on the other CU sports programs.
 

MtnBuff

Not allowed in Barzil 2
Club Member
I'm wondering about what "rock bottom" means for CU football.

Is there a low the program can hit that would cause stakeholders to rally, refuse to accept it, and do what is necessary to be good or great again?

Or will it just be allowed to die since those who remember and most who of those who care are burnt out and finding they're happier if they stop caring so much?

Honestly, I think it's pretty much reached the point where it's not a bad cycle but a fact. CU football is dead.

I'm to the point where I think that CU should start talking to KU and other P5 schools that can't or won't commit to football to form a western version of the Big East. I think football has become a waste of time and money for the CU athletic department while the sport has become completely misaligned with university values.

So, at least for me as a fan and observer, I believe it hit rock bottom a long time ago, it's a grave, and I was unwilling to admit it to myself for a lot of years. It's past time for me to move on and focus on the other CU sports programs.
As long as they can keep mining it for money it's not going away. They get the media money from the conference, they can still get 30k plus to buy tickets and show up paying for parking, concessions, etc. They can make money even sucking horribly badly and that is what they seem to be wanting to do.

As to rock bottom every time we think we have seen it they find some way to bring the program lower. Where the final bedrock is hard to say but we keep drilling towards it.
 

RollTad21

Club Member
Club Member
I was born in 1990. 62-36 was what really sealed the deal for me as a Buffs fan, although my dad always had been. So, I've witnessed a lot of bad CU football. I'm not sure what the program's rock bottom is, but this is the lowest I've ever felt as a fan. In the past I've always found something that convinced me things would get better (new coach, new facilities, moving to the Pac12, recruiting classes) but I can't do that now. There is literally not an aspect of the program I find to be optimistic about even with the most black and gold colored glasses.
 

Always BUFF

I post stupid ****
I'm wondering about what "rock bottom" means for CU football.

Is there a low the program can hit that would cause stakeholders to rally, refuse to accept it, and do what is necessary to be good or great again?

Or will it just be allowed to die since those who remember and most who of those who care are burnt out and finding they're happier if they stop caring so much?

Honestly, I think it's pretty much reached the point where it's not a bad cycle but a fact. CU football is dead.

I'm to the point where I think that CU should start talking to KU and other P5 schools that can't or won't commit to football to form a western version of the Big East. I think football has become a waste of time and money for the CU athletic department while the sport has become completely misaligned with university values.

So, at least for me as a fan and observer, I believe it hit rock bottom a long time ago, it's a grave, and I was unwilling to admit it to myself for a lot of years. It's past time for me to move on and focus on the other CU sports programs.
Nik hits it... do away with false expectations and some entitlement the past is past.
I've been a Buff for 55 years and lived through it all in cycle...even in it's worst there was always the belief that it couldn't get any worse..
I don't have the same faith anymore because I see no light at the end of tunnel...
I hope I live long enough to see CU beat USC.
 

The Alabaster Yak

Club Member
Club Member
It’s hard for me to agree with the OP because the same administration and regents were at the helm for a 10 win season and three straight 5 win seasons where competent coaching of individual games would/should have all been 6+ win seasons, which is all we’re really asking for isn’t it? Four consecutive bowl seasons with a Pac 12 Championship appearance?

I know it sounds crazy, but I think people are underestimating just how bad Karl Dorrell is as a football coach and how his lack of connections or “presence” in the CFB world has hurt his ability to have any kind of gravitas or pull for assistant coaches and good personnel people.

Mike MacIntyre made a 1 win program respectable again and that was with a smaller budget and below average recruiting.

CU doesn’t need Mel Tucker or Steve Sarkisian and an admin that allows them to bend all the rules to be a respectable P5 program. They just need someone better than Karl ****ing Dorrell.
 

GawainBuff

Well-Known Member
I'm wondering about what "rock bottom" means for CU football.

Is there a low the program can hit that would cause stakeholders to rally, refuse to accept it, and do what is necessary to be good or great again?

Or will it just be allowed to die since those who remember and most who of those who care are burnt out and finding they're happier if they stop caring so much?

Honestly, I think it's pretty much reached the point where it's not a bad cycle but a fact. CU football is dead.

I'm to the point where I think that CU should start talking to KU and other P5 schools that can't or won't commit to football to form a western version of the Big East. I think football has become a waste of time and money for the CU athletic department while the sport has become completely misaligned with university values.

So, at least for me as a fan and observer, I believe it hit rock bottom a long time ago, it's a grave, and I was unwilling to admit it to myself for a lot of years. It's past time for me to move on and focus on the other CU sports programs.
This is a blood bath. I’m not sure other teams aren’t getting blindsided by the mix of the NIL cash grab deals and the free agency transfer portal. But we were in an incredibly precarious position to start with, leaving us teetering in the ridiculous uncertainty of all of this.

The NCAA borders on being criminally negligent in all of this: they are essentially just stealing money from programs that follow their rules, and enriching the already rich.

Off topic a bit, but how can ASU not be in the middle of heavy sanctions this year? What the F*** is going on? Are there any rules left—aside from the one that prevented our HC from traveling to meet recruits from the time he was hired until December of this year? Why are we the only ones following these unenforced rules?
 
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Fogo

Well-Known Member
What kills me the most is the waste of the Champions Center. We never really saw a recruiting bump out of it which is the real shame since at the time we actually had facilities that went head to head with a lot of strong teams in the nation.Why even build it if the commitment to following up on it's strength isn't there?
 

GawainBuff

Well-Known Member
Mike MacIntyre rebuilt a 1 win program into a respectable program on the cusp and that was with a smaller budget and below average recruiting
This is a completely different world now. All of that growth under MM took time and patience, waiting for freshman starters to grow into fifth-year senior NFL prospects. And we got one good season out of it. No way those guys stay that long now. No way you keep that core together to get to that one good season now.
 

MiamiBuffs

YYZ
Club Member
I'm wondering about what "rock bottom" means for CU football.

Is there a low the program can hit that would cause stakeholders to rally, refuse to accept it, and do what is necessary to be good or great again?

Or will it just be allowed to die since those who remember and most who of those who care are burnt out and finding they're happier if they stop caring so much?

Honestly, I think it's pretty much reached the point where it's not a bad cycle but a fact. CU football is dead.

I'm to the point where I think that CU should start talking to KU and other P5 schools that can't or won't commit to football to form a western version of the Big East. I think football has become a waste of time and money for the CU athletic department while the sport has become completely misaligned with university values.

So, at least for me as a fan and observer, I believe it hit rock bottom a long time ago, it's a grave, and I was unwilling to admit it to myself for a lot of years. It's past time for me to move on and focus on the other CU sports programs.
Were not giving up the P12 money to join a KU catfish conference. Were gonna switch spots with Oregon St


My guess is when Phil retires things will start to turn around. That could be as soon as the next President being hired.
 
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The Alabaster Yak

Club Member
Club Member
This is a completely different world now. All of that growth under MM took time and patience, waiting for freshman starters to grow into fifth-year senior NFL prospects. And we got one good season out of it. No way those guys stay that long now. No way you keep that core together to get to that one good season now.
Eh, not many from that 2016 defense (or offense) we’re going to be starting elsewhere going into that season, so I don’t buy that guys who were recruited by MacIntyre would just be leaving for better programs a couple years in.

Remember that all of these recruits that are leaving were MM or Tucker recruits who were either being passed over, or don’t care to stick around this inept coaching staff.

Regardless, my point is more about the fact that this administration has approved lower admissions over the past 5-10 years relative to before, has approved much larger coaching contracts and gotten on board with the multi year contracts once it went into law, and weren’t the issue with MacIntyre not being able to beat Oregon State at home to start 6-0 in 2018, or Mel Tucker losing to AFA and Arizona at home.

This program can be a 6+ win program with the current support, but the AD has to make a competent hire for Head Coach.
 

Mr. Babar

I have no elephant books
Club Member
The only way for CU football to ever recover is through a dynamic and visionary coach who has the full support of the university. We have neither at the moment.

Apathy in a fan base is far worse than disappointment/frustration IMO, and I don’t think I have ever cared less about the program. The fat lady has been singing for a while me thinks.
 

dio

Admin
Club Member
Junta Member
I'm wondering about what "rock bottom" means for CU football.

Is there a low the program can hit that would cause stakeholders to rally, refuse to accept it, and do what is necessary to be good or great again?

Or will it just be allowed to die since those who remember and most who of those who care are burnt out and finding they're happier if they stop caring so much?

Honestly, I think it's pretty much reached the point where it's not a bad cycle but a fact. CU football is dead.

I'm to the point where I think that CU should start talking to KU and other P5 schools that can't or won't commit to football to form a western version of the Big East. I think football has become a waste of time and money for the CU athletic department while the sport has become completely misaligned with university values.

So, at least for me as a fan and observer, I believe it hit rock bottom a long time ago, it's a grave, and I was unwilling to admit it to myself for a lot of years. It's past time for me to move on and focus on the other CU sports programs.
The program is dead. Other then one glorious season, the team has been a dumpster for over 15 years now. The donors who want to return it to glory are aging out. The younger graduates don't have the memories of the glorious football to tie them to the school - and franklyt the millennials on down don't have the same financial outlook that the older generations bring. The AD itself is broke. The University as a whole has a big fight coming as higher ed in general faces a sea change. The state has structural limits in place via the BoR that inhibit the ability to get a cohesive vision that includes athletics. NIL and the growing regional status (and associated regional wealth) of the sport are going to leave CU in the dust.

My main hope is that when CFB blows up due to the money, that there will be some sort of collegiate league ala hockey or baseball that has some parity and equity that makes sense for CU so that I can enjoy the sport again.
 

pcbuff

Well-Known Member
Rock bottom was a coach throwing away a road win desolate Kansas do his son could go after a passing record. Everything since has been better. We’ve had lots of ups and downs, but having a guy play his son at QB while other quality kids sat on the bench or left was so unforgivable. We were so small town rec league.
 

PAHIBuff

It's a big world
Club Member
Rock bottom was a coach throwing away a road win desolate Kansas do his son could go after a passing record. Everything since has been better. We’ve had lots of ups and downs, but having a guy play his son at QB while other quality kids sat on the bench or left was so unforgivable. We were so small town rec league.
Hawkins was an unethical grifter but the rock bottom was the Embree regime. Could be headed there again.
 

rosstr

Your Resident “POS Poster”
The absence of hope is rock bottom. Through Hawkins, Embree, MacIntyre there was still hope that a single hire could be transformative. Now, not only is Cardboard awful, but the college football landscape has distorted so significantly that there is no hope. That is rock bottom.
 

Swish

Half a bubble off
Club Member
I don't think we have hit rock bottom yet, but we will in the next couple of years, and there won't be many pieces to pick up. I don't have much faith that it will bounce back and figure we will become a regular fixture in the "Bottom Ten". College football is going through some massive changes as it is, and the house is such a mess that the Buffs are neither capable of reacting nor responding to the changes.

Money is being thrown around that CU just doesn't have and is not going to get with the product that it is turning out. The real major college programs are in complete control and why should they relinquish any of their power when all the money and glory is coming their way. The Buffs can't get out of their own way at this point.

I don't think there are any wealthy benefactors out there that are willing to commit much to save it at this point either.
 

Swish

Half a bubble off
Club Member
The absence of hope is rock bottom. Through Hawkins, Embree, MacIntyre there was still hope that a single hire could be transformative. Now, not only is Cardboard awful, but the college football landscape has distorted so significantly that there is no hope. That is rock bottom.
I think this is right and would only add to it one other factor - indifference. When no hope and indifference sets in, it's pretty much done.
 

hokiehead

Gobbler on the Mountain!
Club Member
Rock bottom is when a school has NCAA sanctions and excessive player legal issues as well as poor performance. CU fans can still hold their heads up high that we haven't been (caught) cheating and our player legal issues aren't more than the norm.
 

rosstr

Your Resident “POS Poster”
Rock bottom is when a school has NCAA sanctions and excessive player legal issues as well as poor performance. CU fans can still hold their heads up high that we haven't been (caught) cheating and our player legal issues aren't more than the norm.
Lol. NCAA compliance train left 10 years ago. It’s actually incriminating that CU hasn’t been accused of violations.

Moreover, Cardboard is so square he probably removes the raisins from his Raisin Bran.
“Honey, I just get too amped up from all that sugar in the morning. And I’m worried about minor kidney damage 30 years from now.”
 

Buffs61

Well-Known Member
The Buffs death sentence was actually in 2001 with the non-scandal…scandal. It was the cancer within CU Boulder. The self-imposed hand wringing and local media witch-hunt. Since then CU has been on Death-Row. We have only had glimpses as if we might get an appeal, only for the hundredth shoe to drop.

Several coaches since have stated that the program was burnt to the ground. Ever since CU has struggled and has had no real identity other than losing year after year.

I think CU is going to have to go to what some smaller programs do with their gimmicky offensives and risk taking defenses. Coach Mac went to the wishbone, triple option to get the program moving in the right direction. I would not mind going with something similar to the service academies systems until CU starts winning and going to bowls again.

Is this rock bottom much different from what our program was when Chuck Fairbanks left? Can we find some new high-energy young coach like coach Mac was in the earlier 80’s? We can only hope.
 

Bliff Cranch

Should be in the Fall of Hame
The Buffs death sentence was actually in 2001 with the non-scandal…scandal. It was the cancer within CU Boulder. The self-imposed hand wringing and local media witch-hunt. Since then CU has been on Death-Row. We have only had glimpses as if we might get an appeal, only for the hundredth shoe to drop.

Several coaches since have stated that the program was burnt to the ground. Ever since CU has struggled and has had no real identity other than losing year after year.

I think CU is going to have to go to what some smaller programs do with their gimmicky offensives and risk taking defenses. Coach Mac went to the wishbone, triple option to get the program moving in the right direction. I would not mind going with something similar to the service academies systems until CU starts winning and going to bowls again.

Is this rock bottom much different from what our program was when Chuck Fairbanks left? Can we find some new high-energy young coach like coach Mac was in the earlier 80’s? We can only hope.
Approaches that worked in the past won’t work today. With NIL, the portal, no real governance from the NCAA, and the spectre of conference realignment only the strongest will prosper and be able to attract and keep on-field and coaching talent. This is doomsday for programs like CU.

It’s over.
 

BuffLuke80

Long Dong Silver
Club Member
Maybe hitting rock bottom is exactly what needs to happen. I know it did with me to open my eyes. Does the same thing apply to an AD or University? I would think it would if you get the right pieces in place and start over. I've already said I don't have much faith in that with CU, but it's not impossible.
 

Buffs61

Well-Known Member
Dial-A-Ride - 12/28
Approaches that worked in the past won’t work today. With NIL, the portal, no real governance from the NCAA, and the spectre of conference realignment only the strongest will prosper and be able to attract and keep on-field and coaching talent. This is doomsday for programs like CU.

It’s over.
You may be right with the future of where things are going. Currently the Service academy's are doing it and beating teams with 2 & 3 star recruits. I figured that is about at the level CU recruits. Teams don't practice much against those style of teams even though they usually have better overall athletes. I'm looking for away to turn the CU Titanic around. It may or may not work. Any other ideas besides packing our tents and going home?
 

Bliff Cranch

Should be in the Fall of Hame
Dial-A-Ride - 12/28

You may be right with the future of where things are going. Currently the Service academy's are doing it and beating teams with 2 & 3 star recruits. I figured that is about at the level CU recruits. Teams don't practice much against those style of teams even though they usually have better overall athletes. I'm looking for away to turn the CU Titanic around. It may or may not work. Any other ideas besides packing our tents and going home?
The stars have to align. The BOR have to immediately realize their next presidential hire has to embrace athletics as a key pillar in the burnishing of the Boulder campus image. That new president has to then clean house by immediately firing Phil DiStefano and then retool the athletic department’s approach to fielding a competitive football team. He or she will have to lobby the state legislature to allow more progressive approaches to NIL. If all that happens in the next 24 months, there may be a chance for CU to settle into a 7 to 8 win pattern as part of the second-tier of college football. If it doesn’t, I think CU could become a middling football program on the scale of New Mexico in five years.
 
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