Moore Out At Wazzu

[Goose]

A few weeks ago, I thought that Wazzu could be a darkhorse to make some noise in the Pac-12 this year. They have one of the best players in the conference in Brock Motum and a PG who's started for three seasons in Reggie Moore.

Oops.

Moore was dismissed from Wazzu for a violation of team rules yesterday. It hasn't come out yet with what he's done, but that's a huge hole in WSU's lineup. As that article points out, he wasn't an efficient player, but he was a good one. With this and Demarquise Johnson being ruled ineligible, unless Motum reaches a whole other level, we can start penciling WSU in with ASU & Utah at the bottom of the conference rather than keeping them in the 4-9 range.

 

[sackman]

I still can't believe USC is going to be as good as people seem to predict. I have never seen a worse basketball team than USC was last year. Absolutely atrocious. I have a difficult time believing they could improve that much in the span of one year.

 

[Darth Snow]

Good news for us. They have a nice arena too. Too bad for them.

 

[tante]

well we only play them once and it is there, so this can only help us.

 

[Darth Snow]

well we only play them once and it is there, so this can only help us.

dammit. of course we only play them once. Don't tell me we also only play ASU and UU once too? :lol:

 

[Goose]

I still can't believe USC is going to be as good as people seem to predict. I have never seen a worse basketball team than USC was last year. Absolutely atrocious. I have a difficult time believing they could improve that much in the span of one year.

They are gaining Jio Fontan (who could be an All-Pac-12 player this season) and J.T. Terrell. I'm not saying they're going to win the conference, but they should be in the grouping between 4 and 7 where it's going to be a dogfight.

 

[tante]

dammit. of course we only play them once. Don't tell me we also only play ASU and UU once too? :lol:

no we are playing them both twice, but if we are going to play WSU once anywhere, glad it is on the road.

 

[Goose]

no we are playing them both twice, but if we are going to play WSU once anywhere, glad it is on the road.

And with McLaughlin not going to UDub, the "road only" games just got easier. Might be the best pairing to have as road only games.

 

[BuffaloSoldier76]

And with McLaughlin not going to UDub, the "road only" games just got easier. Might be the best pairing to have as road only games.

Weren't the Washington schools saying the same thing about making the Mountain swing prior to the start of last season? Just saying. Hopefully this equates to wins for us. Road wins are always big and tough to come by.

 

[sackman]

Help me out - how many "road onlys" do we play? Seems like last year we had UCLA and USC. So do they rotate based on groupings?

 

[BuffaloSoldier76]

Help me out - how many "road onlys" do we play? Seems like last year we had UCLA and USC. So do they rotate based on groupings?

Pretty sure you have one road-only and one home-only pair each year. Last year we missed the SoCal teams in Boulder, and we didn't have to make a trip to Washington. This year, that is reversed (which sucks that we don't get the LA exposure this year).

 

[Goose]

Correct. Last year we got the Washingtons at home and LA on the road. This year we have the Washingtons on the road and LA at home.

Edit - BuffaloSoldier beat me to it.

 

[sackman]

Pretty sure you have one road-only and one home-only pair each year. Last year we missed the SoCal teams in Boulder, and we didn't have to make a trip to Washington. This year, that is reversed (which sucks that we don't get the LA exposure this year).

We got plenty of LA exposure at the Pac 12 tournament last year.

 

[BuffaloSoldier76]

We got plenty of LA exposure at the Pac 12 tournament last year.

Truth! :thumbsup:

 

[tante]

We got plenty of LA exposure at the Pac 12 tournament last year.

we are definitely on the radar in that area.

 

[jgisland]

Stats! From a win share prospective this isn't a huge loss. He was the 6th most productive player on the team. His advanced stats numbers are great for him either. 40.6 efg% and TS% of 47.9.

Player	Brock Motum	Reggie Moore	DaVonte Lacy	Faisal Aden	Marcus Capers	Abe Lodwick	D.J. Shelton	Mychal Ladd	Charlie Enquist	Dexter Kernich-Drew	Patrick Simon
Offensive Win Share	4.75	0.56	1.45	0.89	1.56	1.56	1.22	0.35	1.08	0.16	0.21
Defensive Win Share	0.96	0.87	0.64	0.38	1.20	0.47	0.64	0.31	0.56	0.14	0.10
Total Win Share	5.70	1.43	2.09	1.27	2.77	2.03	1.85	0.66	1.64	0.30	0.31

 

[Goose]

Surprised he's 6th on the team, but I will point out that Capers, Aden & Enquist are all seniors. So with the loss of Moore, they're down to only two of their top 6 players returning. Moore was 58th in the nation in assist rate and had a good rate of getting to the free throw line. If nothing else, he opened things up for Motum. Now, who's going to do that? Lacy?

 

[Goose]

Hat tip to Pachoops for finding this one, but I wonder if this is behind Moore's dismissal. And more importantly, do we know what Snow, Rugged & Teets were up to Saturday night?

Potential WSU basketball recruit arrested for MIP
A basketball recruit was arrested Saturday for minor in possession of alcohol and lying to police.

Pullman police arrested Chad E. Frazier, 20, around midnight at 880 NE B Street and NE California Street. A Daily Evergreen reporter on the scene witnessed the arrest.

Frazier, a point guard for Gulf Coast State College in North Carolina, gave police false information about his identity and background, but identified himself as a basketball recruit. He eventually surrendered his identification card to police, revealing his age and address.

Athletics Department spokesman Bill Stevens said he was not aware of any connection between the arrest and senior point guard Reggie Moore’s removal from the team. The Daily Evergreen contacted Jessica Schmick, spokeswoman for the basketball team, but she was unavailable for comment.

Frazier verbally committed to Oklahoma State on Monday, according to Cougfan.com.


http://dailyevergreen.wsu.edu/read/Potential-WSU-basketball-recruit-arrested-for-MIP

 

[tante]

I am shocked that things like underage drinking happen at a school like WSU.

 

[Darth Snow]

Hat tip to Pachoops for finding this one, but I wonder if this is behind Moore's dismissal. And more importantly, do we know what Snow, Rugged & Teets were up to Saturday night?

We were in the area. I can neither confirm nor deny any allegedly wrong legal advice that may or may not have been given to any current, future, or former WSU students.

 

[CVilleBuff]

I still can't believe USC is going to be as good as people seem to predict. I have never seen a worse basketball team than USC was last year. Absolutely atrocious. I have a difficult time believing they could improve that much in the span of one year.

Not buying it either. They'll be improved, but I have never seen a team that bad. They went ****ing 1-17 in the Pac last year and couldn't even beat Utah. They could be VASTLY improved and only make it to 10th. 4th or 5th just isn't happening for them. O'Neill isn't a good head coach..

Before Wazzu's current situation, I didn't see them making it above 7th. Now they're ****ed.

 

[jgisland]

Surprised he's 6th on the team, but I will point out that Capers, Aden & Enquist are all seniors. So with the loss of Moore, they're down to only two of their top 6 players returning. Moore was 58th in the nation in assist rate and had a good rate of getting to the free throw line. If nothing else, he opened things up for Motum. Now, who's going to do that? Lacy?

Agreed, while he isn't a great player he is certainly better than anything else they have and this will really hurt Motum's production.

 

[jgisland]

Not buying it either. They'll be improved, but I have never seen a team that bad. They went ****ing 1-17 in the Pac last year and couldn't even beat Utah. They could be VASTLY improved and only make it to 10th. 4th or 5th just isn't happening for them. O'Neill isn't a good head coach..

Before Wazzu's current situation, I didn't see them making it above 7th. Now they're ****ed.

This is college basketball, this isn't college football. It is very easy to be dramatically improved year over year. Bring in 1 or 2 new players and you can go from the cellar to competing for conference titles. USC had a lot of bad luck last year with injuries, bring those guys back and the incoming frosh and they "should" be a lot better.

 

[BuffaloSoldier76]

This is college basketball, this isn't college football. It is very easy to be dramatically improved year over year. Bring in 1 or 2 new players and you can go from the cellar to competing for conference titles. USC had a lot of bad luck last year with injuries, bring those guys back and the incoming frosh and they "should" be a lot better.

This man speaks much truth.

 

[sackman]

That all assumes that the rest of the conference either stayed the same or got worse. I don't believe that, either. Remember, last year was probably the worst year in the history of the conference in terms of Basketball. USC was the worst team in the conference during it's all time worst season. Pretty much every other team has to have improved since then (except for maybe UW, who seems snakebit right now), so just getting better doesn't say much to me.

Put me in the "I'll believe it when I see it" camp.

 

[jgisland]

I am not a believer that the Pac-12 is going to be better. CAL, UW, WSU and UTAH may not be worse than last year, but they certainly aren't better. Only Arizona and UCLA can you definitively say are going to be better, there may be better top end talent but the middle and bottom could be worse.

 

[CVilleBuff]

This is college basketball, this isn't college football. It is very easy to be dramatically improved year over year. Bring in 1 or 2 new players and you can go from the cellar to competing for conference titles. USC had a lot of bad luck last year with injuries, bring those guys back and the incoming frosh and they "should" be a lot better.

USC isn't going to be very good, even with improvement. I'm hardly claiming they're going 6-26 (1-17) again. I'm claiming they aren't going to be a good basketball team. Coaching matters in college basketball, even if it can't always be clear cut in statistical form. You can put them 4th. I'll put them 10th. We'll see who comes out closer in March. I expect maybe 15 wins for them total. Renaldo Woolridge simply isn't very good, and their "depth" is overblown

I'm not even sure where I was so drastically wrong in my last remarks. I said they could be vastly improved. The point is they were so atrocious that vast improvement could still result in 10th.

There's a parallel between college football and basketball, and that's knowing how to win. We were fortunate enough to figure it out relatively quickly as '09/'10 progressed after years in the doldrums. Other teams don't figure it out so quickly. When you're down 3 with a minute left after a 1-17 season, are you able to gut it out and pull out the W, or does uncertainly creep into your head? We'll see.

 

[jgisland]

USC could be atrocious, Jio could not be fully recovered, they could have injuries or they could just play terrible and revolt against O'neill. Lots could happen, notice I put "should" be better, in parenthesis, you never know what can happen.

My point was, that it is very easy to make a dramatic turnaround in college basketball. Look at somebody like Missouri a few years ago, in 07/08 they went 16-16 and then graduated a bunch of guys. In 08/09 they brought in 5 frosh and 2 transfers and went 31-7, went to the elite 8 all with the same coach.

 

[CVilleBuff]

USC could be atrocious, Jio could not be fully recovered, they could have injuries or they could just play terrible and revolt against O'brien. Lots could happen, notice I put "should" be better, in parenthesis, you never know what can happen.

My point was, that it is very easy to make a dramatic turnaround in college basketball. Look at somebody like Missouri a few years ago, in 07/08 they went 16-16 and then graduated a bunch of guys. In 08/09 they brought in 5 frosh and 2 transfers and went 31-7, went to the elite 8 all with the same coach.

You won't find an argument from me there. Much easier. All it takes is one or two guys (and it's much easier to have a major influence as freshmen) and you can fix a basketball team. We obviously witnessed that firsthand with Burks and Dre. Although coaching certainly helped our '10/'11 breakout as well. I think USC will be better. If they hit 15 wins, that would certainly be a significant improvement and should buy O'Neill a final decisive season. That said, it's a much longer road upwards for them than most.

USC has so much potential, especially with the Galen Center these days.

 

[tante]

a serious basketball discussion about another school in the middle of football season

#basketballschool