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Props to D.J. Eliot and our young D

Drewdown

Drewdown

Well-Known Member
Stating the obvious but two games and six points from our opponents is legit. I don't care who we have played, that is as impressive a stat as we have in this young season. For a team that was supposed to win in shootout fashion, it's good to see a traditional Black and Gold defense holding down their end. Hoping we build off this momentum and Eliot and company continue to impress! Go Buffs!
 
I'm a fan so far. Obviously they have bent a little, but the 3rd down defense has been outstanding.
 
Last year's CU defense had several professional quality players with a ton of college experience. Oregon does not have this kind of talent. Scheme can only get you so far with subpar talent.
 
manhattanbuf said:
Last year's CU defense had several professional quality players with a ton of college experience. Oregon does not have this kind of talent. Scheme can only get you so far with subpar talent.
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I didn't go so far as to check offense vs. defense, but Oregon had Top 25 classes 2013-2017.

I can buy the argument that it takes time for personnel to adapt to the scheme or possibly different personnel switching to the 3-4 - I get that. Saying they don't have the talent, I don't buy right now.
 
I never said Oregon has zero talent. I said that Oregon's defensive talent today doesnt compare favorably to the professional level talent & high level of experience CU had last season. Leavitt is a good skills coach and skilled tactical coordinator. To say that he's not good at his job because his team this year isn't as good as one of the best defenses we've had in several years is a poor argument.

Highlander said:
I didn't go so far as to check offense vs. defense, but Oregon had Top 25 classes 2013-2017.

I can buy the argument that it takes time for personnel to adapt to the scheme or possibly different personnel switching to the 3-4 - I get that. Saying they don't have the talent, I don't buy right now.
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manhattanbuf said:
I never said Oregon has zero talent. I said that Oregon's defensive talent today doesnt compare favorably to the professional level talent & high level of experience CU had last season. Leavitt is a good skills coach and skilled tactical coordinator. To say that he's not good at his job because his team this year isn't as good as one of the best defenses we've had in several years is a poor argument.
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Sorry, man. Not buying that argument. It isn't talent - it's coaching. The obvious scenario is that Leavitt coaches them up and they improve over this year and are even better next year. That's coaching. Not talent.

Please don't give me the stats of how many CU players were drafted last year off defense vs. OU. Their coaching was horrific. Nobody gets drafted when you look that bad.

Ultimately, I think we are 20 degrees apart and arguing semantics mostly. Leavitt's OU defense will be good next year, even if they are not this year.
 
If you sincerely think Oregon's current defense talent level is as good as CU's from last year, then you're right: we won't be able to agree.

Highlander said:
Sorry, man. Not buying that argument. It isn't talent - it's coaching. The obvious scenario is that Leavitt coaches them up and they improve over this year and are even better next year. That's coaching. Not talent.

Please don't give me the stats of how many CU players were drafted last year off defense vs. OU. Their coaching was horrific. Nobody gets drafted when you look that bad.

Ultimately, I think we are 20 degrees apart and arguing semantics mostly. Leavitt's OU defense will be good next year, even if they are not this year.
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manhattanbuf said:
If you sincerely think Oregon's current defense talent level is as good as CU's from last year, then you're right: we won't be able to agree.
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I'm genuinely impressed that after 1.5 games of Oregon football this year, you know enough about their talent to make that statement. I admit I am a dumbass on evaluating talent. All I know is that the folks paid to evaluate HS talent thought Oregon was higher rated than we were.

I look forward to picking up this conversation in February after we see who is drafted off of OU's defense this year. I guess.
 
By your own admission, you didn't look to see offensive vs. defensive player breakdown. Your star rating argument from high school is kind-of irrelevant based upon this statement. As a team, yes, Oregon's player pool had higher ratings out of high school.

You've really mucked up the debate, so I'll make it clear: Oregon's current defense doesn't have the same quality of players CU did last year. Leavitt is a very good defensive coach. Just because his current team isn't as good as his players from last year doesn't diminish Leavitt's ability. So far, I can't see much refutation of this point.

Highlander said:
I'm genuinely impressed that after 1.5 games of Oregon football this year, you know enough about their talent to make that statement. I admit I am a dumbass on evaluating talent. All I know is that the folks paid to evaluate HS talent thought Oregon was higher rated than we were.

I look forward to picking up this conversation in February. I guess.
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Highlander said it, but you can't judge Leavitt on this year. He's an excellent defensive coordinator. MacIntyre was a defensive coordinator of the year and will have CU playing well on D too. Not mutually exclusive between the two coaches.
 
manhattanbuf said:
By your own admission, you didn't look to see offensive vs. defensive player breakdown. Your star rating argument from high school is kind-of irrelevant based upon this statement. As a team, yes, Oregon's player pool had higher ratings out of high school.

You've really mucked up the debate, so I'll make it clear: Oregon's current defense doesn't have the same quality of players CU did last year. Leavitt is a very good defensive coach. Just because his current team isn't as good as his players from last year doesn't diminish Leavitt's ability. So far, I can't see much refutation of this point.
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So it is my fault you can't prove Oregon's talent level this year is worse than CU's last year? Sure - maybe. But we don't know. Well, at least I don't know. I'm out.

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Drewdown said:
Stating the obvious but two games and six points from our opponents is legit. I don't care who we have played, that is as impressive a stat as we have in this young season. For a team that was supposed to win in shootout fashion, it's good to see a traditional Black and Gold defense holding down their end. Hoping we build off this momentum and Eliot and company continue to impress! Go Buffs!
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Not sure how these conclusions are drawn yet. If CU D is legit, what are some of these teams playing on TV right now.

Really legit?
 
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There's certainly a question how well Leavitt is able to personally coach guys up, and how much credit he deserves for last year's D.
Clark is a good DB coach, who definitely coaches exactly the HCMM method, and that's where I saw tremendous improvement.

Will be interesting to watch as the season goes on how well they improve. They are very young at some spots, and D's tend to be as good as the weakest link.

As for Leavitt next year, he will personally be very disappointed if he's still in Eugene. His crazywife stayed behind to "keep their kids in the same school". It's not like they are a year from graduating or anything, their very young. They truly expect this to be a 1 and done year in Eugene.
 
hawg1 said:
Not sure how these conclusions are drawn yet. If CU D is legit, what are some of these teams playing on TV right now.

Really legit?
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My God. For once we don't have to be completely negative and skeptical about CU football and people still try and tear apart anything and everything they can. This D is young and transitioning with a new coach and they have held two teams to 3 points each. I for one am happy about that. Is there room for improvement? Always but this has been a bright spot in both games out of the gate. Take it and enjoy it for once. It feels good not to hate on everything.
 
Drewdown said:
My God. For once we don't have to be completely negative and skeptical about CU football and people still try and tear apart anything and everything they can. This D is young and transitioning with a new coach and they have held two teams to 3 points each. I for one am happy about that. Is there room for improvement? Always but this has been a bright spot in both games out of the gate. Take it and enjoy it for once. It feels good not to hate on everything.
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Not hating. Just reacting to your comments, which I did not think were legit.

Will be good to see this D against a good O.
 
hawg1 said:
Not hating. Just reacting to your comments, which I did not think were legit.

Will be good to see this D against a good O.
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Most relevant teams are in the exhibition period of the season, playing their cream puff ooc schedule. Find another team that is doing what we are? I'm sure there are a few but like shoulder said, regardless of who you are playing that's solid. These are all talented kids capable of making plays and we have shut them down. It's a pleasant surprise.
 
They are playing well, especially at certain positions.

They may or may not be legit. Way too early to anoint them.
 
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Drewdown said:
Most relevant teams are in the exhibition period of the season, playing their cream puff ooc schedule. Find another team that is doing what we are? I'm sure there are a few but like shoulder said, regardless of who you are playing that's solid. These are all talented kids capable of making plays and we have shut them down. It's a pleasant surprise.
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There is only one other team in the P5 that hasn't given up a touchdown: Clemson. That's it. Everyone else has at least given up a touchdown, even to creampuffs.
 
Not sure about the D as a whole (I still think we need to be a bit more consistent against the run in the front 7) but what I do know is Oliver is going to be a Thorpe finalist this year because he is without question one of the best defensive backs in the nation. He is arguably the most versatile athlete (dont think any other college football db can come anywhere near his personal best decathlon score from this year) playing an athlete based position. His interception today was one of the most athletic plays I have ever seen a db make (excluding plays that involve only raw speed or jumping ability). His ability to exhibit perfect body control while at or near full speed is uncommon even in many NFL corners (who often slow down a little bit when finding the ball, or get in knock the ball down mode).
 
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