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Special Teams
- Thread starter cmgoods
- Start date
Spruce might not be the most explosive guy out there, but he seems like the kind of guy that can field them consistently and not lose yards trying to reverse directions.
Last year we had 89 punt return yards, for the season.
Funny, outside of the CSU game, I don't really recall us forcing anyone to punt. Surprised we had that many.
letsgoavs192
I support systemic racism
I still think the fumble at the end of the half on the punt against CSU changed the season. If we don't turn it over there we are up 14-3 at half I think and we probably win that game. I also think we would have beat Sacramento State and who knows, maybe we end up winning 4 games total.
The worst part is the year before we did the same thing against Ohio State. Fumbled a punt on our own 10 with 15 seconds left in the half. I told myself Embree would learn his lesson but I was wrong. Why against CSU are we even putting a guy back with less than 20 seconds to field a punt on his own 10? So stupid.
The worst part is the year before we did the same thing against Ohio State. Fumbled a punt on our own 10 with 15 seconds left in the half. I told myself Embree would learn his lesson but I was wrong. Why against CSU are we even putting a guy back with less than 20 seconds to field a punt on his own 10? So stupid.
TE coaches don't normally have to deal with those type of decisions.....
BuffNut99
Club Member
I keep watching the win over Wazzu (Pac 12 Network shows it repeatedly), and I notice new stupidities by the prior staff every time. Embree didn't know how to call timeouts in the final minute. He would first walk out onto the field towards the head official, who shook his head and pointed him to go over to the line judge to call TO. CU ran a play, got stuffed, and Embree wanted to call TO again... so he walked straight on to the field towards the head ref again.
Lt.Col.FrankSlade
Well-Known Member
Opponents only punted 16 damn times ALL SEASON.
16 punts in a 12 game season. That is incredible.
We forced 47 punts. We only returned 16 of them. The rest were out of bounds, or fair caught.
http://www.cfbstats.com/2012/leader/national/team/defense/split01/category06/sort05.html
Given our D, I'd say the opponents failed 47 times to score instead of us forcing a punt :wow:
Lt.Col.FrankSlade
Well-Known Member
Fight CU
Well-Known Member
You don't believe that? Why not? Special teams tilt the field. If you have really good special teams, you can be pretty bad and still manage to pull out a few wins in a year. I absolutely believe that.
I believe that, but I think we're far from having good special teams. Our return game is below average. We kicked virtually 0 FGs. Our kick offs fell short, and our return coverage was dreadful.
dunno. I think solid special teams mostly prevent you from losing 3-4 games per year. (remember CSU and UU last year?) Usually teams that win with special teams are also very good at defense.
I agree completely. We're far from even average special teams, IMO. Hawkins had what appeared to be an outright disdain for special teams. It was like he wished it wasn't even part of the game, and gave it the attention he felt it deserved. Embree at least seemed to care about it, but was incapable of actually improving it.
Remember Barney's last year here? We sucked, but we had good special teams. Really good. Special teams won't win you a game against Texas with VY running the show. But it'll beat some other teams with similar talent. That's where I'm coming from on this. It's not enough to make you a contender, but it's enough to keep you in games and win a few here and there. That's all. That's a lot more than what we've had for the last 7 years.
Jon's two seasons were worse than any Dan Hawkins team except 2006 from a KR/PR stand point by a mile.
Edit, was there a rule change between the 06-07 seasons for Kickoffs?
Buff_nc
Well-Known Member
Seems like a pretty conservative choice. Probably makes sense for early in the season. I'm pulling for Mosely for kickoffs.
Fight CU
Well-Known Member
It may give 1-2 games for an otherwise good team, but not 3-4 wins for a terrible team. JMHO
There was a rule change last year, but I don't remember anything in 06-07. They *might* have moved the kickoff line back to the 35 from the 40 that year.
In any event, Jon's teams were worse than everybody's. Not just in special teams, but across the board. Hawkins didn't care, but Jon was incapable.
For a team like our's STs can be huge. Completely different world for a young QB like Wood starting a drive at the 30 instead of the 15. Major difference for our defense when the opponent is starting inside the 25 instead of outside the 35.
STs can easily give you 50-100 yards a game that don't show up in the offensive and defensive stats. Get a punt blocked and you give the opponent a short field. Force fair catches and you not only save yardage but eliminate the risk of a big game swinging return. Force a fumble on a return deep in opponents territory and you have a very high percentage chance to score.
It seems like the teams that have really good STs win a lot of games that they otherwise shouldn't. I also think that you can make significant gains in ST quality in a fairly short time. On the other hand to be outstanding on STs does take more time and also require more depth of talent than we have.
I don't see us being outstanding but even being competent would be a huge step up from the last couple years.
STs can easily give you 50-100 yards a game that don't show up in the offensive and defensive stats. Get a punt blocked and you give the opponent a short field. Force fair catches and you not only save yardage but eliminate the risk of a big game swinging return. Force a fumble on a return deep in opponents territory and you have a very high percentage chance to score.
It seems like the teams that have really good STs win a lot of games that they otherwise shouldn't. I also think that you can make significant gains in ST quality in a fairly short time. On the other hand to be outstanding on STs does take more time and also require more depth of talent than we have.
I don't see us being outstanding but even being competent would be a huge step up from the last couple years.
I agree. I think we've been so awful on special teams that it's cost us games in the last couple years. We have a long way to go just to become average in special teams. In order to get to the point where it's actually helping win games, you have to be very good, IMO. Virginia Tech comes to mind as a team that probably has reasonably good talent, but wins a lot of games due to outstanding special teams play.
agree with this. Terrible teams aren't in the hunt that many times a year.
Mosley took one 100 yards against Utah last year to tie that game. But then Utah scored on the ensuing kickoff, cementing Jon Embree's ouster imo.
6 of those were on 3rd down because they felt bad for us.
boydbuff
Club Member
I'm with you-would love someone with more speed if he also had good hands. Why not someone like DD?
Sacky is right. Special teams can make a bad team mediocre, and the mediocre team pretty good. John Torp was probably one of the most underrated weapons during Barney's tenure. Torp could flip the field like few punters I've ever seen. Add in Mason Crosby, who could have been one of the best kickers in college football history, and your team is suddenly a threat to anybody not in the top 25.
Buffenuf
massive tool
I would guess Devin Ross will be back with Mosely on KOs. Ross looks shifty and has good speed. Mosely's got good hands and can move but not as fast as Ross.
Spruce on punts is for possession, which is what punts have become, with all the weird stuff with rugby-style and hang-time punters: 35 yds. long, but 5.0+ seconds of HT.
Special teams have been emphasized by HCMM, as they never were before. WB&CO treated that, too, like an NFL deal, little practice because everybody on STs in the pros in fighting, scratching and clawing every ST play for that paycheck. Need a different motivation and real coaching for college guys.
I expect the Buffs to be well-drilled at the very least, with a full time ST assistant in Neinas.
Spruce on punts is for possession, which is what punts have become, with all the weird stuff with rugby-style and hang-time punters: 35 yds. long, but 5.0+ seconds of HT.
Special teams have been emphasized by HCMM, as they never were before. WB&CO treated that, too, like an NFL deal, little practice because everybody on STs in the pros in fighting, scratching and clawing every ST play for that paycheck. Need a different motivation and real coaching for college guys.
I expect the Buffs to be well-drilled at the very least, with a full time ST assistant in Neinas.