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WBB Buffs vs ASU

Buffballer

Well-Known Member
ASU will be a huge test today; no doubt the best defensive team the Buffs have faced, It would be incredible to get a win but making it a game and scoring 55+ would be big for confidence and for momentum into next weekend.
 
I think this is a very very good Arizona State team that is 4-2 vs top-50 teams. The Sun Devil's have a Sagarin rating of 88.87 making them the 24th best team in NCAAW and the Buffs aren't in that same class with just an 81.26 rating good for only being the 48th best team. Arizona State is battle tested having played the 8th most difficult schedule of all 349 Div-I teams. The Buffs non-conference schedule was terrible, and even after playing USC, UCLA, and Arizona the Buffs schedule is still only currently good for being the 139th best SOS so far.

Even with the current 3.16 home bonus the Buffs rating bounces from 81.26 to just 84.42. They are still more than 4.0 lower than Arizona State, and realistically don't have the player talent to match up with the Sun Devils. However, as they say, "that's why you play the games." Sometimes you can't measure the fight in the player's heart, and though this Buffs team doesn't have the best Pac-12 players, they have players with grit that are still pretty darn good.

I just think that Arizona State has been playing too many good teams. A team would have to have a 77.52 rating or just be about as good as mid-Major monster CSU to just go 7-7 over the Sun Devil's schedule thus far. Arizona State is 11-3, and the opposite kind of 11-3 as the Buffs. I think JR Payne is definitely going to learn from Linda's mistakes with non-conference scheduling. In future years expect the Buffs to play good/great mid-major teams and tough nationally ranked opponents.

Arizona State played #6 Maryland and lost
Ariz. State played #15 Kentucky and won
Ariz. State beat mid-major power Mid-Tennessee State
Ariz. State beat mid-major power Oral Roberts
Ariz. State lost to #13 Stanford
Ariz. State beat #21 Cal
Ariz. State beat Utah

On paper this game shouldn't even be competitive. However, the game is at altitude and in the winter. The Buffs are not a great team, but just how inconsistent the Buffs are makes them a dangerous team. We've seen the Buffs have a very very high ceiling, but we've also seen the Buffs have a lower floor than anyone expected (first 3Q of Wyoming game).

If we get the Kennedy Leonard that can run the pick & roll with Correal like they did against Kentucky, if we get the Haley Smith that is feeling it for threes and fighting for rebounds, if Zoe Correal can rebound and play effective defense without getting into foul trouble, if Freeman can play fearlessly attacking the rim and managing the pain, if Kennedy Leonard hits 7 threes instead of going 0-for on her attempts, then I think we can win this game. I think any team can win any game. Anything is possible.

Do I think the Buffs win? Nope. Which will make it all that more special when they do.

'Sko Buffs! Home court. Ranked opponent. Make some noise.

The #19th ranked team in NCAAW and a Pac-12 rival is coming to town. I think the Buffs have a couple of special players and a very special coach. Don't expect a win, but don't be surprised if they get one!
 
What would a CU win over ASU would do for CU's Sagarin ratings? Why no love for RPI
 
A lot of how well CU does scoring wise depends on how they are defended. IF ASU plays a zone - regardless of how they play it - CU will most likely have difficulty scoring consistently in the half court. Kennedy won't be able to penetrate and the pick-and-roll won't be available. As mentioned above, another factor will be having a number of hot hands, especially from the perimeter. In the win v Kentucky there were multiple players hitting long range shots. On Friday night after the first few minutes nobody was hitting long range shots.

I agree that this is going to be a very tough game for the Buffs to win, but if they can play with the intensity and confidence they displayed early in the season they will have a shot. Let's hope that Haley, Kennedy, Alexis, etc., are in the groove from beyond the arc.
 
Got to be hot from 3 and rebound in the 2nd half. Keep getting drives to the basket, too. I don't think there's a lot that can be done on defense other than stay between player & basket so ASU has to make contested shots whether it's on the block or a jumper.
 
Got to be hot from 3 and rebound in the 2nd half. Keep getting drives to the basket, too. I don't think there's a lot that can be done on defense other than stay between player & basket so ASU has to make contested shots whether it's on the block or a jumper.

I think we are 3/24 from threes last 24 three point shots. Didn't we hit first three 3's vs UA? If yes then 3 of last 24. That's a disaster considering our insure offense.
 
The women will need to grind in order to win this game...just drive to the glass and make those short shots and play defense. It seems like what we critiqued the men on can be applied to the women as well.
 
Difference in the game? Shooting. Buffs have to hit open looks and score at the rim when they get there. 31% in the first half and it's not all due to ASU defense.
 
That wasn't a good 3Q...outrebounded especially with second chance points despite winning the turnover battle so far.
 
That was not the best quarter of basketball they've played this season. :whistle:
 
Saw the stuff on the ASU WBB coach...second best in the P12 when it comes to wins.

Buffs need to rebound and stiffen up on the interior defense. Love the energy from Leonard and Robinson.

Tough duo of games coming up with the Bay Area schools at home.
 
Post play (lack thereof) is our biggest weakness. Leaves other teams with more players to focus on guards.
 
Let's be honest this is NOT a good Buffs Pac-12 team. They're our team, and we're going to root for them, but this is a rebuilding program. The Buffs are a very good basketball team. They are comfortably inside the bubble of the top-64 NCAAW teams and would certainly be expecting an NCAAW tournament bid at season's end in most conferences. However, the Buffs don't play in most conferences they play in the #1 conference in the country weighted all teams evenly, weighting the middle more than the best/worst teams, and the by the Win50% needed to win conference games. If the Buffs played in any mid-major conference in the country, which is the caliber of our players, we'd be a very very good team. An NCAAW tournament team with the quality to perhaps win a first round game depending on the matchup. This Buffs team could make a run to get deep into the WNIT. The problem is they won't get the chance. The Pac-12 schedule the Buffs play is a schedule of some of the best teams in the country.

Per the Sagarin ratings which are much more predictive than the reputation based AP or USA Today/Coach's polls, as they actually factor in a team's true ability AND strength of schedule as part of the algorithm, not polls, we can see the Buffs are in trouble in the Pac-12. What does this mean? Sagarin ratings reflect how good a team really is in spite of who they play (great teams, poor teams, or good teams). It exactly accounts for the ability of the team and doesn't punish a team for losing to a team that is better, and doesn't particularly reward beating teams that are worse. The problem is that per the objective ratings the following teams are in the Pac-12, ranked as quality in national terms of the 349 NCAA Div-I teams (not quality in terms of the twelve team Pac-12):

7th best team (Washington)
10th best team (Stanford)
12th best team (UCLA)
13th best team (Oregon St.)
24th best team (Arizona St.)
31st best team (California)
32nd best team (Washington St.)
34th best team (Oregon)
36th best team (Utah)
42nd best team (Southern Cal)
122nd best team (Arizona)

This doesn't bode well for Colorado that effectively needs to play two top-10 teams, four top-15 teams, five top-25 teams, eight top-35 teams, and ten top-45 teams in conference play. Why? Because Colorado is only the 47th best team in the country per the Sagarin ratings, and only one team in the Pac-12 is worse than Colorado and we don't play them again after Friday's win. So in all fairness, this is just NOT a good Pac-12 team, but we should never lose sight of the difficulty of the program transition. This may not be a good Pac-12 team. We may not have great Pac-12 players, however we have great basketball players in their own right, and this is a great basketball team in its own right. This should be a NCAAW tournament team well inside the bubble of the top-64 teams, and this team could realistically make a ton of noise in the WNIT. The problem for the Buffs isn't that they aren't great, its that they are great, but that great isn't even good in the Pac-12. Pac-12 good is otherworldly good. Not being ranked in the top-25, but ACTUALLY being good enough by an objective measure (not a poll) to be one of the top-25 teams in the country. Realistically every team in the conference is going to deserve an NCAAW tournament bid, except lowly Arizona. Most teams in the Pac-12 could win just about every mid-major conference.

Our Buffs with their 81.26 rating would be the BEST team in the following conferences (best team & rating in parenthesis):

America East (Maine 70.83)
Atlantic 10 (George Washington 80.49)
Atlantic Sun (Florida Gulf Coast 74.40)
Big Sky (Montana St. 75.27)
Big South (Radford 70.91)
Big West (UC Davis 76.29)
Colonial (James Madison 79.56)
Conference USA (Western Kentucky 79.23)
Ivy (Harvard 75.81)
Metro Atlantic (Quinnipiac 78.86)
Mid-American (Toledo 78.03)
Mid-Eastern (Hampton 70.37)
Missouri Valley (Drake 80.78)
Mountain West (Wyoming 77.55)
NorthEast (St Francis PA 58.46)
Ohio Valley (Belmont 73.76)
Patriot (Bucknell 74.17)
Southern (Chattanooga 74.57)
Southland (Lamar 73.30)
Southwestern (Texas Southern 63.27)
Summit (South Dakota St. 79.71)
Sun Belt (Texas-Arlington 75.02)
WAC (New Mexico St. 68.03)

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the American Athletic conference where UCONN plays, but they would be 4th best after UCONN, South Florida and Temple. Yes Virginia, the Buffs are better than AAC teams Tulane, SMU (which we already know), UCF, East Carolina, Tulsa, Cincinnati, Memphis and Houston.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the ACC where Notre Dame plays, but they would be 10th best after Notre Dame, Florida State, Duke, Louisville, Miami, NC State, Virginia Tech, Syracuse, and Virginia. That's right the Buffs are better than ACC teams Georgia Tech, North Carolina, Wake Forest, Clemson, Pittsburgh, and Boston College.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the Big-12 where Baylor plays, but they would be the 8th best team after Baylor, Texas, Kansas St., West Virginia, Oklahoma St., Oklahoma and Texas Tech. The Buffs are better than Big-12 teams Iowa St., TCU and Kansas.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the Big East where DePaul plays, but they would be the 2nd best team after DePaul. The Buffs are better than every other Big-East team: Marquette, Creighton, St. John's, Georgetown, Villanova, Xavier, Providence, Seton Hall and Butler.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the Big-10 where Maryland plays, but they would be the 7th best team after Maryland, Michigan, Ohio St., Indiana, Iowa, and Northwestern. The Buffs are better than Big-10 teams Michigan St., Minnesota, Purdue, Penn St., Nebraska, Illinois, Rutgers and Wisconsin.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the Horizon where Green Bay plays, but they would be the 2nd best team after Green Bay. The Buffs are better than every other Horizon school: Milwaukee, Oakland, Detroit, Wright St., Cleveland St., Youngstown St., Northern Kentucky, Illinois-Chicago, and Valparaiso.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the SEC where South Carolina plays, but they would be the 10th best team after South Carolina, Miss St., Tennessee, Kentucky, LSU, Auburn, Florida, and Mississippi. The Buffs are better than SEC schools Alabama, Missouri, Arkansas, Vanderbilt, and Georgia.

Colorado wouldn't be the best team in the WCC where Gonzaga plays, but they would be the 2nd best team in the after Gonzaga. The Buffs are better than every other WCC school: BYU, St. Mary's, Santa Clara, Pacific, San Francisco, San Diego, Loyola Marymount, Pepperdine and Portland.

So let's acknowledge that while are Buffs are a gosh awful Pac-12 team with just 3 conference wins in the past two seasons, and realistically don't have competitive Pac-12 players, this is still a great basketball team. The problem is it plays in an even better conference. To compete in the Pac-12 players need to play defense, be able to pass to create for teammates and drive off the dribble, be able to shoot effectively for threes, mid-range and finish at the rim, and be able to rebound. The Buffs have players that can do some of those things and many of those things. There is not a single player on this Buffs squad that can do all of those things at the Pac-12 level, and that isn't even debatable the Buffs defense and rebounding have been that atrocious.

The Buffs have great scorers, good rebounders, good ball handlers, great three point shooters, good finishers, and good defenders. The problem is they all have different last names. This Arizona State loss was tough. The Buffs are doing their best. JR Payne is trying to fix what is fixable, but at the end of the day the Buffs just have a complete talent deficit and you can't compete in the Pac-12 with great players. The Buffs have great players, which could dominate most conferences and almost every mid-major conference. The problem is that in the Pac-12 an NCAAW team needs truly elite players and that the Buffs just don't have at any position. There is not a single Buff on this team that has ever been the Pac-12 Player of the Week. The Pac-12 is full of truly phenomenal elite players, it truly is the Conference of Champions. The Buffs could play in most conferences and finish with an undefeated record going into the NCAAW tournament most seasons. As it is, the Buffs might not win but one single conference game all season. Does that mean they aren't a good team? No it does not. It means they are a terrible Pac-12 team, but still a truly great team in the NCAAW context. The Buffs are one of the top-50 teams in the nation. Let's not forget that. They don't hand out participation ribbons in the Pac-12, that advances a team to the postseason.
 
The only thing on my mind, as I watched this game today, was........I wonder how we stack up in the Horizon after this?????? Damn, and the WCC or the MVC!!!!!! Thank the good Lord, I now have my answer.
Disclaimer: I am in no way related to Kennedy Leonard
 
The general consensus of posters seems to be that the Buffs are lacking skill at the 4 and particularly 5 spots. I have agreed with this. But it's more that that right now. Tonight they got a number of good looks at the basket and simply didn't couldn't finish. This isn't to say they would have won the game, but it would have been much closer. Additionally, little things like holding onto the ball when rebounding and cutting down on silly turnovers will increase the Buffs' chances.

After watching the two games this weekend my thought is that CU will be doing well to win two to three more games during this conference season. Too bad Arizona isn't on the schedule again.

I'm not related to Kennedy either, but boy she is one heck of a player. She has the offensive skills to start on any CU team, ever. I state this knowing that she isn't consistent with her perimeter jumper.
 
The only thing on my mind, as I watched this game today, was........I wonder how we stack up in the Horizon after this?????? Damn, and the WCC or the MVC!!!!!! Thank the good Lord, I now have my answer.
Disclaimer: I am in no way related to Kennedy Leonard

Now that is funny. I thought it was funny he just had to throw in there that we are not elite AT ANY POSITION. He can't help himself. I guess he is blocked from twitter accounts of players now so he continues on here.
 
The general consensus of posters seems to be that the Buffs are lacking skill at the 4 and particularly 5 spots. I have agreed with this. But it's more that that right now. Tonight they got a number of good looks at the basket and simply didn't couldn't finish. This isn't to say they would have won the game, but it would have been much closer. Additionally, little things like holding onto the ball when rebounding and cutting down on silly turnovers will increase the Buffs' chances.

After watching the two games this weekend my thought is that CU will be doing well to win two to three more games during this conference season. Too bad Arizona isn't on the schedule again.

I'm not related to Kennedy either, but boy she is one heck of a player. She has the offensive skills to start on any CU team, ever. I state this knowing that she isn't consistent with her perimeter jumper.

She definitely needs to improve her three pointer and not force them from NBA range. Her and smith are the most consistent on the team. Robinson needs to start playing better. Those three should be doing the bulk of the scoring during the whole game. I don't have much hope for the inside players. We signed three inside players for 2017 IMO. They should be able to help in 2018-19 season when Robinson and Leonard are SRs. Hopefully Jones, Burich, Ellis, Freeman and cayla-do get better as well by then too. I see us improving each year.
 
Now that is funny. I thought it was funny he just had to throw in there that we are not elite AT ANY POSITION. He can't help himself. I guess he is blocked from twitter accounts of players now so he continues on here.

Not surprised, his agenda was the same last year. Makes you wonder why someone with that level of animosity towards 19 and 20 year old players and this program would join its "fan" board. Glad I've blocked him. Not related to KL (like the other 30 of you).
 
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No big surprise with the outcome tonight. I think if anything, considering the poor shooting, getting killed on the boards and some questionable officiating the outcome was better then expected. At the end of the day we don't have the depth or breadth of talent to go toe to toe with ASU for 40 minutes. Good news is we competed which we did not do last year against ASU. 6 PAC 12 teams at 1-3, a win or two next weekend would be huge.
 
The general consensus of posters seems to be that the Buffs are lacking skill at the 4 and particularly 5 spots. I have agreed with this. But it's more that that right now. Tonight they got a number of good looks at the basket and simply didn't couldn't finish. This isn't to say they would have won the game, but it would have been much closer. Additionally, little things like holding onto the ball when rebounding and cutting down on silly turnovers will increase the Buffs' chances.

After watching the two games this weekend my thought is that CU will be doing well to win two to three more games during this conference season. Too bad Arizona isn't on the schedule again.

I'm not related to Kennedy either, but boy she is one heck of a player. She has the offensive skills to start on any CU team, ever. I state this knowing that she isn't consistent with her perimeter jumper.

No she's not, but she's had a couple of games where she's been on. Let's not forget how fun it was when she hit 7 threes in a game vs CSU not too long ago this season.

KL game log this season (3 pointers: Made-Attempts):
4-8
1-3
1-10
2-8
3-7
1-6
1-5
1-5
7-11
1-4
2-7
0-0
0-8
0-5
2-8

Since she dropped those 7 threes on Colorado State she's been just 5-32 since, which is frustrating as there are good 3-point shooters on this team. She's only shooting .274 on 3s for the season. The Buffs as a team shoot .331 for 3s on the season.

In Pac-12 play she has 21 Assists and 16 Turnovers.

She's an elite scorer, no doubt about it. However, Colorado has had some great scoring guards.

Shelly Sheetz finished with 1775 points on winning teams. NCAA appearances.
Chucky Jeffrey finished with 1644 points on winning teams. NCAA appearance, WNIT Qtr finals multiple times.

I think Kennedy Leonard could start on most Colorado teams, but we've had too much tradition and too many great players on winning teams for me to agree that a player with 3 conference wins in two seasons of Div-I play could start on any CU team ever. She doesn't start on Sheetz's or Chucky's teams. Both were significantly better defenders and great leaders, and elevated their teammates around them. Sheetz was a great distributor and a much much better three point shooter (.381 career). Chucky was brilliant at running the transition game and the best rebounding guard we'll ever see in our lifetime, and was a great scorer in her own right. Leonard also scored a lot of her points during irrelevant minutes of games that were long since over. Chucky and Sheetz did it when it mattered in winning efforts, not in garbage time. I don't sit down either Sheetz or Chucky to start Leonard on those CU teams, and KL doesn't have the type of game to be effective as an off guard. She needs the ball to be effective. She doesn't have the height or the perimeter defense or athleticism to guard off guards, combo guards or true twos. I wouldn't take the ball out of Shelly or Chucky's hands, but that's just me.

I'd love to see KL with some of the other great Colorado players around her. I think we'd see a whole other level of play from her if she had better players around her, however, her attempts and scoring would go down as well. Its an either/or thing. I think Leonard is like the NCAAW version of AI without the defense. She's that special. One of the best scoring players you'll ever see just like AI, worth the price of the ticket, but like AI not always winning basketball. However, when she's on, she's on, as a scorer. I don't think she'll ever get Lisa Van Goor's single season scoring record at 678 points. However, I truly believe KL will have the #1 single season scoring average, maybe even this season. She's dominating FG attempts late in games and getting to the line as well.

Its an academic debate, who is better AI or Chauncey Billiups. Most would say AI. I'd say championships matter, being a leader on a championship team matters, and I'd say scoring averages on teams that don't win anything don't matter. That's just me. I'll tell you what though, AI sold a lot more tickets and merchandise than Chauncey ever did.

I'll say this. I don't know how painful this season would actually be if KL wasn't on this roster. KL is a good enough player to single handily drag just about any program in ANY conference from irrelevance to an NCAAW tournament appearance, just not the Pac-12 conference. It isn't her fault, but she doesn't have the height, the athleticism or the frame to handle the physicality of playing teams like ASU or other Pac-12 opponents.

It isn't a fair observation of a player to say "they need to grow taller." That's not something they can control. The modern game is different than the era Sheetz played in though. Sheetz was a great player, but she wasn't matching up against the type of athletes that Leonard has to face. I think its fair to say that, for sure. Chucky was a battler, and a strong and tough player that played beyond her size. We've seen her handle the physicality of the Pac-12 opponents and win many of those match ups.

If you watch or read JR Payne after the game, she essentially says she doesn't have Pac-12 height or talent. Most of the quotes from the coach or players acknowledges they just don't the size or athleticism to match up with Pac-12 players they are seeing.

http://www.cubuffs.com/news/2017/1/...-devils-prove-too-much-for-erratic-buffs.aspx

To compete in the Pac-12 you need tall and athletic basketball players. CU doesn't have those players, plain and simple. For right now. This program is moving in the right direction. This program is getting better. The culture is changing. The athletes are going to come. CU has too great of a tradition, is too attractive of a school, and JR Payne is too good of a coach.

That's my entire frustration. The narrative of every CU game is that the Buffs don't have the players they need to compete in the Pac-12. Its the opposite reality from the false narrative that the Buffs have any elite Pac-12 players. Which is not to say the Buffs don't have great basketball players. Every basketball player on this Buffs roster is a good basketball player or she wouldn't be here.

This is a team that would go to the NCAA tournament in just about any conference. However, they probably won't win barely any games in the Pac-12, this conference is THAT good. There is no better conference in all of NCAAW no matter how you figure it. These are some of the best women's basketball players on the planet. This is not NCAAW, this is the Pac-12. The Buffs are a top-50 NCAAW program right now, and that's good enough to just be one of the doormats of the Pac-12.
 
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No she's not, but she's had a couple of games where she's been on. Let's not forget how fun it was when she hit 7 threes in a game vs CSU not too long ago this season.

KL game log this season (3 pointers: Made-Attempts):
4-8
1-3
1-10
2-8
3-7
1-6
1-5
1-5
7-11
1-4
2-7
0-0
0-8
0-5
2-8

Since she dropped those 7 threes on Colorado State she's been just 5-32 since, which is frustrating as there are good 3-point shooters on this team. She's only shooting .274 on 3s for the season. The Buffs as a team shoot .331 for 3s on the season.

In Pac-12 play she has 21 Assists and 16 Turnovers.

She's an elite scorer, no doubt about it. However, Colorado has had some great scoring guards.

Shelly Sheetz finished with 1775 points on winning teams. NCAA appearances.
Chucky Jeffrey finished with 1644 points on winning teams. NCAA appearance, WNIT Qtr finals multiple times.

I think Kennedy Leonard could start on most Colorado teams, but we've had too much tradition and too many great players on winning teams for me to agree that a player with 3 conference wins in two seasons of Div-I play could start on any CU team ever. She doesn't start on Sheetz's or Chucky's teams. Both were significantly better defenders and great leaders, and elevated their teammates around them. Sheetz was a great distributor and a much much better three point shooter (.381 career). Chucky was brilliant at running the transition game and the best rebounding guard we'll ever see in our lifetime, and was a great scorer in her own right. Leonard also scored a lot of her points during irrelevant minutes of games that were long since over. Chucky and Sheetz did it when it mattered in winning efforts, not in garbage time. I don't sit down either Sheetz or Chucky to start Leonard on those CU teams, and KL doesn't have the type of game to be effective as an off guard. She needs the ball to be effective. She doesn't have the height or the perimeter defense or athleticism to guard off guards, combo guards or true twos. I wouldn't take the ball out of Shelly or Chucky's hands, but that's just me.

I'd love to see KL with some of the other great Colorado players around her. I think we'd see a whole other level of play from her if she had better players around her, however, her attempts and scoring would go down as well. Its an either/or thing. I think Leonard is like the NCAAW version of AI without the defense. She's that special. One of the best scoring players you'll ever see just like AI, worth the price of the ticket, but like AI not always winning basketball. However, when she's on, she's on, as a scorer. I don't think she'll ever get Lisa Van Goor's single season scoring record at 678 points. However, I truly believe KL will have the #1 single season scoring average, maybe even this season. She's dominating FG attempts late in games and getting to the line as well.

Its an academic debate, who is better AI or Chauncey Billiups. Most would say AI. I'd say championships matter, being a leader on a championship team matters, and I'd say scoring averages on teams that don't win anything don't matter. That's just me. I'll tell you what though, AI sold a lot more tickets and merchandise than Chauncey ever did.

I'll say this. I don't know how painful this season would actually be if KL wasn't on this roster. KL is a good enough player to single handily drag just about any program in ANY conference from irrelevance to an NCAAW tournament appearance, just not the Pac-12 conference. It isn't her fault, but she doesn't have the height, the athleticism or the frame to handle the physicality of playing teams like ASU or other Pac-12 opponents.

It isn't a fair observation of a player to say "they need to grow taller." That's not something they can control. The modern game is different than the era Sheetz played in though. Sheetz was a great player, but she wasn't matching up against the type of athletes that Leonard has to face. I think its fair to say that, for sure. Chucky was a battler, and a strong and tough player that played beyond her size. We've seen her handle the physicality of the Pac-12 opponents and win many of those match ups.

If you watch or read JR Payne after the game, she essentially says she doesn't have Pac-12 height or talent. Most of the quotes from the coach or players acknowledges they just don't the size or athleticism to match up with Pac-12 players they are seeing.

http://www.cubuffs.com/news/2017/1/...-devils-prove-too-much-for-erratic-buffs.aspx

To compete in the Pac-12 you need tall and athletic basketball players. CU doesn't have those players, plain and simple. For right now. This program is moving in the right direction. This program is getting better. The culture is changing. The athletes are going to come. CU has too great of a tradition, is too attractive of a school, and JR Payne is too good of a coach.

That's my entire frustration. The narrative of every CU game is that the Buffs don't have the players they need to compete in the Pac-12. Its the opposite reality from the false narrative that the Buffs have any elite Pac-12 players. Which is not to say the Buffs don't have great basketball players. Every basketball player on this Buffs roster is a good basketball player or she wouldn't be here.

This is a team that would go to the NCAA tournament in just about any conference. However, they probably won't win barely any games in the Pac-12, this conference is THAT good. There is no better conference in all of NCAAW no matter how you figure it. These are some of the best women's basketball players on the planet. This is not NCAAW, this is the Pac-12. The Buffs are a top-50 NCAAW program right now, and that's good enough to just be one of the doormats of the Pac-12.

I would disagree on KL's athleticism but we may disagree on what athleticism is. Her lateral quickness on going around players and making some of the crazy layups around or over people shows me she has the athleticism. I mean you're comparing her to AI and saying lack of athleticism? She doesn't have the height, frame or strength though. She would have more assists and less turnovers on a team with better scorers around her but less points. Thank God she didn't transfer or JR might not have been able to attract any top recruits winning 5-6 OOC games and zero PAC 12 games.

Disagree also that she would get this team to the tournament in other big conferences. PAC 12 is clearly the best but this team is weaker than most want to believe. SEC is a very athletic and physical conference but less good shooting. The top half of that league would be trouble for this team. ACC is second only to the PAC 12. No way they get in playing in that league. Big 10 and 12 maybe.
 
We knew after Swan graduated, this team did not have a post player. Previous coach did not have one recruited to arrive on campus this season so even without the coaching change, that would still be an issue.

JR had team run the mile in the pre-season in a set amount of time. They had never been asked to do that before. Not all made time in the first shot, but, eventually every single player made time. For some of the kids, they had to work hard to accomplish that.

Best players on team right now are Leonard and Smith, but two players do not a team make. I see Freeman improving. I see Quaylo-Do improving. I know Beard-Fails has been through the concussion protocol and I heard this weekend she has a hip injury. Zoe sometimes does some good things. I know players get banged up during the season and play as best they can. We do have one or two players who will not see playing time in JR's system because they don't fit. Will only play in blowouts.

Did see a photo of Kennedy with ice on her knee on the bench towards end of game.
 
Pac 12 is the premier women's basketball conference in the country this season. Many upsets this weekend. Just none by CU.

JR is doing her best with the team she was handed. With the exception of Jones, this is the team she was handed. She isn't afraid to go after name recruits and she will land them. Team will improve every season under JR. Friend of mine said she overheard Coach Towns after one of the early games saying he wished they had 3 or 4 more months t work with them before the season had started. They didn't. It is now their team, but most of the players on the team would not be at CU with JR as a coach.

I felt many years Lappe settled on players. It's showing now, bit time.
 
We knew after Swan graduated, this team did not have a post player. Previous coach did not have one recruited to arrive on campus this season so even without the coaching change, that would still be an issue.

JR had team run the mile in the pre-season in a set amount of time. They had never been asked to do that before. Not all made time in the first shot, but, eventually every single player made time. For some of the kids, they had to work hard to accomplish that.

Best players on team right now are Leonard and Smith, but two players do not a team make. I see Freeman improving. I see Quaylo-Do improving. I know Beard-Fails has been through the concussion protocol and I heard this weekend she has a hip injury. Zoe sometimes does some good things. I know players get banged up during the season and play as best they can. We do have one or two players who will not see playing time in JR's system because they don't fit. Will only play in blowouts.

Did see a photo of Kennedy with ice on her knee on the bench towards end of game.

I don't see the improvement by freeman except rebounds. We need her to score off the bench. She's 9/29 FGs in PAC 12 play so far. Caylao-Do definitely playing with more confidence.
 
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JR is doing her best with the team she was handed. With the exception of Jones, this is the team she was handed. She isn't afraid to go after name recruits and she will land them. Team will improve every season under JR. ........
Lappe also went after name recruits but she didn't land any of them.

For 2017, without the lead time normally needed for recruiting top players, JR and staff retained the commit from unranked forward Annika Jank, obtained a commit from F/G Aubrey Knight (#73 ESPN, #131 ProspectsNation) and a commit from unranked post Mya Hollingshed. A decent class but not enough to compete in the PAC 12 where 5 schools have recruiting classes for 2017 ranked in the top 15 by ESPN. But still a pretty good start.

So far, for 2018, JR has a commit from Mykasa Robinson, a top 20 player in both ESPN and ProspectsNation rankings. But how much of that is because her sister is here? I hope we do see JR continuing to land the better recruits.
 
Lappe also went after name recruits but she didn't land any of them.

For 2017, without the lead time normally needed for recruiting top players, JR and staff retained the commit from unranked forward Annika Jank, obtained a commit from F/G Aubrey Knight (#73 ESPN, #131 ProspectsNation) and a commit from unranked post Mya Hollingshed. A decent class but not enough to compete in the PAC 12 where 5 schools have recruiting classes for 2017 ranked in the top 15 by ESPN. But still a pretty good start.

So far, for 2018, JR has a commit from Mykasa Robinson, a top 20 player in both ESPN and ProspectsNation rankings. But how much of that is because her sister is here? I hope we do see JR continuing to land the better recruits.

I think the sister got the foot in the door but they will only be together for one year. I think 2018 will be a top 15 class.
 
I think the sister got the foot in the door but they will only be together for one year. I think 2018 will be a top 15 class.
Very early for 2018 class rankings but currently Prospect Nation has our '18 class ranked #10. Also, keep in mind that any potential JoCo or graduate transfers for next year are not known at this point.
 
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