AllBuffs | Unofficial fan site for the University of Colorado at Boulder Athletics programs
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
Prime Time. Prime Time. Its a new era for Colorado football. Consider signing up for a club membership! For $20/year, you can get access to all the special features at Allbuffs, including club member only forums, dark mode, avatars and best of all no ads ! But seriously, please sign up so that we can pay the bills. No one earns money here, and we can use your $20 to keep this hellhole running. You can sign up for a club membership by navigating to your account in the upper right and clicking on "Account Upgrades". Make it happen!
What Are Your Expectations For CU Men's Hoops
- Thread starter Goose
- Start date
Expect, desire, vs desire within reason.
I want to be sweet 16 most years. That's probably not reasonable.
I do think "Iowa" is a reasonable desire. I think CU could very reasonably do that; I don't think they (admin, school, AD, etc) will ever do that.
I expect "Xavier." CU should do that, and if they don't, they are failing to meet expectations.
I want to be sweet 16 most years. That's probably not reasonable.
I do think "Iowa" is a reasonable desire. I think CU could very reasonably do that; I don't think they (admin, school, AD, etc) will ever do that.
I expect "Xavier." CU should do that, and if they don't, they are failing to meet expectations.
Progress/something to watch is what drives me to enjoy watching CU basketball, and what I would classify as a expectation. This would result in a NCAA team 25-50% of the time.
Things like seeing Dak's progression throughout the year and seeing the team get better throughout the year are great. Think about the '09-10 (?) year, we didn't make the tournament with Bz, but you saw the team go right up till the end of the season with something to play for, you saw new talent maturing, it was exciting.
I know most of this is an old man yelling at the sky, and not a Tad/CU issue, more of a college sports issue, but that is what I struggle with the most.
That said, winning is also fun
Things like seeing Dak's progression throughout the year and seeing the team get better throughout the year are great. Think about the '09-10 (?) year, we didn't make the tournament with Bz, but you saw the team go right up till the end of the season with something to play for, you saw new talent maturing, it was exciting.
I know most of this is an old man yelling at the sky, and not a Tad/CU issue, more of a college sports issue, but that is what I struggle with the most.
That said, winning is also fun
My expectation is that we are competing for, if not making the Dance, 2 years out of 4.
I will accept 1 out of 4, but complain about it.
I will accept 1 out of 4, but complain about it.
Same. I'd also like our rebuilding years to be like KJ's frosh year or McKinley's frosh year.
I'm the same as both of you.
But this question made me wonder: how does Iowa State do it? Ames is smaller than Boulder, Iowa is a smaller state than Colorado, they're pretty much at least as far from other major metros, and they have in-state P4 competition for recruits. Historically, up until the last 40 years or so, CU had been the more successful basketball program, and even when ISU had more success from ~1984-2010 or so, they were more like making the tournament 2 out of 4 years rather than some juggernaut.
And yet, in the last 15 years, each of 3 different HCs have won a conference championship, and they've made the S16 more times (4, with each coach making it at least once) than CU has since the ****ing Kennedy assassination (0 times).
Is ISU just that much more committed institutionally than CU? I know CU has very little institutional support, but it looks like over the last year spending on both programs was roughly the same (CU spent $7.9M, ISU spent $8.4M)
Yes.
There's a reason, after all, that Tad singled out their AD for props earlier this season.
I would love a bubble team most years with some being a no question they are in the dance. But a bubble team that if they got hot with the right mix could get to the second weekend. That means they are NIT other years and that is ok. This year is a disappointment and will happen from time to time. No excuses but is is what it is. We were never a consistent bubble team unless you go way back before most of the 35 year olds were born. Even then, it was up and down
I'm learning right now that I can't handle losing seasons. I won't trade them for a deeper occasional tourney run.
So, my expectations (what would keep me highly engaged as a fan and not thinking about a coaching change):
I. No losing seasons.
2. Dance at least 50% of years.
3. Give me at least 1 2nd weekend run or conference tourney title per decade.
So, my expectations (what would keep me highly engaged as a fan and not thinking about a coaching change):
I. No losing seasons.
2. Dance at least 50% of years.
3. Give me at least 1 2nd weekend run or conference tourney title per decade.
Ok- I’m a complete ignorant here, but what does ISU do differently? They spend about the same. I didn’t see what tad said.
Bubble team. That said, we're hell and gone from that level at this point. There is ZERO EXCUSE for Tad's lack of effort this offseason to build off his most successful season/team. NONE. At this point I think it's safe to say we probably win one more game this season. And based on Tad's attitude/effort re: NIL and the portal, I would expect at least 3 players to bolt in the offseason (Dak, Diop, Rancik, Smith). I also wouldn't expect any legit players to be knocking down the door to transfer to the Big12 doormat. Lastly, I'm pretty sure we missed on Anderson, Kossaras and Crawford. "Harry Caray" is a nice surprise, though!
Sidenote: Looking back, it seems that players like Hadley, Lampkin and O'Brien saw the writing on the wall - a terrible team and little money if they stuck around.
Sidenote: Looking back, it seems that players like Hadley, Lampkin and O'Brien saw the writing on the wall - a terrible team and little money if they stuck around.
They take care of their arena. They emphasize basketball for their fanbase, not just tolerate it. They support beyond just hiring some coaches and a DJ. My assumption is they don't stick the team on a commercial flight to Seattle or Orlando, as I've seen our team on in recent seasons.
It does help that their larger fanbase cares about the sport and that program beyond if they can write their name on a bracket in March or not. Nobody can change that.
Tad's comments from back at the end of non-conference play -- I've never heard him highlight another AD like that before. He was on a roll, though, and had been musing earlier on how we stack up in this new league:
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
They have history for sure-but they had a fairly ugly year under Steve Prohm not too long ago. Other thing with ISU is the way they play defense. I can't remember the last time I saw a team play as hard as they do on that side of the ball. That takes recruiting a different kind of kid in this era
Iowa State has one of the most loyal fan bases in the country in athletics. I knew that was true for football, men's and women's basketball. I was surprised when CU volleyball played in Minneapolis and the Iowa State team was also there. They had two busloads of fans.
They sell out for the 3 big sports. For women's basketball, they rank in the top 10 nationally for over 25 years.
The men's team has drawn from the time I was a kid. Maury John, Johnny Orr, etc. They drew big time years ago.
When they hired Fennelly, they hired someone to increase attendance. WBB was lucky if they got 500 people in there. Now they average about 10,000 per game.
Their fans are not fickle. Bowls like them for football because they know they will turn out and they will drink.
3 nephews are graduates. Middle nephew lives in Des Moines and has football season tickets and goes to the bowl game every year.
The students are loyal too. Iowa State played Kansas before school was back in session. Students had tents set up 3 days before the game because the student section is GA.
They know how to market. CU has never cared enough about basketball to market it.
They sell out for the 3 big sports. For women's basketball, they rank in the top 10 nationally for over 25 years.
The men's team has drawn from the time I was a kid. Maury John, Johnny Orr, etc. They drew big time years ago.
When they hired Fennelly, they hired someone to increase attendance. WBB was lucky if they got 500 people in there. Now they average about 10,000 per game.
Their fans are not fickle. Bowls like them for football because they know they will turn out and they will drink.
3 nephews are graduates. Middle nephew lives in Des Moines and has football season tickets and goes to the bowl game every year.
The students are loyal too. Iowa State played Kansas before school was back in session. Students had tents set up 3 days before the game because the student section is GA.
They know how to market. CU has never cared enough about basketball to market it.
I believe there is also an element of "WTH else are you going to do in Ames, IA besides support the local teams?!?"
We see this with almost every rural major university.
We see this with almost every rural major university.
- large college w/ corresponding large alumni base
- far far away from any pro teams
- great academics which leads to alumns being proud of their ISU degrees, and by extension, proud when the team does well
I got an email this morning that CU is now selling gameday experiences for MBB & WBB like they did for FB. Things like being part of the T-shirt toss, being in the video control room, photos on the court, etc. Glad to see it. Frustrating that it wasn't implemented at the start of the season, though.
GRM
I'm a ****ty troll
The main difference I see with Iowa St. v. CU is that ISU has broke the glass ceiling; and CU has not. CU is an occasional bubble team.
Since 2015, ISU won the B-12 conference tournament 5 times. Since 2000, they have won 15 games in the NCAA tourney, and they beat some big name teams--North Carolina, UCLA, UCONN, LSU, ND, Wisco... They were 1 and done 4 times. When ISU's goes to the NCAA tourney this century, they have been a 2-3 seed 5 times, and better than a 6 seed, 9 times. Although they have not won the NCAA or made a final 4, I feel ISU is an estabished hoops power--4 sweet 16s and one elite 8. There sustained success teamwise is why their fanbase is so active. ISU fans always feel that they have a great shot to win in any given game. When they have a good season, it is a great team.
Since, I graduated in 93', CU won 1 conference tourney once in our 1st year in the PAC. CU is 4-7 in the NCAAs since 2000 (one win was the play-in game last year). 1 and done 4 times in 7 appearances. We have not made the Sweet 16 since 1969. CU's best modern NCAA seed was a 5 in 2021, with the six other teams seeded 8-11 seeds--clearly bubble teams. Also, when we lose at the NCAA tourney, we are generally taken to the woodshed, Marquette was a pleasent exception last year. IMO, CU got it's best NCAA win in the modern era over #8 Indiana with Chauncey, however, that was the 1st time CU got back to the NCAA tourney in 28 years. Last year we did beat a 7 seeded Florida to make the Sweet 16. Compared to ISU, when CU has a great season, they are a bubble team.
In terms of successful CU seasons, CU's success is generally driven on 1-2 star players going off and really carrying them. Last year was great for CU with 3 guys going in the draft, but that team was really only 6 guys deep for the 2nd half of the season. I thought it was one of Tad's best coaching seasons. Contrast that with ISU's success, they have a star player or two, however always a much better supporting cast and they just play better team basketball. Hence, the higher seeded teams.
@Da Lama summed up my expectations for this year. A grim rebuild and then departures, so probably another rebuild.
My expectations going forward is trying to be in the Top 2/3 of the Big 12, with occassional NCAA bubble bids in sporadic special seasons. For the near term, I think that CU will have a rough adjustment in the B12. Much of the future depends on what Tad does. Tad is a known quantity and has had the best success for CU since the 1960s. I can CU see maybe being competitive in the B12 with Tad, however not breaking the glass ceiling--i.e--winning the B12 regular season, winning the conference tounrney, or being a Top-15 team during a given season. I do not see a sustained run of great seasons under Tad. If Chauncey is interested, CU may consider that.
Since 2015, ISU won the B-12 conference tournament 5 times. Since 2000, they have won 15 games in the NCAA tourney, and they beat some big name teams--North Carolina, UCLA, UCONN, LSU, ND, Wisco... They were 1 and done 4 times. When ISU's goes to the NCAA tourney this century, they have been a 2-3 seed 5 times, and better than a 6 seed, 9 times. Although they have not won the NCAA or made a final 4, I feel ISU is an estabished hoops power--4 sweet 16s and one elite 8. There sustained success teamwise is why their fanbase is so active. ISU fans always feel that they have a great shot to win in any given game. When they have a good season, it is a great team.
Since, I graduated in 93', CU won 1 conference tourney once in our 1st year in the PAC. CU is 4-7 in the NCAAs since 2000 (one win was the play-in game last year). 1 and done 4 times in 7 appearances. We have not made the Sweet 16 since 1969. CU's best modern NCAA seed was a 5 in 2021, with the six other teams seeded 8-11 seeds--clearly bubble teams. Also, when we lose at the NCAA tourney, we are generally taken to the woodshed, Marquette was a pleasent exception last year. IMO, CU got it's best NCAA win in the modern era over #8 Indiana with Chauncey, however, that was the 1st time CU got back to the NCAA tourney in 28 years. Last year we did beat a 7 seeded Florida to make the Sweet 16. Compared to ISU, when CU has a great season, they are a bubble team.
In terms of successful CU seasons, CU's success is generally driven on 1-2 star players going off and really carrying them. Last year was great for CU with 3 guys going in the draft, but that team was really only 6 guys deep for the 2nd half of the season. I thought it was one of Tad's best coaching seasons. Contrast that with ISU's success, they have a star player or two, however always a much better supporting cast and they just play better team basketball. Hence, the higher seeded teams.
@Da Lama summed up my expectations for this year. A grim rebuild and then departures, so probably another rebuild.
My expectations going forward is trying to be in the Top 2/3 of the Big 12, with occassional NCAA bubble bids in sporadic special seasons. For the near term, I think that CU will have a rough adjustment in the B12. Much of the future depends on what Tad does. Tad is a known quantity and has had the best success for CU since the 1960s. I can CU see maybe being competitive in the B12 with Tad, however not breaking the glass ceiling--i.e--winning the B12 regular season, winning the conference tounrney, or being a Top-15 team during a given season. I do not see a sustained run of great seasons under Tad. If Chauncey is interested, CU may consider that.
I voted the Iowa option. I'm also a hopeless homer so there's that.
On the attendance discussion, crowd sizes are at least decent during seasons when the Buffs are just a middling NIT team. Bubble team or better those numbers go up. I've always felt the fan base does care and wants to see the program be successful, but we're not stupid. We as a whole see the commitment to the program and act accordingly.
On the attendance discussion, crowd sizes are at least decent during seasons when the Buffs are just a middling NIT team. Bubble team or better those numbers go up. I've always felt the fan base does care and wants to see the program be successful, but we're not stupid. We as a whole see the commitment to the program and act accordingly.