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2015 Coaching Carousel

Steve Marshall is the new Oline coach for the Jets. As much as a disaster as Embree's tenure was, his staff went on to prove that a CU job isn't really a dead end. I actually don't think there are many, if any dead end assistant jobs in the B5. Good coaches have good connections and will land on their feet.

Of course CU won't beat Michigan for Durkin, but I highly doubt a coach would turn down a promotion because of our recent history. Coaches are transients who will be in a different job in a few years regardless. Take a look at Robert Prince, Hawk's last WR coach who came in for the lame duck year. He went on to become the OC for Boise before moving to his current role as WR coach of the Lions. Those are hardly demotions after he joined what was obviously a sinking ship.

I'm a big MM believer, but this search and the latest recruiting battles have finally left me with some questions about his competency. Hopefully I'm just being overly dramatic after checking allbuffs religiously the last month to no avail.
 
nolabuff said:
Steve Marshall is the new Oline coach for the Jets. As much as a disaster as Embree's tenure was, his staff went on to prove that a CU job isn't really a dead end. I actually don't think there are many, if any dead end assistant jobs in the B5. Good coaches have good connections and will land on their feet.

Of course CU won't beat Michigan for Durkin, but I highly doubt a coach would turn down a promotion because of our recent history. Coaches are transients who will be in a different job in a few years regardless. Take a look at Robert Prince, Hawk's last WR coach who came in for the lame duck year. He went on to become the OC for Boise before moving to his current role as WR coach of the Lions. Those are hardly demotions after he joined what was obviously a sinking ship.

I'm a big MM believer, but this search and the latest recruiting battles have finally left me with some questions about his competency. Hopefully I'm just being overly dramatic after checking allbuffs religiously the last month to no avail.
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Which of his guys are now coordinators?

Which of his guys are now HCs somewhere?

Bonus points if you can tell us if they ever will be and when?
 
nolabuff said:
Steve Marshall is the new Oline coach for the Jets. As much as a disaster as Embree's tenure was, his staff went on to prove that a CU job isn't really a dead end. I actually don't think there are many, if any dead end assistant jobs in the B5. Good coaches have good connections and will land on their feet.

Of course CU won't beat Michigan for Durkin, but I highly doubt a coach would turn down a promotion because of our recent history. Coaches are transients who will be in a different job in a few years regardless. Take a look at Robert Prince, Hawk's last WR coach who came in for the lame duck year. He went on to become the OC for Boise before moving to his current role as WR coach of the Lions. Those are hardly demotions after he joined what was obviously a sinking ship.

I'm a big MM believer, but this search and the latest recruiting battles have finally left me with some questions about his competency. Hopefully I'm just being overly dramatic after checking allbuffs religiously the last month to no avail.
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Assistant coaches have never had time finding jobs. Even Embree and Bieniemy and Brown were able to find assistant coaching jobs. Kent Baer has been one of the worst defensive coordinators in college football history, at multiple BCS level jobs - he found another job in a week.

The "dead end" comment goes with CU's head coaching job. Other than Neuheisel, who left of his own accord - CU's head coach has never worked as a head coach again. Barnett has begged and pleaded to get back into coaching - to no avail. Water Bottle? Please. Hawkins actually got a job coaching in Canada, that lasted for a couple weeks.
 
MiamiBuffs said:
Which of his guys are now coordinators?

Which of his guys are now HCs somewhere?

Bonus points if you can tell us if they ever will be and when?
Click to expand...

Hawk's OCs, Helfrich and Kiseau, both ended up with promotions despite some bad results at CU. EB, Embree, and Brown all have similar positions to where they were before CU. In addition to Helfrich and Kiseau, Tui, Marshall, Prince and Grimes are all coaches I can think of off the top of my head who all managed to parlay themselves into immediate promotions despite terrible records by CU. The coaching community is pretty small and my point is respected coaches will end up in respected jobs.

Let's just throw out a hypothetical hire of Ken Norton as DC. If CU goes 0-13 next year and cleans house, Norton still sure as hell won't be the coach of Boulder High in 2016. He'd likely end up at a top college program or back in the NFL as a position coach, which is where he was anyway. If MM can't find or can't sell this job to anyone, it's a serious problem.
 
nolabuff said:
If CU goes 0-13 next year and cleans house, Norton still sure as hell won't be the coach of Boulder High in 2016. He'd likely end up at a top college program or back in the NFL as a position coach, which is where he was anyway. If MM can't find or can't sell this job to anyone, it's a serious problem.
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No. That job is currently held by another former CU assistant - Bob Simmons.
 
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sackman said:
No. That job is currently held by another former CU assistant - Bob Simmons.
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Who is 66 years old and had been out of coaching for 5+ years when hired. Sounds like a retirement gig to me.

Go back 15 years and Simmons' career path actually proves my point. He received a big promotion from being a college position coach, flamed out, and ended up back as a position coach at a top program. I just don't think CU is a huge career risk for a guy looking to move up in the ranks.
 
Do most guys get another chance to be a HC if they fail, in CU's case horribly, in their one chance? Seems to me like most guys don't get that second chance unless there was some semblance of success.
 
White_Rabbit said:
Do most guys get another chance to be a HC if they fail, in CU's case horribly, in their one chance? Seems to me like most guys don't get that second chance unless there was some semblance of success.
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Realistically who have we had that deserved anything resembling a second chance.

Mac retired, if he was going to coach it would have been at CU so he doesn't count.

Skippy took a top 10 program and made it into a declining top 25 program. He then got chances at both UW and UCLA, worked out fine for him other than sucking at those jobs as well.

GB never got another chance, this one was the sad one since he was a dog gone good coach who got smeared by a made up scandal that the administration at the time didn't have the backbone to contest.

Hawkins. Screwed up a CFL team. Why would anyone give him a second chance.

Embree. Shouldn't have had the first chance. Killed his chances at a second job with the way he choose to leave the CU job.

M2. So far hasn't won much but has turned the program in the right direction. Should he be fired in the next couple years very likely that he would be able to get another non-P5 job based on his SJSU record and being a good person.
 
Can't think of many around the P10/12 either. Tomey at Zona got another job at SJSU, but he was actually pretty successful in the desert.

Paul Hackett, the HC at USC before Carroll, hasn't gotten another shot.
Stoops hasn't.
Koetter at ASU hasn't.
Dorrell at UCLA hasn't. Bob Toledo at UCLA got another shot as Tulane's HC.

I just don't think guys get second chances. Hell, Karl Dorrell can barely get a job as an OC, he has only had WR jobs since UCLA fired him save for 1 year last year as Vandy's OC.
 
Off the top of my head, guys who got second (and sometimes third) HC chances after being fired from D-1 coaching jobs include:

Ron Zook
Kyle Winningham
Charlie Weiss
Rich Rodriguez
Earle Bruce
Frank Solich
Bo Pelini


i can't think of any others, but I'm sure there are a few.
 
sackman said:
Off the top of my head, guys who got second (and sometimes third) HC chances after being fired from D-1 coaching jobs include:

Ron Zook
Kyle Winningham
Charlie Weiss
Rich Rodriguez
Earle Bruce
Frank Solich
Bo Pelini


i can't think of any others, but I'm sure there are a few.
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Lol, Tyyyyyrone willingham
 
And a lot of the guys that got second chances didn't do awful in their first chance. Rich Rod definitely deserved another shot. Rick didn't really deserve that third one, but I can see how an AD could be duped just looking at his W-L record.

Hell, Larry Coker won 2 national championships, and almost a third, at the U and had to take a job at UTSA to be the head guy again.

Cutcliffe got another shot at Duke and I can see that happening given the success he had at Ole Miss. Nothing too amazing, but stuck around the 7-8 win mark which is highly lucrative to a place like Duke.
 
MM would probably be hired quickly as a DB coach or a DC in the NFL of he was out here. I would think he could get a HC job easily outside the P5 trams too. My hope for Seto is the fact that Mac can make him a co-DC for a year then full DC after. Makes a possible jump to NFL DC for him in 2 to 4 years if he did a great job here. Seeing Seattles aggressive D I would love this to happen. Really am hoping that this is the rabbit MM pulls out of his hat next week.
 
nolabuff said:
Hawk's OCs, Helfrich and Kiseau, both ended up with promotions despite some bad results at CU. EB, Embree, and Brown all have similar positions to where they were before CU. In addition to Helfrich and Kiseau, Tui, Marshall, Prince and Grimes are all coaches I can think of off the top of my head who all managed to parlay themselves into immediate promotions despite terrible records by CU. The coaching community is pretty small and my point is respected coaches will end up in respected jobs.

Let's just throw out a hypothetical hire of Ken Norton as DC. If CU goes 0-13 next year and cleans house, Norton still sure as hell won't be the coach of Boulder High in 2016. He'd likely end up at a top college program or back in the NFL as a position coach, which is where he was anyway. If MM can't find or can't sell this job to anyone, it's a serious problem.
Click to expand...

In that post I wasn't talking about Hawkins staff. I was asking about Embree's staff. All the position coaches are position coaches once again was my point. For some of them they should have held a coordinator position before getting those jobs and they should get one again someday IF they have the potential. We reached with that staff and crossed our fingers and our toes.
 
White_Rabbit said:
Can't think of many around the P10/12 either. Tomey at Zona got another job at SJSU, but he was actually pretty successful in the desert.

Paul Hackett, the HC at USC before Carroll, hasn't gotten another shot.
Stoops hasn't.
Koetter at ASU hasn't.
Dorrell at UCLA hasn't. Bob Toledo at UCLA got another shot as Tulane's HC.

I just don't think guys get second chances. Hell, Karl Dorrell can barely get a job as an OC, he has only had WR jobs since UCLA fired him save for 1 year last year as Vandy's OC.
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They seem to take some weird career paths afterwards that don't really have a lot to do with them being fired. It's like they peaked when they got the big HC job in the first place, then it's usually all downhill from there. Like they don't even hold onto the coordinating acumen that probably got them noticed in the first place.
 
Retreads aren't quite as in vogue for colleges. Nfl seems to do the retread dance more often, however having only 32 teams makes every coaching change much more newsworthy.
 
BehindEnemyLines said:
Retreads aren't quite as in vogue for colleges. Nfl seems to do the retread dance more often, however having only 32 teams makes every coaching change much more newsworthy.
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Yeah. College seems like the career arc is that someone keeps getting promoted until he gets fired. Once fired, he'll either get a chance at the position he was fired from at a smaller program or drop back to his previous job position level while maintaining status as a big program guy. We rarely see, for example, a HC or coordinator get fired one P5 and hired at another P5. Rich Rod and Leach are very notable examples of that happening. Probably because they had won at this level and nothing about their firings suggested they had lost the ability to win as P5 HCs.
 
Coaching is a rough profession. You don't really want to turn down jobs that you're offered as the luster can wear off quickly, but you also kinda have to choose wisely.

Take Dom Capers for example. Great DC. Has failed twice as a HC, but both jobs were of expansion franchises. Can't imagine many guys would be successful in those situations so he'll probably finish his career with the label of great DC, awful HC.
 
SD Buff said:
Mike Nolan hired today as LB coach of the Chargers. From Head Coach back to DC down to LB coach.
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The best thing I can say about Nolas as a HC is that wearing a suit on the sideline looks sharp as hell.
 
zbuff said:
I liked Stram.
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SuperiorBuff said:
I ****ing hate Stram.
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zbuff said:
Meh
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goldilocks-and-the-three-bears-web.jpg
 
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