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Adding baseball & softball not as expensive as I thought
- Thread starter Buffnik
- Start date
Putting some numbers to it makes it clear that you are correct in the short term (under a set of generous assumptions) that the "6 sport" scenario would be much less costly, but long term (~50 yrs) they are equivalent, presuming no further facilities investment.
Under your scenario, let's presume that-
- Carlson can be converted for use in gymnastics and wrestling without any significant political challenges from the academics wanting Carlson for use as planned
- The updates required are maybe $10M to get Carlson updated to acceptible status
- The diving well at CU can be updated as is without major renovation has 2 1M boards and a 3M board. NCAA requirements are for 2 1M boards, 2 3M boards, and a platform. Let's say that costs $500K
- The bowling facilities are acceptable "as is".
- The annual scholarship costs are $900K for all added 46 student athletes
- Coaching salaries for all 6 sports is ~$1M total for HCs and assistants
- The NCAA allows CU to add just a diving program- I believe all current programs are diving AND swimming
- Field Hockey and Men's LAX requires no further facilities investment
- Travel for all 6 teams is roughly $600K
- The teams generate negligible revenue
- A world-class baseball/softball facility costs about $35M- that's what South Carolina just spent to put in one of theirs.
- Total coaching salaries are ~$1M for the two sports
- Scholarship costs are $450K
- Travel is roughly $400K for baseball/softball
- Added revenue for softball/baseball is ~$300K (not unreasonable given that Arizona made $400K off of ticket/concession revenues for baseball alone in 2012)
However, if any of the above ssumptions were to change in favor of baseball/softball, the equivalent cost would be much sooner than 50 years.
SuperiorBuff
Well-Known Member
I never suggested that we ad 6 sports; I merely pointed out that there is a large list of potential women's scholarship sports that would cost less than softball that could be used to keep Title 9 compliance for the addition of men's lacrosse and wrestling. I do not want baseball or softball.
cowe6453
Well-Known Member
Lacrosse! With the amount of success DU and Air Force have had and the growing popularity of the sport in Colorado and the west, this needs to happen. Our club team has had a lot of success and CU already attracts a lot of kids from the northeast / mid Atlantic so it theretically shouldn't be too hard to attract players from those regions especially when we're really only competing with DU and Air Force as the only programs in the west. DU already attracts a good chunk of kids from California and geographically it makes sense that we would stand to benefit from that as well.
I could see Stanford and Oregon adding programs soon so we need to lead the charge and be the pioneer program for the PAC if we want to build something special. Factor in the limited initial investment and expenses and it seems llike a low risk / high reward scenario
I could see Stanford and Oregon adding programs soon so we need to lead the charge and be the pioneer program for the PAC if we want to build something special. Factor in the limited initial investment and expenses and it seems llike a low risk / high reward scenario
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You are all talking about what makes the most sense for the AD, financially, where they can compete, etc. As an AD that is something to consider, but as a fan, I don't really care.
I like to watch baseball, I dislike going to Denver and paying a bunch of money, spending a ton of time driving/parking/walking to see the Rockies from seats no where near the field. I would to to and watch a quite a bit of CU baseball. Honestly the biggest problem is when they play ball, its too early in the year.
I like to watch baseball, I dislike going to Denver and paying a bunch of money, spending a ton of time driving/parking/walking to see the Rockies from seats no where near the field. I would to to and watch a quite a bit of CU baseball. Honestly the biggest problem is when they play ball, its too early in the year.
Men's Club Soccer is already extremely competitive as is Men's Club Lax. make the schollies work and add those two ASAP.
Also nike outfitted Men's Lax with the sharpest sets on campus.
Also nike outfitted Men's Lax with the sharpest sets on campus.
cowe6453
Well-Known Member
Seriously, they already treat that club like a D1 team. Financially and Title IX wise, soccer and lax make the most sense and hey it'd be a nice way to spark up some competition between DU and CU. Cant imagine that be anything but a good thingMen's Club Soccer is already extremely competitive as is Men's Club Lax. make the schollies work and add those two ASAP.
Also nike outfitted Men's Lax with the sharpest sets on campus.
Also, keep dreaming about building on south campus. The university owns the land, but the city of Boulder has refused to issue water taps for that site. CU can build all they want, but that is quite difficult to do when you aren't able to get running water.
Don't know if your
Just a couple comments-
I don't know if it's fair to just assume revenues from baseball and softball would be higher than those from other sports that might be added. In addition to Men's Lax already showing signs at the club level that it could earn some revenue, I'd think there's also opportunities in at least a couple of the the indoor sports, especially gymnastics. I'd never looked at NCAA gymnastics attendance before, but it looks like it's the top draw for women's sports at many colleges (https://www.roadtonationals.com/results/charts/ch_attendance_current.php shows average gymnastics attendance). Of course, it's presumptuous to think CU would grab the "brass ring" and have the sport become huge (like it evidently is at Utah, whose average gymnastics attendance of ~13,700 last year was I believe the highest average of ANY woman's sports team at ANY school), but even a school like UCLA, which has a pretty apathetic fan base in general (or maybe just massive traffic trauma?), averages over 6,000 in gymnastics (vs. ~800 for volleyball and ~1,800 for women's basketball and 7,700 for MEN'S basketball). (And, for local reference, DU averaged a decent 1,900 for gymnastics also.)
Conversely, the top baseball attendance in the Pac last year (From a "Misc Report" at http://stats.ncaa.org/rankings?sport_code=MBA&division=1) was ASU at 3,014, and Utah (closest to being our "weather brother") only averaged ~1,300. (I couldn't find attendance stats listed for softball or wrestling in the NCAA stats site.)
Re facilities for the indoor sports such as gymnastics and wrestling, I'd assume that their home competitions would just take place at Coors, so practice facilities are mainly all that's needed (other than of course mats and so forth). Were there contingency plans already developed during the initial design phase of the Practice Facility next to the Keg to expand it to add additional indoor sports relatively economically (so the new sports could take advantage of the weight, medical, recovery etc. equipment already there)? If so, what would the additional costs be? (I have no idea.)
Just a couple comments-
I don't know if it's fair to just assume revenues from baseball and softball would be higher than those from other sports that might be added. In addition to Men's Lax already showing signs at the club level that it could earn some revenue, I'd think there's also opportunities in at least a couple of the the indoor sports, especially gymnastics. I'd never looked at NCAA gymnastics attendance before, but it looks like it's the top draw for women's sports at many colleges (https://www.roadtonationals.com/results/charts/ch_attendance_current.php shows average gymnastics attendance). Of course, it's presumptuous to think CU would grab the "brass ring" and have the sport become huge (like it evidently is at Utah, whose average gymnastics attendance of ~13,700 last year was I believe the highest average of ANY woman's sports team at ANY school), but even a school like UCLA, which has a pretty apathetic fan base in general (or maybe just massive traffic trauma?), averages over 6,000 in gymnastics (vs. ~800 for volleyball and ~1,800 for women's basketball and 7,700 for MEN'S basketball). (And, for local reference, DU averaged a decent 1,900 for gymnastics also.)
Conversely, the top baseball attendance in the Pac last year (From a "Misc Report" at http://stats.ncaa.org/rankings?sport_code=MBA&division=1) was ASU at 3,014, and Utah (closest to being our "weather brother") only averaged ~1,300. (I couldn't find attendance stats listed for softball or wrestling in the NCAA stats site.)
Re facilities for the indoor sports such as gymnastics and wrestling, I'd assume that their home competitions would just take place at Coors, so practice facilities are mainly all that's needed (other than of course mats and so forth). Were there contingency plans already developed during the initial design phase of the Practice Facility next to the Keg to expand it to add additional indoor sports relatively economically (so the new sports could take advantage of the weight, medical, recovery etc. equipment already there)? If so, what would the additional costs be? (I have no idea.)
Give me some badeball!
BuffG
Well-Known Member
I've been wanting men's soccer for so long. Since the 90's, Colorado has had one of the best youth systems in the country. DU has finally capitalized on it & they're regularly going to NCAAs & bringing in top recruiting classes made up of a lot of CO kids.
Not exactly the same appeal as beach volleyball
Runza-eatin' kegglers….
Yes but, apparently you can't play baseball in Grand Forks.
As an aside, during my brief incarceration in Fargo, I got to go to several F-M RedHawks games. Northern league baseball is great.
you would be one of only a few.
I don't think he would. We are the only Pac12 school without it and the conference has been very good at baseball thru the years. Also could not hurt in certain football recruiting situations either. Baseball would be a good add for CU when the revenue situation with football gets straightened out. Need to solely focus on football revenue cirst
I can tell you, in my area at least, there are just as many football fall/ lax spring athletes as there are football fall/ baseball spring ones. I expect this trend to continue.
Not disagreeing on this point. LAX is a great sport as well I just think it comes after baseball
SuperiorBuff
Well-Known Member
F*** baseball, that is all.
Also only Pac12 school without softball.