Buffenuf
massive tool
At the end of the season after the Noro-V struck, there's no way he finished at 210; I'd be surprised if he broke 200!
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Andre (Edit: LEAVING FOR NBA)
- Thread starter rynobuff
- Start date
At the end of the season after the Noro-V struck, there's no way he finished at 210; I'd be surprised if he broke 200!
Medford M.
Well-Known Member
I honestly don't think he was 210 at any point last year.
Medford M.
Well-Known Member
True. I actually feel CU has been far more truthful than most teams in this regard be it football or basketball.
jgisland
Club Member
David Aldridge has an article up on NBA.com today looking at the small forwards in the draft. Aldridge has him as the 6th best small forward and likely to go early in the second round. He makes these rankings and I quote "based on discussions with dozens of NBA and college coaches, and NBA college scouts and team executives, address the question of how ready players are to play the position which they are assigned: In other words, if there was a game tonight, who would play better at that position tonight, not in three years. Players are ranked based on the position that the coaches and scouts believe is their best NBA position, and even then, there is always disagreement between teams."
Here's what Aldridge has to say about Dre.
Colorado's Andre Roberson averaged a double-double (10.2 points, 11.2 rebounds), the second year in a row he accomplished the feat. Those boards were good for second in the nation, behind Siena's O.D. Anosike (11.4 per game). But Roberson, the Pac 12's Defensive Player of the Year winner, is still wrestling with whether he'll go into the Draft, looking like he'll go all the way to Sunday's deadline before deciding. If Roberson puts his name in the Draft and keeps it in, he'll have to adjust from playing inside at Colorado to trying to play on the wing in the pros.
"He's an OK shooter," said a coach whose team played Colorado. "He doesn't put it on the floor like a three. He can put it on the floor. I don't see how he improves. Based on what he's doing he'll be the same player next year. But he's very active. He's a good rebounder and shot blocker. Excellent hands. He can defend multiple positions because he's mobile."
But if he doesn't have a true NBA position at the offensive end, he's expected to be able to defend multiple positions at the defensive end. There are comparisons made with Kenneth Faried, who worked the glass at Morehead State all the way to the first round of the 2012 Draft. But Faried is bigger, even though Roberson has a similar kind of motor.
"He's got big energy," one GM said. "But he's very thin to play the four, and that's why we're looking at him at the three. Does not have the skills right now to be an effective small forward, and would have to get really stronger to play the four. This year he tried to do a little more on the perimeter and really didn't do well with it. But he's got a high spirit."
Here's what Aldridge has to say about Dre.
Colorado's Andre Roberson averaged a double-double (10.2 points, 11.2 rebounds), the second year in a row he accomplished the feat. Those boards were good for second in the nation, behind Siena's O.D. Anosike (11.4 per game). But Roberson, the Pac 12's Defensive Player of the Year winner, is still wrestling with whether he'll go into the Draft, looking like he'll go all the way to Sunday's deadline before deciding. If Roberson puts his name in the Draft and keeps it in, he'll have to adjust from playing inside at Colorado to trying to play on the wing in the pros.
"He's an OK shooter," said a coach whose team played Colorado. "He doesn't put it on the floor like a three. He can put it on the floor. I don't see how he improves. Based on what he's doing he'll be the same player next year. But he's very active. He's a good rebounder and shot blocker. Excellent hands. He can defend multiple positions because he's mobile."
But if he doesn't have a true NBA position at the offensive end, he's expected to be able to defend multiple positions at the defensive end. There are comparisons made with Kenneth Faried, who worked the glass at Morehead State all the way to the first round of the 2012 Draft. But Faried is bigger, even though Roberson has a similar kind of motor.
"He's got big energy," one GM said. "But he's very thin to play the four, and that's why we're looking at him at the three. Does not have the skills right now to be an effective small forward, and would have to get really stronger to play the four. This year he tried to do a little more on the perimeter and really didn't do well with it. But he's got a high spirit."
That's the thing. I think there really isn't a downside of staying (barring injury). The upside, though, is if he thinks he can work on his game and become a threat from the perimeter. He showed flashes that he might be capable of doing so, but as of now, no NBA team can draft him with any confidence in his outside game.
jgisland
Club Member
On the flip side the quote "Based on what he's doing he'll be the same player next year" is an argument to go now.
Oh definitely. Unless he wants to make a run in the tourney and his family is in a comfortable enough situation that an immediate payday is not needed. I also think having some legitimate offensive weapons on the floor might allow dre to show what he can do on the offensive end.
I dont think he will drop next year, and he can be part of something special next year which gives him the exposure to potentially being bumped. Also, he would get a degree as a fall back plan.
HotBuffChica
New Member
A. Payne (Michigan State) & Dre. basically are in serious reflection mode as the clock nears the magical deadline. Read that Payne is leaning towards returning at MSU putting them in my opinion as the pre season team to beat in the country. MSU should be pre season #1 (even though Kentucky will get it on hype) based on returning players and body of work with Payne returning.
Izzo has strong influence over players leaning towards entering. He usually advises a return and when he does the player usually always follows suit.
Izzo has strong influence over players leaning towards entering. He usually advises a return and when he does the player usually always follows suit.
If he stays, then the team should be pretty special next year, and receive more national exposure which can only help his draft status. Plus the dude needs to put on some pounds.
jgisland
Club Member
He went from a borderline lottery pick to potentially going undrafted after this year. The draft looks down on four year players and he can always come back and get his degree. One year of a NBA salary is going to pay as much as 10 years of what he'd make using his degree.
Great call about CU getting more exposure next year. Even if the Mayor ends up higher on the draft board, CU having a solid season will reflect greatly on Dre's abilities, and unless you're the absolute freak on an average team, the NBA loves every solid player at the highest performing schools.
haha
This is assuming he gets drafted, and then if he's a 2nd rounder, he actually makes the roster.
jgisland
Club Member
Absolutely, but a lot of the mock drafts that don't have him listed are omitting him until he declares for the draft. Plus with the article about the Celtics interest in him and the Aldridge article IMO I don't see him not getting drafted.
jgisland
Club Member
I've been wanting to post this for a while and I haven't gotten to it.
There's a paper called Predicting NBA Draft Position from College Performance. To sum it up, they looked at a variety of factors and attempted to find the factors with the highest correlation to draft position. They admit that it isn't a perfect model, but it does a reasonably good job of predicting draft positions (average deviation of draft picks is 5.8 spots). They found the 2 most important factors are efficiency and usage.
The player I most often hear Dre compared to is Kenneth Faried. So when you compare Faried and Dre's usage and efficiency numbers it doesn't paint the best picture for Dre. Dre has never used as many possessions as Faried did. The most troublesome thing in my eyes is Faried and Dre's efficiency numbers trended in opposite directions during their careers.
There's a paper called Predicting NBA Draft Position from College Performance. To sum it up, they looked at a variety of factors and attempted to find the factors with the highest correlation to draft position. They admit that it isn't a perfect model, but it does a reasonably good job of predicting draft positions (average deviation of draft picks is 5.8 spots). They found the 2 most important factors are efficiency and usage.
The player I most often hear Dre compared to is Kenneth Faried. So when you compare Faried and Dre's usage and efficiency numbers it doesn't paint the best picture for Dre. Dre has never used as many possessions as Faried did. The most troublesome thing in my eyes is Faried and Dre's efficiency numbers trended in opposite directions during their careers.
| Kennth Faried | ||||||||
| Ht | Wt | Yr | G | %Min | ORtg | %Poss | ||
| 2011 | Morehead St. | 6-8 | 228 | Sr | 35 | 85.9 | 116.2 | 25.8 |
| 2010 | Morehead St. | 6-8 | 225 | Jr | 35 | 75.2 | 109.8 | 27.8 |
| 2009 | Morehead St. | 6-8 | 215 | So | 36 | 74.7 | 110.1 | 24.6 |
| 2008 | Morehead St. | 6-8 | 215 | Fr | 30 | 50.2 | 100.8 | 29.2 |
| Andre Roberson | ||||||||
| Ht | Wt | Yr | G | %Min | ORtg | %Poss | ||
| 2013 | Colorado | 6-7 | 210 | Jr | 31 | 77.3 | 99.8 | 20.5 |
| 2012 | Colorado | 6-7 | 195 | So | 36 | 75.2 | 108.7 | 21.9 |
| 2011 | Colorado | 6-7 | 195 | Fr | 38 | 55.2 | 118.3 | 16.3 |
Dre is the kind of guy who needs a team to fall in love with him. He is a quality individual who is a solid teammate, hard worker, great attitude. On the plus side he could potentially be a lock down defender against multiple postions while contributing a bunch of rebounds and a guy who can get some buckets in transition due to speed and athleticism.
On the other hand he doesn't have the handle or the outside shot of a 3 and isn't close to big enough to compete at the 4, he's actually a lot smaller than a lot of 3s in the league. He would be an offensive liability and as good a defender as he is I could see him having problems with a number of the more physical 3s.
If he went to a team that had a supporting cast that would allow him to focus on what he does well he could have a long and productive career but go to the wrong team and he is in the D-league before he knows what hit him.
I have no idea what he is going to decide. Selfishly I want him to come back. We will be a much better team with him. If he has the right NBA team tell him that they will definately draft him if he is there because they have a space for him then it would be hard to turn down. I keep thinking about him being a perfect pick for San Antonio. Short of that promise I think he would be way ahead to stay.
I don't see him adding substantial weight although even 10lbs would help. I also don't see him becoming anything close to a complete perimeter offensive player but if he can get his outside shot more consistent or develop at least one go to move (maybe a pull up 12-15 ft shot off a simple drive) then he would be in a much better position next year. He's not going to move into the lottery but a good year with some specific improvements could make him a solid second half of the first round guy.
On the other hand he doesn't have the handle or the outside shot of a 3 and isn't close to big enough to compete at the 4, he's actually a lot smaller than a lot of 3s in the league. He would be an offensive liability and as good a defender as he is I could see him having problems with a number of the more physical 3s.
If he went to a team that had a supporting cast that would allow him to focus on what he does well he could have a long and productive career but go to the wrong team and he is in the D-league before he knows what hit him.
I have no idea what he is going to decide. Selfishly I want him to come back. We will be a much better team with him. If he has the right NBA team tell him that they will definately draft him if he is there because they have a space for him then it would be hard to turn down. I keep thinking about him being a perfect pick for San Antonio. Short of that promise I think he would be way ahead to stay.
I don't see him adding substantial weight although even 10lbs would help. I also don't see him becoming anything close to a complete perimeter offensive player but if he can get his outside shot more consistent or develop at least one go to move (maybe a pull up 12-15 ft shot off a simple drive) then he would be in a much better position next year. He's not going to move into the lottery but a good year with some specific improvements could make him a solid second half of the first round guy.
SECOBuffsFan
Active Member
He is a San Antonio Spurs type of player
and that would be his dream team
btbuff
It's an inside joke
San Antonio has a better version offensive(less rebounding) version of Andre in Kawhi Leonard. Steals the ball, plays GREAT defense, and hits the 3 at a pretty high rate. However, remember that Orlando's is now full of former San Antonio members.
cubuffs85
Active Member
Define something special? Winning the Pac-12, going to the Sweet 16, Final Four, winning it all? On a different note, I hate when fans "recruit" prospects by telling the players they have "a chance to be something special." That's true about everything.
If there's a good chance he'll get drafted he should go. If the choice is between being here, Bangor ME, or Eastern Europe, he should comeback to Boulder.
Would I like 'Dre to comeback, absolutely. But I don't want to see him as a another Roby as Goose as alluded to.
Something Special Definition: Best team in Colorado basketball history.
That special enough for you? On paper that is what they are looking like. With Roberson, they look like a top 15 team. They should challenge Arizona for the Pac 12 title and be a sweet 16 team. This will sky rocket the national awareness of Colorado basketball along with it's best defensive player, Andre Roberson.
The 1940 team won the NIT (the more prestigious tournament at the time) and was considered national champions.
Buffenuf
massive tool
fify....love Dre's resolve, but remember his big RB numbers come from instinct and developed from hours of watching video, not from blocking out and his lockdown "D" has been against good college players, about his size and weight, not against the best in the world every night and not against players who regularly outweigh him by 20+ lbs. The chart above shows Fareid at 228 as a senior and Dre as 210 as a junior. There is no way he finished a 30+ game season anywhere near 210! I'd be surprised if he broke 200 after the loss to Ill-noise. Now that play-offs are underway there's an excuse to briefly watch NBA games; do so and note the overall size and athleticism of all players (AC's excepted, but Dre won't be guarding any pro AC's). Dre is definitely not there yet.
While I believe he can improve offensively, more importantly, I think he would measurably improve physically under Forman's Sports Performance program---Forman heads up the entire program , even if BB has its own S&C guy. He would not have that, sitting on the bus to Austiin or Bakersfield. He needs that physicality most of all, for regular 80 game play in the Association.
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Lt.Col.FrankSlade
Well-Known Member
Is he seriously thinking of declaring for the NBA?
jgisland
Club Member
This is all great and I would love for Dre to come back but none of this guarentees that his draft stock gets boosted and being part of something special doesn't pay the bills. What happens if CU does have a great run, Dinwiddie takes a massive leap, XJ b/c a monster on the boards, Scott dominates in the post and Dre is a nice role player on that team? All of the sudden in 2 years he is a jr analyst in an accounting dept making 30k a year, but he has that degree and being "part of something special" to fall back on.
i'm with cubuffs85, if he's an early 2nd rounder like the most recent projections show he should go.