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How Much Does Our Defense Improve?

Buffskier said:
That could be viewed as luck, but could just as easily be interpreted that the rest of the team was swarming to the ball and was put in a position to succeed. Who knows. Maybe Baer is a hell of a DC at the MWC level, but his defenses just don't work at the P5 level.
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That was something I really noticed when reviewing the highlights in the 'countdown' thread. The CU defense in the '90s did a much better of job of having 2 or 3 players at the tackle point, even when the initial solo tackle was successful. Swarming to the ball has many benefits in terms of follow through on tackles and making the most of fumbles.

I hope the new coaching staff gets some immediate results, but it's hard for me to believe that they can have that big an impact in only 20 some practices. I expect to see improvement by the end of the season though.
 
TSchekler said:
It is a good defense, and it's been built with a lot of unheralded recruits, much like CU is going to doing/has to do.

Nobody seems to know exactly what defense CU will be running and even the beat writers have talked about a 3,4 and 5 man front. Then they throw out the depth chart and show a 4-3 base defense (which we know just isn't the case). So if you're waiting on the staff to officially announce anything, I wouldn't hold your breath. Otherwise, there have definitely been various tidbits, if you read between the lines, that suggest they are moving toward a similar model.
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Nobody seems to know, but you figured it out!!!!! I'll take the contrarian opinion and we are not moving towards the TCU model.
 
MtnBuff said:
With that staff we may not have been any good with a young Champ Bailey or two back there along with Jimmy and Jalil.

Our corners are good, not as good as Jimmy and Jalil but good. The guys in front of them are mostly better and the coaching is much better. It couldn't be worse.
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I dug up that roster because i was curious, I'll give you the talent point, but not sure the front 7 is better:

http://www.cfbstats.com/2010/team/157/tackle/index.html
 
Buffskier said:
That could be viewed as luck, but could just as easily be interpreted that the rest of the team was swarming to the ball and was put in a position to succeed.
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The analytic guys show that as luck. Same staff, same players in the NFL, different results over 12 games is not unusual.
Certainly you can coach it to improve, but getting 20 out of 21 is just plain luck (and ridiculous at that).
 
absinthe said:
I dug up that roster because i was curious, I'll give you the talent point, but not sure the front 7 is better:

http://www.cfbstats.com/2010/team/157/tackle/index.html
Click to expand...

That team was typical Hawkins era talent. Some very good talent surrounded by a number of guys who didn't belong on a P5 field. Our current talent in the front 7 is probably better but not by a lot (some of the better guys that year were still young.)

It is hard to compare though because by then the rot that was the Hawkins era had set solidly in and very few of those guys lived up to their potential individually or as a unit. Losing had simply been accepted and expected.

I sense (and hope I am right) that our current staff is changing that mentality
 
MtnBuff said:
That team was typical Hawkins era talent. Some very good talent surrounded by a number of guys who didn't belong on a P5 field. Our current talent in the front 7 is probably better but not by a lot (some of the better guys that year were still young.)

It is hard to compare though because by then the rot that was the Hawkins era had set solidly in and very few of those guys lived up to their potential individually or as a unit. Losing had simply been accepted and expected.

I sense (and hope I am right) that our current staff is changing that mentality
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I think it comes down to coaching too, and Mac is a much better coach than birdman ever was.
 
absinthe said:
I dug up that roster because i was curious, I'll give you the talent point, but not sure the front 7 is better:

http://www.cfbstats.com/2010/team/157/tackle/index.html
Click to expand...

Surely you jest? Look again at the DLs and LBs on that '11 squad. The guys you think were better were all FR and Sophs: Uzo-Diribe , Pericak, Rippy, Forrest West.... all smaller, weaker, far less experienced and less knowledgeable than in their prime; find one decent front seven guy from that squad........................not happenin'!
 
Buffenuf said:
Surely you jest? Look again at the DLs and LBs on that '11 squad. The guys you think were better were all FR and Sophs: Uzo-Diribe , Pericak, Rippy, Forrest West.... all smaller, weaker, far less experienced and less knowledgeable than in their prime; find one decent front seven guy from that squad........................not happenin'!
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Enjoy your revisionist history.
 
Buffenuf said:
Knew you couldn't do it!
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Couldn't and wont bother to are not the same thing.

Go back and look at stars, offers, and awards for that group, especially look at who those players were before injury. Three of those players had more offers than our whole front 7.
 
Buffenuf said:
Surely you jest? Look again at the DLs and LBs on that '11 squad. The guys you think were better were all FR and Sophs: Uzo-Diribe , Pericak, Rippy, Forrest West.... all smaller, weaker, far less experienced and less knowledgeable than in their prime; find one decent front seven guy from that squad........................not happenin'!
Click to expand...

Curtis Cunningham and BJ Beatty. Sipili was decent at times too.
 
buffaholic said:
Nobody seems to know, but you figured it out!!!!! I'll take the contrarian opinion and we are not moving towards the TCU model.
Click to expand...
Nobody knows for sure because they aren't going to make any sort of official announcement, but if you listen to the things they say about the personnel in the front 7, how they're using Awini in a "Nickelback" role, and watch the type of players they are recruiting for defense, you can draw some reasonable parallels. Lighten up, man.
 
Duff Man said:
Curtis Cunningham and BJ Beatty. Sipili was decent at times too.
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Dont ignore the smaller/weaker assertion even amoung the young pups - Rippy/Pericak/Kasa/Major the 2 LBs in that equation were both bigger than our current best LB by a lot. Kasa and Pericak were as big or experienced anyone not named Solis on our current line.

Ultimately it was coaching though i think this staff beats that staff with the same players.
 
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Orr said:
Oh hey, what's up new member who's very concerned about the D-line.
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The difference is a capital "S" this time around. Or it moved back to front?

Oh, and the difference on the field will be noticeable in many ways, even though uh scores three or so TD's.
 
absinthe said:
Couldn't and wont bother to are not the same thing.

Go back and look at stars, offers, and awards for that group, especially look at who those players were before injury. Three of those players had more offers than our whole front 7.
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Ahhhhh, the Mack Brown rationale (#3,#2,#3 recruiting classes among his last four, yet no NFL draftees).....Got it!
 
Buffenuf said:
Ahhhhh, the Mack Brown rationale (#3,#2,#3 recruiting classes among his last four, yet no NFL draftees).....Got it!
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Not to nit pick but Kasa was drafted, just not for defense. Major/Rippy would have been drafted had it not been 4 injury, Pericak played in the league, Sipili was arrested before it came up, Polk and Perkins made preseason teams, and as mentioned by Duff, Beaty and Cunningham were significant contributors.

This is why i didn't bother with a decent response to you because you are either blinded by your Hawkins hate, trolling or an idiot. Go back and look at that team it was not without talent, it was very poorly coached but we'd take 3 of that front 7 on this team, and at least 4 would be contributors if not more.

Jalel Awini and ex-QB With zero starts? or BJ Beaty?
Keneth Ogblude - a 5'11" 210 lb jr? or Sipili as a Sr at 6'1" 235

Solis is probably the only guy who contributes on that line when you go back and look at it our starters this are 1 SR in Solis and 1 jr in Gilbert, sophs in Lopez and McCartney, lopez hasn't played a game, with back-ups of Shaver, Norgard, Frazier(still on D ?) . Basically no experience beyond the Solis/Gilbert and McCartney unless you count the Juco's.

Back then the starters were:

Hartigan - JR
Cunningham - Jr
Preciak - So
Beaty - SR

With expected contributions from:
Kasa, West - Sophs with game experience
Obi, Goree, AHles - Jr with game experience
 
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Will Pericak now plays O-line for seattle and is apparently killing it in camp. Pretty cool story. Tom cable has a history of moving d-line to o-line.

Also, solis is a senior.
 
I think we're going to be saying we'd rather have Awini over Beaty by the end of the season. Beaty was a solid player, but I'll blindly take Awini's athleticism in the Pac 12.
 
TSchekler said:
I think we're going to be saying we'd rather have Awini over Beaty by the end of the season. Beaty was a solid player, but I'll blindly take Awini's athleticism in the Pac 12.
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Beaty was pretty athletic, he played too out of control. Every other play he was in position to make a big play and flew completely past the action.
 
absinthe said:
Dont ignore the smaller/weaker assertion even amoung the young pups - Rippy/Pericak/Kasa/Major the 2 LBs in that equation were both bigger than our current best LB by a lot. Kasa and Pericak were as big or experienced anyone not named Solis on our current line.

Ultimately it was coaching though i think this staff beats that staff with the same players.
Click to expand...
Pericak was just moved from TE at that point and Kasa was such a bust as a DL that he ended up at TE. Kafovalu and Lopez, at this stage, are better as DL than those two.
Major was coming off an injury that he never fully recovered from and Rippy needed time to increase his FB IQ. I'll take Gillam and Olugbode over both; we'll see whether Gillam returns better than Major from his woes and Olubode is already way ahead of Rippy in FB IQ.
 
SuperiorBuff said:
Beaty was pretty athletic, he played too out of control. Every other play he was in position to make a big play and flew completely past the action.
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Yeah, I liked BJ and I don't want it to come off as if I'm ripping our former LBs. I am just extremely excited about the the potential that Awini brings to the position, and the creative ways they are going to use him.
 
TSchekler said:
I think we're going to be saying we'd rather have Awini over Beaty by the end of the season. Beaty was a solid player, but I'll blindly take Awini's athleticism in the Pac 12.
Click to expand...

If that turns out to be the case we'll be in much better shape than i expect.
 
Buffenuf said:
Pericak was just moved from TE at that point and Kasa was such a bust as a DL that he ended up at TE. Kafovalu and Lopez, at this stage, are better as DL than those two.
Major was coming off an injury that he never fully recovered from and Rippy needed time to increase his FB IQ. I'll take Gillam and Olugbode over both; we'll see whether Gillam returns better than Major from his woes and Olubode is already way ahead of Rippy in FB IQ.
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- So first we were smaller weaker, less experienced.
- Then no one was drafted
- Now our projected starters are better than our back-ups were then.


Pericak as a soph:
2010 (Soph.)—He started all 12 games at nose tackle, earning honorable mention All-Big 12 honors from the Associated Press and the league coaches (he was second-team by the Dallas Morning News and third-team by Phil Steele’s).
 
hawaii's offensive line is not that good and they lost a couple of starters from last season. Our DL and blitzing LB's need to get after wittik and rattle him up, while building some confidence. Our DB's have an opportunity to make some plays, so they need to step up and get it done. Our offense will move the ball, we just need to get touchdowns in the redzone and not rely on our kicking game to win this.

I am predicting a fumble recovery on defense and a pick 6 from one of our corners.
 
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