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If we have so little talent...

The talented PAC12 teams have frosh and soph who can play well young (Su'A Cravens). We have some talent, but it's the kind that needs development. Problem is, this program's cupboards were bare when Mac got here. The fact he got this team to the point where they are in most PAC12 games in only his second season is a testament to him and his system.

I think we'll win 1-2 PAC12 games next year, but we are still too thin in some spots to make a big jump next year...IMO. If it's ever going to happen for this program (and I'm becoming increasingly skeptical it can), I'm looking for 2016 to be the 6-7 win year as we will have lots of upperclassmen and a more favorable home schedule.
 
Some people keep saying progress. Recruiting, defense, special teams and not learning how to win and ofer in conference play. Yes we played closer games and offense was better, but MANY areas made No progress.
 
Bufffan68 said:
The talented PAC12 teams have frosh and soph who can play well young (Su'A Cravens). We have some talent, but it's the kind that needs development. Problem is, this program's cupboards were bare when Mac got here. The fact he got this team to the point where they are in most PAC12 games in only his second season is a testament to him and his system.

I think we'll win 1-2 PAC12 games next year, but we are still too thin in some spots to make a big jump next year...IMO. If it's ever going to happen for this program (and I'm becoming increasingly skeptical it can), I'm looking for 2016 to be the 6-7 win year as we will have lots of upperclassmen and a more favorable home schedule.
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There is not a team in the Pac 12 who has more underclassmen in the two deep than we do. Next year is the year this team needs to make the jump.
 
We are not talented (at least by Pac 12 standards which is all that matter's), you know how I know? We went 0-9 in conference.

Tini, I appreciate your hopeless optimism, but you're entering clown zone when you start a thread about this teams talent level immediately following a 2-10 season.

Mac is probably a good coach, I hope he is, but he's now in a conference filled with very good coaches, next year will tell us a lot.

Serious question Tini, do you think there is a single fan base in the Pac 12 that would trade their coach for Mac today? Or their roster for ours? That's what we're up against. Mac seems like a great guy and a good coach, but fair or not he needs to show that he is a VERY good coach beginning next season.
 
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SINKRATZ said:
We are not talented (at least by Pac 12 standards which is all that latter's), you know how I know? We went 0-9 in conference.

Tini, I appreciate your hopeless optimism, but you're entering clown zone when you start a thread about this teams talent level immediately following a 2-10 season.

Mac is probably a good coach, I hope he is, but he's now in a conference filled with very good coaches, next year will tell us a lot.

Serious question Tini, do you think there is a single fan base in the Pac 12 that would trade their coach for Mac today? Or their roster for ours? That's what we're up against. Mac seems like a great guy and a good coach, but fair or not he needs to show that he is a VERY good coach beginning next season.
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smart post....perhaps best of the night.
 
SINKRATZ said:
We are not talented (at least by Pac 12 standards which is all that latter's), you know how I know? We went 0-9 in conference.

Tini, I appreciate your hopeless optimism, but you're entering clown zone when you start a thread about this teams talent level immediately following a 2-10 season.

Mac is probably a good coach, I hope he is, but he's now in a conference filled with very good coaches, next year will tell us a lot.

Serious question Tini, do you think there is a single fan base in the Pac 12 that would trade their coach for Mac today? Or their roster for ours? That's what we're up against. Mac seems like a great guy and a good coach, but fair or not he needs to show that he is a VERY good coach beginning next season.
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I recall seeing a ton of posts from people before the season saying that they want to see progress without the blowouts. We got ****ed by USC and Oregon, but we were a competitive Pac 12 team this year. Now, following the season that is not good enough for people. I hate the losses and I'm tired of hearing people pick the low apple and **** on CU football when they can't name any players, but there is no denying that we saw a big jump overall this season. We've lost big and we've lost close, the next step is to win close, and I guess my point is that MacIntyre is a good enough coach and there is enough talent on the roster IMO to get to a bowl game in 2015 and beyond.

I'm not sure who would trade their coach for MacIntyre, but I bet if he had UCLA's roster the team would be a extremely good team, same with a team like UW. I've said this before, but MacIntyre has a damn good reputation as a excellent coach. As for the roster, UCLA had a terrible OL, ours was good this year. I'm sure there are more than a couple teams who would love to have Spruce. As a whole the roster is not great, but it's not as bad as some are trying to make it out to be. We have Pac 12 players in the secondary. Gillam had a terrible year with injuries all season, but I don't think you can say he shouldn't be on a Pac 12 team, even if he didn't start this year because of his injuries. THe problem with this question is the youth we have, most of these guys would be seriously competing for jobs on most other teams this coming year as 3rd year players, not as 1st and 2nd year players.
 
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Our talent was good enough to go winless for the first time ever. Res ipsa loquitur.

There are signs of hope. I think this is a very good offensive staff. I think they are organized and know how to be effective.

We aren't recruiting at a p12 level and it shows.

Do I think we can get to a bowl in 2015? Yes I do. But it should be a given not a stretch goal. The fact that we aren't sure if we can do it is very telling about the talent in the program.

When the original coach Mac was turning it around, there were more signs of life than this. But I do see some signs here so I have hope.

We are entering "nut up or shut up" time for this staff.
 
Liver said:
Our talent was good enough to go winless for the first time ever. Res ipsa loquitur.

There are signs of hope. I think this is a very good offensive staff. I think they are organized and know how to be effective.

We aren't recruiting at a p12 level and it shows.

Do I think we can get to a bowl in 2015? Yes I do. But it should be a given not a stretch goal. The fact that we aren't sure if we can do it is very telling about the talent in the program.

When the original coach Mac was turning it around, there were more signs of life than this. But I do see some signs here so I have hope.

We are entering "nut up or shut up" time for this staff.
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Is that because of the actual talent level relative to the rest of the Pac 12, and more importantly the bottom half or is it because the fans have been jaded over the last 9 years and therefore expect the worst?
 
'Tini said:
Is that because of the actual talent level relative to the rest of the Pac 12, and more importantly the bottom half or is it because the fans have been jaded over the last 9 years and therefore expect the worst?
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Kid, I've lived and died with CU football for decades longer than you've been on this earth. Jaded or not, we don't have the bodies. It speaks to these guys' offensive brilliance that they were able to keep us in games when we are so overmatched. That's what gives me some hope. But we need athletes. Every conference team we play has more difference makers than we do. That is not a recipe for success.
 
'Tini said:
Is that because of the actual talent level relative to the rest of the Pac 12, and more importantly the bottom half or is it because the fans have been jaded over the last 9 years and therefore expect the worst?
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It's clearly the former. This is the result of winning very few recruiting battles against conference foes - those foes get the talent, we get plan B guys and developmental players.
 
Liver said:
Kid, I've lived and died with CU football for decades longer than you've been on this earth. Jaded or not, we don't have the bodies. It speaks to these guys' offensive brilliance that they were able to keep us in games when we are so overmatched. That's what gives me some hope. But we need athletes. Every conference team we play has more difference makers than we do. That is not a recipe for success.
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How were those difference makers as underclassmen? And yes, there are underclassmen who are difference makers. Unfortunately, those guys are usually the blue chip recruits at USC and UCLA and those schools. We are getting the guys who need time in the weight room and overall need to grow up and mature, but they look like athletes. How many of MacIntyre's recruits who have played have looked out classed athletically for their position? An experienced team can overcome a talent deficit.
 
PAHIBuff said:
Mac2 is a really good coach, but the talent isn't there. The team has to play mistake-free football to win a P12 game because of the talent gap, and it's hard to play mistake-free football for an entire game. Answer.
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I think were talented on offense. Its the defense where we lose. We can't make stops happen consistently enough or when the game is on line. So its on the offense to keep the game close or win it. So yeah, that means the offense and ST has to play error free football.

Daaah said:
We just finished what could arguably be the worst season in the school's history. You cannot expect people to be giving reasoned assessments after this game. I think for the most part people realize that Mac is at least a decent coach and is probably pretty good. But there is a glaring talent issue that must be addressed.
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2012 was worse. Didn't we lose to a lower division school? Won only 1 game when it was handed to us. And were otherwise bitch slapped by everyone we played. And ranked in the 100s in nearly every FBS statistical category on defense. So, in my mind, that season was worse. We were in a position to win 5-6 games this year and you can't say that about 2012.
 
'Tini said:
How were those difference makers as underclassmen? And yes, there are underclassmen who are difference makers. Unfortunately, those guys are usually the blue chip recruits at USC and UCLA and those schools. We are getting the guys who need time in the weight room and overall need to grow up and mature, but they look like athletes. How many of MacIntyre's recruits who have played have looked out classed athletically for their position? An experienced team can overcome a talent deficit.
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The fallacy here is you're assuming that these developmental guys will contribute in a meaningful way down the line - some will, but some will bust just like other recruits.

Who looked outclassed? How about Gillam for most of the season. Yeah he was banged up but a 200lb (generous) middle linebacker without elite speed was glaring. How about watching our entire front 7 chase Wilson around the field and never catch him.
 
Daaah said:
We just finished what could arguably be the worst season in the school's history. You cannot expect people to be giving reasoned assessments after this game. I think for the most part people realize that Mac is at least a decent coach and is probably pretty good. But there is a glaring talent issue that must be addressed.
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Not even close to 1-11 Embree season. Short memory.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
SINKRATZ said:
The fallacy here is you're assuming that these developmental guys will contribute in a meaningful way down the line - some will, but some will bust just like other recruits.

Who looked outclassed? How about Gillam for most of the season. Yeah he was banged up but a 200lb (generous) middle linebacker without elite speed was glaring. How about watching our entire front 7 chase Wilson around the field and never catch him.
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I agree that Gillam had a rough year, and in other programs with depth at MLB he isn't playing, but he has shown that he is a Pac 12 player, just not when he's underweight because of injury and cna't seem to keep his head healthy.
 
'Tini said:
I agree that Gillam had a rough year, and in other programs with depth at MLB he isn't playing, but he has shown that he is a Pac 12 player, just not when he's underweight because of injury and cna't seem to keep his head healthy.
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It speaks volumes about the talent level of this team that when describing our (arguably) best defensive player you're using phrases like "he has shown that he is a Pac 12 player".
 
SINKRATZ said:
It speaks volumes about the talent level of this team that when describing our (arguably) best defensive player you're using phrases like "he has shown that he is a Pac 12 player".
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It speaks volumes about that one position
 
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