BerkeleyBuff
Well-Known Member
I mean, the bolded part is just demonstrably untrue. And Jay was a solid contributor in the end.
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Karl Dorrell officially named Colorado HC
- Thread starter The Alabaster Yak
- Start date
That 2005 team had Drew Olson, Jones-Drew, and Mercedes Lewis as seniors. It was their third year in a complicated offense, so you can see why this was their most successful year. It's really hard to tell much from his time at UCLA. My main point is that it's wrong to conclude he was an abject failure. Good coaches can struggle, and bad coaches can succeed when the stars align. We have to remember that Tedford had the Bears humming from 2003-2007. He wasn't just recruiting against USC. Hopefully, Dorrell has learned that he has to simplify the offense. It seems he'll have to do so out of necessity this year. It wouldn't hurt if we can finally get lucky with a QB. We have been horribly unlucky at that position for a long, long time.
I hated MacIntyre because he coached to lose by two touchdowns in games where we had a chance to win.
buff_fanatic
Well-Known Member
I’m ready to hear some info (rumors) about some of the staff he plans to bring on and keep.
If you have to force a HC to make needed changes he isn’t the right HC.
What kind of recruiting bump did UCLA get from that 10 win season in 2005?
2006: 9th out of 10 in the P10 (11 out of 12 including CU and then G5 Utah).
2007: 10th out of 10 in the P10 (12 out of 12 including CU and then G5 Utah).
SINKRATZ
PhD in Analogy
3 of those guys were promoted to HC after being on staff at the same school (i.e. they were known commodities at their respective schools), the other 2 were incredibly successful HC who were poached for the HC jobs at tOSU and UW. None had a 13 year hiatus from college football with 1 terrible season as a coordinator mixed in so I’m not seeing the parallel here?
I agree.
This says they were #15 nationally in 2006, which would be in line with a #16 finish in the AP poll.
2006 All Teams Football Recruiting Team Rankings
2006 all-teams football recruiting team rankings by Rivals.com
They only had 11 commits in 2007, but with an average of 3.27 stars. That puts them in the same area on a stars per commit basis.
Rivals is only one rating service and isn’t the best. I am using the composite from 247.This says they were #15 nationally in 2006, which would be in line with a #16 finish in the AP poll.
2006 All Teams Football Recruiting Team Rankings
2006 all-teams football recruiting team rankings by Rivals.comn.rivals.com
They only had 11 commits in 2007, but with an average of 3.27 stars. That puts them in the same area on a stars per commit basis.
Big Jim
WTF?
Personalities.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
This is not a sexy hire, at all. Most kids will be scratching their heads at who this guy is. A lot of what goes into recruiting is name recognition and who you’ve coached into NFL players. We saw exactly that with Jason Harris (please don’t leave Jason!) when he said he chose CU because what Tucker has done. This guys floated around as a WR coach mostly and hasn’t been an OC in 21 years outside of his disastrous year at Vanderbilt, disastrous might be stating it lightly.
The biggest thing is does he have any cred to sell these kids? Outside of a WR coach in the NFL? Yikes. I thought Bienemy would be a bad hire but this feels even worse. This smells of desperation and really reaching on RG’s part. I know he didn’t have many options here but a NFL WR coach who hasn’t really been in college consecutively for 13 years?
I hope I’m wrong. I hope I’m wrong because I love CU and I don’t want this **** to continue. But **** man this feels like dark days are ahead, I’m afraid to witness this. If you see the transfer portal start to fill, we’re royally ****ed.
It doesn't necessarily need to be sexy. The key with Dorrell will be personality (he's a very stoic man from what I remember of him when he was here-he's going to need some high energy ACs. He's also going to need a fair amount of assistants who can recruit-Chev, Mick, and Hagan are must keeps. Who does he bring in to fill the needs we have on staff? I really wanted the anti-Melvin. I read this post on 247 (so take this with a total grain of salt) and it pissed me off and made me appreciate this move even more. See below:
"But, just want to clarify that Tucker in no way shape or form thought CU was a sleeping giant.
He wrote a 20 point dossier for lack of a better term on what CU needed to do to win a championship. The problem with it was that 4-5 items would be only realistic at the top 5 programs in the country, 10 items borderline necessary and 5 had some validity. In the hiring process he made it a point to contact EB and share this with him and why he should think twice about getting involved in the CU job.
He was in Plati’s office a lot complaining about the future schedule. He wanted to buy out of the A&M game next year and could not believe we were going to play AFA in Colo Springs in the future. He wanted the Alabama schedule model and play 3 no names at home every year in the non-conference. he could not see straight we were going to FC for the next year as well.
Time will tell on what KD does or does not do at CU and everyone can have a view, not saying anything is a sure deal either way. But, the public Mel Tucker and the behind the scenes Mel Tucker were very different people."
This kind of stuff would never happen under KD. Unlike Melvin, he's been in Boulder already. He has a lot more of an idea for the challenges he's facing here than Melvin ever did, and his personality is what what we need right now. He also understands the importance of scheduling the way RG has. He's a man of character with impeccable integrity, and he knows how to sell Boulder and CU. There's a lot I like about this move-Karl Dorrell is a good football coach, and he can definitely achieve the same results here he got at UCLA.
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I'll take Rivals in 2006 over 247, which started in 2010.
c502cid
Well-Known Member
Please do tell the other options Manhattan. Real options, not just what you think were options. Hey I get why you wouldn't like this hire. I don't like this hire, I just think RG and CU Football got bufued by a first year coach with a losing record in February, and the choices were very very slim. If he would have hired KD in November I'd have personally sharpened the pitchforks.
jizzrag85
Well-Known Member
I guess it depends on what your definition of “sexy” is. He doesn’t have any recent ties to any recent recruits or a background to lean on to show he can get a kid to the NFL. I’m not saying he can’t convince them and he won’t end up being good but I’m very, very skeptical. But he hasn’t been in college in 13 years (barring Vanderbilt) so this is an uphill battle for him.
Their composite index gives a better feel across several indices.
Even using Rivals:
2003: n/r
2004: 8 of 10.
2005: 3 of 10.
2006: 2 of 10.
2007: 8 of 10.
Average rating of 5.25 out of 10 over the only four seasons they list (2003 class was not great, so that helps) is still not a glowing recommendation of his team’s recruiting prowess.
247 bought Scout. Its composite ranking for 2006 is the average of Rivals, Scout and ESPN.
This feels more like a hit by pitch.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
The questions are totally fine-I've got them too. Recruiting and personality (John Hessler said it best-KD doesn't get real fired up about anything) are where I start. I want high energy ACs who can recruit around him. Chiaverini is a must keep. Hagan and Mick are too. Who does KD bring in to fill the holes we have on staff at the moment?
Pretty sure we were at or near the top of the Pac in attendance as a percentage of available seats.
Those numbers are all ****ed up. Only a handful of the recruits are rated. Look at Micah Kia. Rivals has him as UCLA's top recruit. 139 in the nation, 8 at his position. His rating at 247? N/A.
Another example, an average rating of .8550 in 2005 earned them the #21 class in the nation, whereas an average rating of .9208 got them the #91 class in the nation. Those numbers are jacked and I don't see how you can draw any conclusion from them.
It's not helpful to the program to misrepresent Dorrell's recruiting record because you want to win an argument on Allbuffs.
jizzrag85
Well-Known Member
I was saying that days ago when I said we were ****ed with spring ball and not having a HC in place. Who are we going to hire as assistants? NFL guys? Yikes. Midnight Mel got a pot of gold and still hired the same QC guys from Georgia and Alabama.
Another big concern of mine is it’s not like it was 15 years ago. Budgets are huge, staffs are huge, every school has QC guys. ****-er got that, does Dorrell?
Did our former coach tell you that or is it some rumor you read on a message board?
I am not misrepresenting anything. The composite ranking numbers are the composite ranking numbers. I linked the source. You can read them for yourself.
Even using the Rivals only metric, mediocre recruiting is not good enough. You think it is. We disagree.
I didn't say it was irrelevant, just pretty low on the list. Winning is obviously most important, and I've see little correlation between winning and "hot" coaching hires that excite a fan base.
I have been absorbing this one and trying to understand the hire. Just does not match up with what the AD has been preaching for the last several years. I understand the out of cycle cluster we were left with by Tucker and Saban’s meddling.
RG started by swinging for the fence and played a great cloak and dagger game with Sark by blowing huge smoke in the media with planted stories about Calhoun who was never a serious candidate. What has mebaffled is what looks like a complete turtle in the process to move from going after Sark to settling for KD. He is the antithesis of Sark and Tucker. No personality. No recent (or really none at all) college connections or a coaching line to pull assistants from. Nothing to suggest he will be successful at the college level at all.
Did RG inquire about other high profile assistants at P5 programs? Is CU’s rep now so trashed and low that he could not get them to listen? Were they just try8ng to get this done and move on? Bottom line it looks like they just went to the bottom line and offered a guy that they knew would be a safe yes and got it over with.
What bums me out most is that I think we just set the program back again. We will be right back to looking for a coach in 3 to 5 years with absolutely no improvement on the results we are seeing today.
I hope his offer is relatively short, 3 years, and I really do not care if he has a buyout if hired away. I want our buyout if we fire him to be almost zero. I know that is notrealistic but it needs to be structure to provide security to KD only if he meets certain performance metrics.
I wish I was more positive and onboard with this hire. I just do not see it.
RG started by swinging for the fence and played a great cloak and dagger game with Sark by blowing huge smoke in the media with planted stories about Calhoun who was never a serious candidate. What has mebaffled is what looks like a complete turtle in the process to move from going after Sark to settling for KD. He is the antithesis of Sark and Tucker. No personality. No recent (or really none at all) college connections or a coaching line to pull assistants from. Nothing to suggest he will be successful at the college level at all.
Did RG inquire about other high profile assistants at P5 programs? Is CU’s rep now so trashed and low that he could not get them to listen? Were they just try8ng to get this done and move on? Bottom line it looks like they just went to the bottom line and offered a guy that they knew would be a safe yes and got it over with.
What bums me out most is that I think we just set the program back again. We will be right back to looking for a coach in 3 to 5 years with absolutely no improvement on the results we are seeing today.
I hope his offer is relatively short, 3 years, and I really do not care if he has a buyout if hired away. I want our buyout if we fire him to be almost zero. I know that is notrealistic but it needs to be structure to provide security to KD only if he meets certain performance metrics.
I wish I was more positive and onboard with this hire. I just do not see it.
Please compare:
Half of the 2006 recruits received a rating of N/A from 247. How is that info remotely helpful? The original question was how the 2005 season helped recruiting. The most reliable information I can find is that it gave them the #15 class in the country which is line with their end of season AP ranking.