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Pac 12 network / direct tv (PACN now on fuboTV streaming)
- Thread starter absinthe
- Start date
Wow, your hate for DTV runs strong. Your descriptions of it remind me of a rapist/murder/cannibal combination character in a horror flick. I really liked DTV when I had it, but it was time to move on, and I have Comcast again.
I'm not sure where you got your info about channels you pay for getting pulled, as I had it for 5 years and never had that happen (from ribbon scrolls I've seen on tv, that seems to usually be Dish). Anyway, I preferred DTV, but not enough to keep me from finally switching, however, it took my favorite NFL team really sucking to do so.
I don't think DTV is special enough to get the fanboy treatment, and I don't think that it is. It's just really hated by some like you, and I don't have a problem with that, as they should've been on board with the Pac-12 long ago, so screw em.
Can someone translate digger for me
Idot Buff
Guest
SD Buff
Club Member
Where I'll agree with you is Scott totally over estimated the PAC fan bases. He should have known PAC fans weren't going to switch and give him the leverage needed to push a deal.
Instead PAC fans proved DirecTV right and took the freebies, didn't affect them hardly at all.
It's unfortunate PAC fans think we should devalue the product even more. Having a rate card nearly half the B1G and SEC. Instead they think we should have bent over.
I don't understand that position but ha e learned to accept it. PAC will never match the other big 2 dollar for dollar and I am starting to realize just how massive the gap is getting. Hell, Kansas State made more from their Tier 3 TV rights and a lot less content than USC. Everyone in the Big 12 did. All because PAC fans didn't give the conference leverage
If DTV was offering a good deal for the PAC don't you think Scott would have taken it already. His job is to do what is best for the league and it's members, I'm fine with giving him the ability to make decisions that do that.
Anyone who thinks that Direct has better picture quality than Dish isn't dealing in reality. Most of the programming on both is coming through on 720p, each has a couple of feeds that run 1080i (which ends up with very close to the same picture quality as 720p. Neither is running any sports programming on 1080p.
I have compared picture quality with friends and family who have DTV, my Dish quality is at least equal if not better.
Realistically it simply comes down to two questions. Are you so tied into the NFL that you want Sunday ticket and are you willing to pay a higher price for programming on DTV?
Anyone who thinks that Direct has better picture quality than Dish isn't dealing in reality. Most of the programming on both is coming through on 720p, each has a couple of feeds that run 1080i (which ends up with very close to the same picture quality as 720p. Neither is running any sports programming on 1080p.
I have compared picture quality with friends and family who have DTV, my Dish quality is at least equal if not better.
Realistically it simply comes down to two questions. Are you so tied into the NFL that you want Sunday ticket and are you willing to pay a higher price for programming on DTV?
It means declining revenue per school. TV subscriptions have peaked as I understand it and are now starting to decline with cord cutters. LS wanted the P12N in the standard offering to insure every household among millions paid us a ~$1.
As an example Disney's stock got beat up a few weeks back because ESPNs subsciber costs are declining due to cord cutting. ESPN has billions contractually obligated to others in the form of payments for the right to air. Those deals can't be cut or redone. So, the fear is the cord cutting combined with the fixed contract costs could hurt ESPN and Disney's bottom line. Even though they get $5 of every house hold.
If we weren't wholly independent wed have to give half the revenue to the partner. The P12N laid out the costs and set up fees so they wouldn't have to share the revenue stream with someone else. All the other conferences used ESPN, Fox, et al., that provided the talent, studio, equipment, ad sales, and accounting departments. But they are giving up some large percentage of the revenue likely after overhead is subtracted.
Since my provider is DirecTV that ain't happening. However, my son's friend has Comcast. Just sayin'. Oh, and my FIL has no internet. So I'll have to go LTE.
I agree with you and Buffs were always my greatest passion and I still waste money coming to see them every year. But the product just is not worth losing the NFL games.
If they were still a Top 25 team or close I would have Dish.
EddieCrowder
Well-Known Member
To clarify the DTV is a "superior product" many of you seem to be bogged down on the "picture quality" issue. Its the product it has nothing to do with picture. If some of you would take Larry's dick out of your mouth long enough to look at who is receiving the most money you might stop blowing him continually and realize this model he used is failed. Think about the one comment in this thread that truly shows this. Kst made more cash then USC,.... USC in the largest market, with no NFL team to compete with and Kst in little Manhattan KS made more money from the joke Big XII's TV deal. But hey Larry has a plan right ? the plan that continues the lack of exposure, terrible start times, and thus the second class view the rest of the country has of the PAC 12. The same plan that will see the continued decline in revenue, and widening the gap between the PAC and the other P5's. What a bunch of geniuses you boy's are, I always thought the idea was to get the biggest bank, most viewers, best ratings. when all along its just about making sure Larry was / is right.
jobuff
Club Member
That remains to be seen depending on the fees they end up agreeing with DTV. What you need to understand is that DTV lowballed the offer to P12N because it knows that the P12N owns the network fully. Let me ask you this, do you have any idea what the offer was in terms of money?????? I know many here are just worried about being able to see the games. This is a business and there is a strategy they need to play. No one here is saying they are a genius. My point is that we need to see how it plays out. If ATT gives the P12N their quote it could end up catching up in revenue by more than it would have if they would have bent over and taken it from behind (as you hope he would have done). You seem to already reached your conclusion that he should have bent over.
EddieCrowder
Well-Known Member
I agree with most of that but, and its a big but,... In the case of DTV they dont need the PAC, and now their owner, ATT is the one trying to low ball the offer which does not bode well for the future where the "title sponsor" is concerned. The price is never the same for everyone for the same products, DTV can get the PAC in places they HAVE to be commerical establishments that the others just cant offer. Everyone thinks I argue this because I have DTV and cant see the Buffs. When in fact I have watched every game in HD this about exposure, which in turn equals money. We are losing ground yearly, the gap gets wider on a weekly basis and when your PARTNER is telling you "ahhh NO" you have a problem
The fact is that on a national basis the PAC isn't as valuable as the SEC, the Big 10 or because of Texas even the B12. The league exist in a region that is not college football crazy, the fans do not have the allegiances to their teams, they don't "take ownership" like you see in other parts of the country.
Scott cannot just bow down and kiss the feet of Direct. Not only would it not make sense to give away product but it could end up actually costing money. The other carriers protect themselves. They include provisions in their contracts that provide for cost relief if another major carrier gets a substantially better deal. What this would mean is that if the PAC gives Direct a break they then have to give a comparable break to Dish, to Comcast, and to the other carriers. This could end up costing more than they actually get from Direct.
PAC 12 teams actually end up with more network revenue that SEC schools do because the SEC gave up a big chunk of equity to ESPN.
Both sides are playing hardball, that's their job. In the end they will figure out how to make the numbers work and a deal will be done, it is just a question of when.
Personally it won't matter to me because I refuse to subsidize the NFL package through Direct when I can get everything I want for much less through Dish.
Scott cannot just bow down and kiss the feet of Direct. Not only would it not make sense to give away product but it could end up actually costing money. The other carriers protect themselves. They include provisions in their contracts that provide for cost relief if another major carrier gets a substantially better deal. What this would mean is that if the PAC gives Direct a break they then have to give a comparable break to Dish, to Comcast, and to the other carriers. This could end up costing more than they actually get from Direct.
PAC 12 teams actually end up with more network revenue that SEC schools do because the SEC gave up a big chunk of equity to ESPN.
Both sides are playing hardball, that's their job. In the end they will figure out how to make the numbers work and a deal will be done, it is just a question of when.
Personally it won't matter to me because I refuse to subsidize the NFL package through Direct when I can get everything I want for much less through Dish.
EddieCrowder
Well-Known Member
MtnBuff I think your position is closer to mine then you think, I agree with most of what your saying but the solution to me might be quite different. I had all but ignored anything that was said recently in this thread until the merger. Then the news starts to trickle out that ATT is now taking the DTV side and saying "your price is to high" the only way to grow is through exposure, the revenue is shrinking, with exposure it grows. If the PAC loses ATT and they decide lets just go with the NFL as well. The price they want now will be even smaller. Larry has backed himself into a corner, its a giant "penis showing game" and theirs is bigger
SD Buff
Club Member
Love it how you continue to brag about being a thief. Great job.
Since it was me who mentioned this, I wrote out two separate novels responding. Going over every detail of the contracts and revenue streams of the Big 12 and PAC in case you didn't really understand. But both were way too long.
btw- the conference TV contracts
The PAC (12 years @ 3 billion) averages 20.8 million per school for 44 football games and 68 basketball games.
The Big 12 (13 years @2.6 billion) averages 20 million per school for 61 football games and 100-105 basketball games.
Don't want to look back at this thread - can you give me the cliffs or bullet points on your issue with the model and/or your solutions?
dude, you are the one who posited that DTV was the superior product with superior picture. When you got torn up on it, you ran from it like the thief you are.
Now, if you just want to bash Larry for not taking the quick cash and thinking long term, that's certainly your prerogative, but at least now we know what you are really whining about. Or you changed the debate because you got beat.
Nothing groundbreaking.
http://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/index.ssf/2015/09/thursday_morning_news_notes_li_19.html
http://registerguard.com/rg/sports/...c-12-net-nearing-a-deal-with-directv.html.csp
Should be beautiful weather tomorrow. Go Buffs!
http://www.oregonlive.com/collegefootball/index.ssf/2015/09/thursday_morning_news_notes_li_19.html
http://registerguard.com/rg/sports/...c-12-net-nearing-a-deal-with-directv.html.csp
Should be beautiful weather tomorrow. Go Buffs!
It's ok. So long as the myopic guys like Eddie Crowder are running the other conferences, LS is going to come out on top in the long run. Not only (as Mtn posted) are the schools in the Pac12 receiving similar amounts of money for the current contracts, but Pac 12 owns the content and the network. Wait until 10 years from now when the SEC, Big XII, et al are tied to the broadcast networks' and providers' sinking ships AND THEN have to invest in the infrastructure of their own networks. That's when the P12 is really going to come out on top.
EddieCrowder
Well-Known Member
Damn right I brag about it because it is not illegal, funny thing is you clowns would be surprised how many of us here actually do this. The difference is I dont give a **** what you pompous ****s think, others do. Spin what you want how you want and the dollars and cents will continue to shrink. ATT/DTV has the biggest dick in the game, they are going to get what they want at the price they want. Or Larry will be shopping for a new title sponsor, he has no leverage. I do however offer my congratulations on your blind faith, I hope I am wrong and that the PAC brings the Giant to its knees. On the other hand that only happens in fairy tales and the reality will be the giant always wins.
interesting legal opinion there. You have any support for that?
Deleted member 807
Guest
Has anyone ever been to a Comcast store?
Has anyone ever gone to Dish store?
Of course not, because TV providers don't have retail stores...until now.
If you want to talk to somebody about DirecTV live and in person, there is someone you can visit at any one of AT&T's thousands of retail locations that occupy prime retail space in most communities from coast to coast.
They are just typically in nicer, more educated areas where money and price are less of an issue.
Indeed. At the fact that if a blizzard is raging outside on a football weekend, my Comcast works like a charm while your screen looks about the same as the window outside with DTV.
Actually, I've had far fewer issues with the satellite than I ever had with cable. Some moron runs over the cable with a root-tiller and it takes Comcast two days to figure out where the problem is. The only time I've ever had issues with the satellite is during big rain storms. Snow doesn't seem to be a problem for whatever reason.
That aside, I think we can all agree that DTV offers nothing special in terms of picture quality over any of it's competition, satellite or cable.
That aside, I think we can all agree that DTV offers nothing special in terms of picture quality over any of it's competition, satellite or cable.
SD Buff
Club Member
Kodi/xbmc itself is not illegal. Streaming the PAC 12 Network on the software sure is.
Again, I am not going to read the previous 20 pages to understand why you're throwing such an epic hissy fit. But will ask a second time - what is your solution? Scott's heaviest leverage was PAC fans forcing carriage by changing providers. Collectively, we didn't do it. So where I'll agree he probably should have known that about the PAC fanbases in advance - what would have been your solution?
And Captain Obvious point here - you don't know what is going on in negotiations and/or what the final deal is going to be.
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