Ranking of CU's Recruiting Class

[89BUFF89]

I think if we're being honest we have to hope that Embree and company's eye for talent, coaching, change in culture, etc. is the difference because until we can start winning and going to bowls we are not going to get commitments from a ton of 4/5* guys. We have to hope they grab and coach up 3* guys that can play like 4/5* guys and make the difference. Once we start winning and going to bowls we'll get our fair share of higher ranked studs. It's easier to have mostly 4/5* guys and a few misses than when you have just a few and most miss like under Hawkins.

 

[Daaah]

I think if we're being honest we have to hope that Embree and company's eye for talent, coaching, change in culture, etc. is the difference because until we can start winning and going to bowls we are not going to get commitments from a ton of 4/5* guys. We have to hope they grab and coach up 3* guys that can play like 4/5* guys and make the difference. Once we start winning and going to bowls we'll get our fair share of higher ranked studs. It's easier to have mostly 4/5* guys and a few misses than when you have just a few and most miss like under Hawkins.

Why can't they get 4 and 5* guys? Hawk's staff was able to do it in the years following the scandal.

 

[Quattro]

Why can't they get 4 and 5* guys? Hawk's staff was able to do it in the years following the scandal.

Hawkins got the 4*'s and 5*'s after going to a bowl game (sans Ryan Miller who I believe was a CU legacy). We haven't sniffed a bowl in 4 years now. It's not impossible to get 4*'s and 5*'s in when you haven't gone to a bowl game in four years but it's very tough.

 

[DrunkRalphie]

Why can't they get 4 and 5* guys? Hawk's staff was able to do it in the years following the scandal.

And how many of those guys actually worked out? Miller has been a disappointment compared to his scout ranking. Katoa was a head case that never played.

Hawks' most successful guys turned out to be 3* guys like Smith.

 

[Daaah]

And how many of those guys actually worked out? Miller has been a disappointment compared to his scout ranking. Katoa was a head case that never played.

Hawks' most successful guys turned out to be 3* guys like Smith.

We're talking about recruiting 4/5*. There is no excuse. If Hawk's staff could do it, the current staff should be able to do it. I don't care how they turned out. And Miller was named to an all american team. That's good enough for me.

 

[Quattro]

We're talking about recruiting 4/5*. There is no excuse. If Hawk's staff could do it, the current staff should be able to do it. I don't care how they turned out. And Miller was named to an all american team. That's good enough for me.

I like how you ignore the fact that we've won 16 games since we last went to a bowl game and since the '12 recruits have been in high school and haven't come close to a bowl game.

 

[Buffnik]

I like how you ignore the fact that we've won 16 games since we last went to a bowl game and since the '12 recruits have been in high school and haven't come close to a bowl game.

You guys should listen to tini on stuff like this. He's the right age.

Tini, when you decided to go to CU did you do it with the feeling that you were going to a good football school? (I understand that this gets modified a bit because of your dad being a Buff fan and you getting that growing up.)

 

[Daaah]

I like how you ignore the fact that we've won 16 games since we last went to a bowl game and since the '12 recruits have been in high school and haven't come close to a bowl game.

I'm not ignoring that fact. Hawk coached that team to a bowl game. That's part of the whole deal, as hawk would say.

 

[Quattro]

You guys should listen to tini on stuff like this. He's the right age.

Tini, when you decided to go to CU did you do it with the feeling that you were going to a good football school? (I understand that this gets modified a bit because of your dad being a Buff fan and you getting that growing up.)

At the time no, but I knew that we have tradition of being a good football school in the past and the belief that we will be back at the top soon, but I knew that because that was engrained in my head from the day I was born. The recruits for the most part don't have that, just pressure from kids in their high school thinking that CU has always been that way. Here's an example from my best friend who has lived in Colorado his whole life and goes to CU. We were heading back from the WSU (might have been Cal) and he asked me if we've ever been good and I said yeah before we hired Hawkins we were next in line for 700 wins and would be top 15 in all time wins, he looked at me like I told him the most blasphemous statement he's ever heard. Kids my age have a short memory and don't realize that we are not far removed from being a top 10 team. It sucks but that's the way it is.

 

[BlackNGold]

We're talking about recruiting 4/5*. There is no excuse. If Hawk's staff could do it, the current staff should be able to do it. I don't care how they turned out. And Miller was named to an all american team. That's good enough for me.

I love revisionist history...The 2010 class had one 4 Star - Paul Richardson who actually signed an LOI with UCLA - we were able to pick him up because we were one of the few teams that was willing and had space. The 2009 class had one 5 * (Kasa) who was a local kid and decided he wanted to stay home. So Hawkins staff was not exactly killing it after his luster wore off.

What you do not realize is that Hawkins killed every CU pipeline there was and all of that has to be rebuilt.

Recruiting is going better than I actually expected. Most of the kids are solid looking prospects which is a step up from where we were the last few years. CU is still in on some highly sought after players.

I look at teams like Wisconsin - look at their 2007, 2008, 2009,2010,2011 classes. They are loaded with 2 and 3 star players...they bring in a lot of solid players coach them up and win with them. Now this year they are cleaning up on 4 star players. CU has to get solid players into the program and plug the holes first, build a track record of success (momentum or what ever you want to call it) -obtain on the field success and then move recruiting up a notch.

 

[Duff Man]

Just so I am clear, when can I expect the coaches to:

A. Win games
B. Land 4* players

The way most of you guys talk, I might need to hold out until about 2015.

 

[BlackNGold]

Just so I am clear, when can I expect the coaches to:

A. Win games
B. Land 4* players

The way most of you guys talk, I might need to hold out until about 2015.

1. We will win games when the defensive holes are plugged and we get better QB play...the Buffs have struggle at QB since Klatt left. I am hoping to see some of that this coming season.
2. I expect that you will see two 4 star players this cycle.

Things would be going quicker if Bohn had fired Hawkins a year earlier.

 

[Duff Man]

Thank you for at least attaching expectations to your posts. I think it should be a reasonable expectation to land at least one 4* player this class (pretty confident it will happen too).

 

[buffsyko]

Just so I am clear, when can I expect the coaches to:

A. Win games
B. Land 4* players

The way most of you guys talk, I might need to hold out until about 2015.

Sounds familiar, like it's 2007 all over again. I have confidence this staff will not repeat the previous 5 years.

 

[Darth Snow]

Thank you for at least attaching expectations to your posts. I think it should be a reasonable expectation to land at least one 4* player this class (pretty confident it will happen too).

2-3 is a minimum. Less is a serious disappointment.

 

[Buffnik]

I'm going to re-post something I worked damn hard on earlier this year:

Hired in December of 2006, Jim Harbaugh had a very similar situation as Jon Embree (hired December 2010) with a partial class to pull together right off the bat. Stanford's previous 5 seasons leading into Harbaugh's 1st recruiting class in 2007 had been (recruiting class that followed listed in parentheses):

2002: 2-9 (#25 Rivals class)
2003: 4-7 (outside top 50)
2004: 4-7 (#41)
2005: 5-6 (outside top 50)
2006: 1-11

That 2007 transition class was also ranked outside the Top 50 on Rivals.

In the 2007 season, the team had a 4-8 record that included a signature win over USC that gave credibility to what Harbaugh was selling. This only translated into the #50 class for 2008 (remember, the big recruiting bump for on-field performance is offset by a year). That class only included two 4* prospects, but one of them was Andrew Luck. They got their QB to jumpstart things.

In 2008, Stanford went 5-7 without a real signature win. But the record was improving. They were able to pull in the #20 class for 2009.

Then in 2009 they kind of broke through, going 8-5 with signature wins over both Oregon and USC (finishing with a loss in the Sun Bowl). The 2010 class came in ranked #26 on Rivals.

As we know, 2010 saw one of the greatest Stanford seasons ever: 12-1 with a Orange Bowl win and a #4 finish in the polls. This was followed with the #22 Rivals class for 2011.

Now to compare that with CU.

Prior to the Embree hire, the last 5 seasons and their accompanying Rivals recruiting classes were as follows:

2006: 2-10 (#32 Rivals class)
2007: 6-7, including an Independence Bowl loss to Alabama (#15)
2008: 5-7 (#48)
2009: 3-9 (outside top 50)
2010: 5-7

The 2011 transition class was also ranked outside the top 50.

Obviously, we don't have a 2011 season to look at yet [edit: 3-10 record with a strong finish with a nationally televised road win] and our recruiting class is not final. But Embree, like Harbaugh, landed a 4* QB [since rated high 3* but an Elite 11 finalist plus we got a transfer from the starting QB in the Army All-American game from 3 years ago - Connor Wood] who was a top target right off the bat.

Will Dillon [or Wood] be the kind of player Luck has been? Probably not.

But will CU do significantly better than Harbaugh's 50th ranked 1st full class? Almost certainly yes.

Beyond that, it's a question of whether this season generates the excitement around the program that Harbaugh's initial 4-8 campaign did for him. We're starting from a somewhat higher baseline than Stanford was and they give us a blueprint as a case study for how to win. Embree shares a lot of commonalities with Harbaugh from a philosophical standpoint (featuring TE and FB, identity as a running team, focus on discipline and toughness... old school football).

I'm not saying that 12-1 is going to happen in Year 4, but it's not out of the question if Dillon [or Wood] develops into a top QB. And we can certainly hope to surpass the records from Harbaugh's first three seasons (4-8, 5-7, 8-5). CU has also shown that when it is winning or even seen as "on the rise" that it is able to pull recruiting classes that are better than the 20-26 range Stanford is pulling at its current high point.

After the 2001 Big 12 Championship, we pulled the #10 class in 2002. 2003 yielded the #19 class. Then we had the "scandal" years with classes in the 40s from 2004-2006. As stated previously, the coaching change that followed along with the momentum from making a bowl game resulted in #32 and #15 classes, respectively. While Stanford's high point result is classes in the 20s every year, CU can realistically expect to be pulling classes ranked in the top 20 once we have any momentum.

It starts with the 2011 season and 2012 class. We need to see a top 35 class, hope that we got the right guy with Dillon [and/or Wood], and have a signature win and/or make a bowl game [we really can't say we got a signature win]. If we take care of business, we will quickly be on our way back to where we were and where we belong as a Top 25 all-time program.

 

[Burrito]

Jesus, now it's even more boring.






























Nice work.

 

[ScottyBuff]

So Embree will lead us to a BCS Bowl game in 2014, then leave to be the next HC for the Denver Broncos and EB will then lead us to a 12-1 season and a BCS berth the next year?

 

[Darth Snow]

So Embree will lead us to a BCS Bowl game in 2014, then leave to be the next HC for the Denver Broncos and EB will then lead us to a 12-1 season and a BCS berth the next year?

I'm ok with that.

 

[boydbuff]

I'm guessing our 2012 class ranking is going to be in the 20's the way we are headed! With Crawley joining and some of other commits getting bumped up plus we still may have a few surprise additions.

 

[Jaximus]

I'm guessing our 2012 class ranking is going to be in the 20's the way we are headed! With Crawley joining and some of other commits getting bumped up plus we still may have a few surprise additions.

Regardless of our final rank. I am very pleased with the class this year. Our coaches have address our biggest needs. Almost everyone of our players were recruited by BCS schools, so we know they'll BELONG in the PAC12. And I trust our staff to develop this talent and maximize their potential. This snowball just gets bigger and bigger as we pick up momentum for 2013. Go Buffs!

 

[Buffnik]

I'm guessing our 2012 class ranking is going to be in the 20's the way we are headed! With Crawley joining and some of other commits getting bumped up plus we still may have a few surprise additions.

I think in the 30s.

 

[sackman]

I think in the 30s.

I'm thinking this as well, and I'm totally fine with it. As has been pointed out many times, a 3-10 team with a recruiting class in the 30's is quite an accomplishment. And I know you know this, but the difference between a class in the 20's and a class in the 30's is probably one guy.

 

[Buffnik]

I'm thinking this as well, and I'm totally fine with it. As has been pointed out many times, a 3-10 team with a recruiting class in the 30's is quite an accomplishment. And I know you know this, but the difference between a class in the 20's and a class in the 30's is probably one guy.

Yeah. A big difference between this class and some higher-rated classes (including some of our own in the recent past) is that it's not top heavy. There's no one I can point to and not be able to say either "solid prospect" or "definite upside if we can develop him". I couldn't say that the past 7 years or so.

 

[DBT]

Signing close to 28 guys helps. Next year we won't have that advantage.

 

[J.R. Ewing]

We're going to have to be pretty darn selective.

 

[MtnBuff]

The real measure of a class is does it improve your program.

Hawk left this team seriously short of PAC12 level athletes. Based on the reported offers virtually every kid in this class had offers from other AQ level programs. It could be assumed from this that these guys are likely then to be the level of athlete we need to at least compete, a major step forward.

Not a lot of kids in this class who we are beating Utah State and Idaho for, much better to be beating Arizona, Washington, and Tennessee for kids. Even without the star types this class looks much more solid top to bottom than recent classes have been, if we can add a couple of star guys so much the better.

 

[Duff Man]

The next step is winning more battles against PAC-12 schools.

 

[sackman]

The next step is winning more battles against PAC-12 schools.

Agreed. While I think it would be a lot to ask to win many battles against USC, it's not too much to win a few against ASU, Cal, Stanford, UO, UCLA and Washington. And yes, we did win a few against those schools, but we lost more than we won.

 

[BehindEnemyLines]

I'm happy with the class so far. The staff has addressed needs while upgrading athleticism/speed.

Now, hold on to each and every one of these young guns !!