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Reflections on the Jon Embree Era
- Thread starter Buffnik
- Start date
Your post is useless
I think you are minimizing the importance of the fact the firing was "mishandled". Sports Illustrated and others said he was "stabbed in the back" and every person connected with college football learned how CU was capable of treating people.
Add the fact he only got 2 years to the mistreatment, and of course some percentage of people believe race was a factor. Racism is primarily unconscious and certainly no one can say it did not play a role.
Who knows how much this may have influenced the decisions of potential coaches and how others see the university.
The fact Embree stopped being the coach is something I have no problem with. The way it was done was a disgrace to the once-proud CU traditions of respect and fair-play.
the fact self-centered idiots (and there were many here) stooped to calling one of the greatest Buffs ever ("Buffs for Life" is huge) "water boy" and the like, because it made them feel better, was disgusting and none of those jerks are truly CU fans. I was a fan back when CU played Alabama in 1969 and the black players were cursed and mistreated. One can imagine those fans yelling at the coach, "hey, water boy!"
Embree came back to the place he loved best and gave his all. To be mocked, ridiculed and stabbed in the back was one of the CU's worst moments.
I hope the man is doing well.
Add the fact he only got 2 years to the mistreatment, and of course some percentage of people believe race was a factor. Racism is primarily unconscious and certainly no one can say it did not play a role.
Who knows how much this may have influenced the decisions of potential coaches and how others see the university.
The fact Embree stopped being the coach is something I have no problem with. The way it was done was a disgrace to the once-proud CU traditions of respect and fair-play.
the fact self-centered idiots (and there were many here) stooped to calling one of the greatest Buffs ever ("Buffs for Life" is huge) "water boy" and the like, because it made them feel better, was disgusting and none of those jerks are truly CU fans. I was a fan back when CU played Alabama in 1969 and the black players were cursed and mistreated. One can imagine those fans yelling at the coach, "hey, water boy!"
Embree came back to the place he loved best and gave his all. To be mocked, ridiculed and stabbed in the back was one of the CU's worst moments.
I hope the man is doing well.
I generally agree.
The two exceptions, of course, are uniform threads and soccer threads, in which we have a moral obligation to save people from themselves.
Your use of "water boy" in this context is more demonstrative of your race-centered world. You fail to understand context, because you only see one option.
Nobody called Coach Embrue "water boy". The term was "water bottle", and it was related to his remarks on that topic of (wait for it)...water bottles. You should probably back off your narrative on that, since it's both offensive and wrong. Furthermore, it exposes your parochialism.
I've got to believe that if Butch Jones was black, you would chastise posters on this board for calling him "food cart". Oooooooh! So racist!
And while I agree that everybody has blindspots, and people exhibit subtle racist and sexist behaviors despite their best intentions otherwise, I think he on-product field was sufficiently bad in this case to assume that the fan base would have reacted similarly, regardless of race. Please don't trot our MacIntyre as evidence that we wouldn't, because the broader situations are quite different.
aik
Well-Known Member
There hasn't been much good news for football and either basketball program this winter so we're understandably beaten down and devoid of morale on this board. However, I wish we could make a better effort to stop discouraging people from contributing to the content of this board by plastering their works with "who cares" feedback. While we play the coach and recruit waiting game during football's offseason there is often little fresh news of value to enjoy for someone who, like probably many of you, checks AllBuffs as often as I do looking to be informed and entertained. Here we have a respected poster in Nik who spends hours out of his day working for free to give us something to think about and discuss regarding our favorite team. His posts are not impulsive. They do not stand on conjecture. And while there are positions he took that I may not agree with, I appreciate that he gave us more angles on a past coaching era whose narratives benefit from an additional year of history from the last offseason we debated the Embree regime. There are other fan boards that are unreadable because they are overrun with posters caught in a flame war with each other who actively dismiss arguments outright rather than take a counter position and defend it. That's beyond lazy. This board is great because we are not like those boards. Yet. Let's keep this a thinking fan's place.
Lt.Col.FrankSlade
Well-Known Member
**** Embree and **** you. His name is "Water Bottle".
Since you think the way Water Bottle was fired was a "disgrace" but you "have no problem" with the fact that he was fired -- please enlighten us as to how he should have been fired.
Mr. Babar
I have no elephant books
Nailed it. Nothing racist about the name - what about calling the ex-Rammie coach "Sparkles"? Would that be racist if he was black?
I do agree that we shouldn't bash Embree hard - the dude tried to do the best he could and was over-matched with the X's and O's. That's one Bohn for hiring him. People tend to think they are capable of more than they can handle and take opportunities - the interviewers need to recognize when someone may not be a great fit.
Had Bohn mandated that having experienced coordinators (at least one) was a condition, then hiring Embree makes more sense. Hindsight is 20/20 - I thought Embree/EB was going to be a great hire at the time.
Umm honestly, I could care less. All I know is **** isn't working like it should. Fix it, we'll be patient if we have direction.
Mr. Babar
I have no elephant books
This post is useless as well... I am responding with a useless post identifying another useless post utilized to call my original post useless; oh no, we may be getting trapped in an infinite loop of uselessness... to infinity and beyond!
Hypocrite
Lt.Col.FrankSlade
Well-Known Member
Mr. Babar
I have no elephant books
We are both guilty of the crime. Haha. Oh well, we hire a DC yet?
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
My recollection of Embree will always be his sideline demeanor and post game pouts. Those traits did not instill confidence in me that he had the patience to get things turned around. There were a lot of red flags that things could spiral out of control into an abyss that would destroy us and take even many more years to recover from.
Yes. MacIntyre is much more Dick Vermeil than Tom Landry.
He was fired after fielding the worst team in CU history. I fail to see how that equates to being stabbed in the back. He was given an opportunity (wrongly, IMO) to hold a press conference after the dismissal. Fact is, he never should have been hired in the first place. Firing him was CUs only option, and he was the one controlling the narrative at that point. If there was a mistake made, it was allowing that to happen.
And I'd love to see that SI link. I'm guessing that if anything, they quoted somebody (perhaps Embree himself) when the "stabbed in the back" comment was published.
This, one thousand times.
Embree was actually given more consideration in his firing than most coaches get. He was given the choice if he wanted to address the media or not, he was given access to the players well past the firing date. The AD was complementary towards him right up to the end.
The disgrace was how he responded. He was the one who lashed out angrily, he was the one who pulled the race card, he was the one who refused to recognize that the program was falling apart around him and he was falling apart with it.
People can talk about respect. What kind of respect did he show his 18-23 yo players much less the fans and supporters with his game long and practice long cascades of profanity and insults. How much respect did he give when he divided the team into "his guys" and "the other guys" and treated each group completely differently.
I still respect Embree as a great Buff and know that his heart is still pumping black and gold blood. That may have been a part of the reason he took the firing so hard.
That doesn't change the fact that anyone with eyes could have seen that the trajectory of the program was heading towards depths never seen before and he didn't have a clue how to stop it. His firing wasn't because he was black, it was because he and his staff couldn't handle the job.
The disgrace was not in his firing but in how he responded to it. I hope that one day we can all get past both his performance as coach and how he handled his firing and welcome him back to the Buff family but that unfortunately is going to take some action on his part.
He needs to keep it together a bit more going forward. Fine with a young team to show some fire, but a coach needs to show more composure for a team trying to break through.
I agree. Based on his comments after Oregon State, he agrees.
That and figuring out what the hell happens in third quarters would go a long way in improving MacIntyre's game day coaching. The fact the team didn't quit (which definitely happened with regularity under Hawkins and Embree) was a good first step.
It seemed that they finally started figuring out the end of half & end of game issues of wearing down in those situations. (Or maybe MacIntyre just got ridiculously conservative in order to cover the issue.) But coming out of the locker room flat is a major thing to address for 2015. Sefo needs to come out calm and steady, but the rest of the team needs to light its hair on fire.
What must occur to get Embree's smiling face off the front page for Allbuffs? Can I make a donation to Allbuffs or something?
Agree. He needs to tone it down and handle his post game interviews better. I believe he is making the effort and was much better.
Buffskier
Club Member
FIFY... C'mon - there are hundreds of threads on this!
I could give a ****.
I think the biggest question right now when considering the past and the improvements that have been made, how close is CU to having the structure in place that we don't need to make a "savior" hire of a superstar coach in order to be successful on the field?