Was that the same game Cormier blew his knee out? I think it was.
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Rocky Mountain Showdown - News & Updates
- Thread starter Buffnik
- Start date
You really think Wyoming moves the needle with CU fans like CSU does?
Glad to see it moving back to campus. It looks like we're moving back to CO shortly, but I won't attend the games in Denver because both fan bases act like absolute ****heads. I'm not judging because I used to be one of the most egregious ****heads, but man I can't deal with that anymore (let alone subject my kids to it).
I guess I haven't experienced what you have. I've had no issues at that game. That isn't to say it's all roses either.
No, I don't.
What does that have to do with what I posted?
I'm pretty certain CSU needs this series a whole lot more than we do. We should be getting that extra home game. We hold the cards, not CSU. There are lots of options out there that aren't named "CSU".
Deleted member 807
Guest
Rediculous assessment.
Many CU fans have a once in a lifetime opportunity to visit the AFA campus. These same CU fans may be current or former service members, or have relatives who served, and/or honor our soldiers, marines, sailors and airmen on Memorial Day, Veterans Day, 4th of July, and other occations where respect and dignity are implied. I've even seen CU fans take off their hat at the beginning of games in Folsom for the singing of the national anthem.
The world has changed since CU and AFA clashed due to Viet Nam war tensions in the early 70's.
Wyoming would garner the same 26k fans at Folsom that show up for Nichols State. CSU will always be a sellout, which is why CU has motivation to keep the series going, even if it's not 2-1. There have been some solid explanations in this thread, but it's as if you don't read.
If anything, you seem to be arguing for a 2-1 yourself. We get more people in the stands, and we have the leverage. Why not push for the 2-1?
SINKRATZ
PhD in Analogy
Who do you think is going to give us a 2-1? Certainly no one that is more compelling for fans than CSU. We can't even get a 2-1 with Hawaii or UMass. Would you prefer a 2-1 with Presbyterian or Charleston Southern? I wouldn't.
Of course I want a 2-1, but it's not 2-1 or bust for me. I think a 1-1 with a year or two break makes sense.
Ive been to a lot of AF games as I once lived in Colorado Springs. I found it to be a unique and exciting football experience that was vastly different than anything else I had seen here, Michigan, or in Florida or anywhere in the Big 8/12.
Regardless of what you say this game is unlikely to be played in a prime time TV spot. Nor will it be as well attended or followed as intensely in the media as the CU CSU game. Its kind of like playing an Ivy league school; those players play football as a secondary effort to their actual education.
This series essentially has no hope of replacing the potential that CU CSU has in terms of playing an in state team.
I see tremendous risk of some dumb CU student making an ugly mistake that embarrasses our attempt to right the wrongs of the 1970s. I hope we dont have that. But it remains a risk that could supersede coverage of the game on the evening news.
That's fair and I'm willing to concede my experiences may have been based in whole or part on my own behavior between 18 and 25. That said, I've seen several sucker punches thrown, as well as a CU kid in 2007 that - unprovoked - threw an entire soda at the CSU fan behind him following the game. In 2005 I got nailed in the head with a metal trash can that, for some reason, was being tossed among the crowd like a beach ball, while waiting to get through the student entrance.
You probably miss all that stuff when you're wheeled into the elevator and whisked to the club section.
Stole this from @rward , which he posted on the Rivals board. It paints the picture of CSU and Wyoming being the best G5 matchups for CU to host if we want to get 50k or more fans no matter the state of the CU program.
G5 attendance in Folsom from 1990:
2005 Colorado State - 54,972 (sell out) - typo (one of these top 2 is supposed to be 2004
2005 Colorado State - 54,954 (sell out)
1997 Colorado State - 53,416 (sell out)
2009 Colorado State - 53,168
1995 Colorado State - 52,848 (sell out)
1992 Colorado State - 52,164 (sell out)
1991 Wyoming - 52,155 (sell out)
1997 Wyoming - 50,971
2009 Wyoming - 50,535
1995 NE Louisiana (now UL-Monroe) - 49,223
1994 NE Louisiana (now UL-Monroe) - 48,114
2010 Hawaii - 47,840
2001 Fresno State - 47,762
2004 North Texas - 46,355
1998 Utah State - 45,298
2007 Miami (Oh) - 45,243
2005 New Mexico State - 44,742
2002 San Diego State - 44,126
1998 Fresno State - 42,623
1999 San Jose State - 41,716
2001 San Jose State - 40,338
2014 Hawaii - 39,478
2015 UMass - 35,094
I recall reading a story a couple years back that G5 ADs stopped agreeing to play the larger schools because they wanted an Ohio State to come play in their house. Im sure if we upped what we were willing to pay out to get a 2-1 we would. But money has historically been a problem for CU. Now that we have balanced budget why push away an inexpensive game thats easy to schedule and is, to your point, compelling.
The truth here is that, like with Univ of Texas, Sackman doggedly refuses to grant them more significance then he *thinks* they should be worth.
If Sacky was confident we would roll them every year, he'd take this. The gap is starting to widen.
Fair enough. So Wyoming still generates some interest because it's considered local, but CSU is still the more compelling matchup. I know not everybody feels the same, but like patebuff said, growing up in CO has gotten me to highlight the RMS every year, whereas Wyoming would be a hard pass when deciding which games to make a priority.
CUFan
Welcome back
If there are no long term commitments then I am at least a little happier. 1-1, then off for a while, then schedule another 1-1, etc. I will be very disappointed if we enter into some sort of long term contract to play for 10 years or something. No need for something like that. Keep the flexibility.
UMass is a 2 for 1, they are coming for the back end in 2021.
Hawaii is a special case, because if you travel to the island, you get an extra game that year. I.e. an extra home game. Which means that all home and home series against them are home + 1 and home.
I look at it this way, I will likely drive up to FoCo every year they have the RMS. I won't go to Laramie.
CUFan
Welcome back
I grew up in Colorado and still don't consider the CSU game to be of much importance. I doubt all the transplants do as well. We have precious few OOC games. I see no reason to be joined at the hip with CSU. Play them every now and then, but it doesn't need to be an annual thing.
You know everyone wants to roadtrip up to Laramie for the girls and the bars. And for AFA we can stop at Old C's and the Focus on the Family museum. Winning.....
SINKRATZ
PhD in Analogy
Beating CSU is just more fun as a fan than beating Wyoming. I tend to root for Wyoming to play us respectable and feel almost apologetic when we beat them because I carry no animosity towards them and their fans aren't as douchy. I feel no such sympathy for CSU and would be content to crush them by 40 every year and for them to stink it up in conference.
That's why I prefer to keep the CSU game rather than replace them with some other G5 school that I'm generally ambivalent about.
SINKRATZ
PhD in Analogy
2021? Great, we'll all look forward to that compelling match-up.
I'm aware of the Hawaii rule, but doesn't change the fact that it's still a 1-1 and that we used that extra home game to schedule Nicholls State which sucks for fans. Attendance for that game was just over 37,000 compared to 66,000 a week earlier against CSU in Denver.
Deleted member 807
Guest
From the RMS we've seen CSU and CU student behavior. Each side argues the other side is the worst. Regardless who's correct, it's safe to assume that CU fans won't act materially different than CSU fans when AFA comes to play.
Seeing AFA has a longstanding series with CSU, it's safe to assume that AFA fans coming to Boulder will know basically what to expect.
It's rediculous to believe CU fans visiting the AFA campus will amount to some tremendous risk.
The fear mongering is unwarranted.
As to television viewership, the only reason national eyeballs pay attention to CSU vs CU is because the game has been played on the Sunday of Labor Day weekend, with no other college or pro options to watch. When CSU and CU play on a saturday 2 or 3 weeks into the season, it will only have regional interest.
You realize that we do have a 2-1 with UMASS, right?
At least AFA has a winning football tradition. They also really get what college football is about. Tradition, pageantry, student-athletes, great tailgates, winning. Going to a game at Falcon Stadium is a great time, in a very convenient location.
The big thing is this: CU only has 3 out of conference games a year. We only have 3 opportunities to play different teams. We need to make the most of those; this is the biggest argument against a regular, every-year series against CSU.
Sure, they belong in the rotation, but not every damn year, because then we only have 2 games to see other teams.
The same statement is true for AFA. They belong in the rotation, but not every year. A home-home once every 6 to 10 years seems about right.
There's a pretty reasonable chance that Wyoming is going to end up dropping to FCS in the not too distant future, so they probably won't be a viable opponent except as a body-bag game. [They are having a really hard time maintaining the FBS minimum attendance figures; what's gotten them over the hump more than once is paying some big time visitor fees to UT, NU, etc. Their biggest booster passed away last year, and the university is in a lot of budget trouble as the oil/gas/coal boom-bust cycle is now in full-on bust mode up there, so I wouldn't count on them paying for attendance (i.e. "please NU, here's a lot of money to fill our stadium with your polyester red") going forward.]
Also: for reference, these are the teams with which CU has agreed to 2-1 deals in the past decade or so:
SJ State
Fresno State
UMass
The series with both the CA State schools had some weird snafus thrown in with the Boulder floods, scheduling conflicts, and, well, us hiring one of their coaches...
[Reason for Edit: Sac State /= SJ State]
The big thing is this: CU only has 3 out of conference games a year. We only have 3 opportunities to play different teams. We need to make the most of those; this is the biggest argument against a regular, every-year series against CSU.
Sure, they belong in the rotation, but not every damn year, because then we only have 2 games to see other teams.
The same statement is true for AFA. They belong in the rotation, but not every year. A home-home once every 6 to 10 years seems about right.
There's a pretty reasonable chance that Wyoming is going to end up dropping to FCS in the not too distant future, so they probably won't be a viable opponent except as a body-bag game. [They are having a really hard time maintaining the FBS minimum attendance figures; what's gotten them over the hump more than once is paying some big time visitor fees to UT, NU, etc. Their biggest booster passed away last year, and the university is in a lot of budget trouble as the oil/gas/coal boom-bust cycle is now in full-on bust mode up there, so I wouldn't count on them paying for attendance (i.e. "please NU, here's a lot of money to fill our stadium with your polyester red") going forward.]
Also: for reference, these are the teams with which CU has agreed to 2-1 deals in the past decade or so:
SJ State
Fresno State
UMass
The series with both the CA State schools had some weird snafus thrown in with the Boulder floods, scheduling conflicts, and, well, us hiring one of their coaches...
[Reason for Edit: Sac State /= SJ State]
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Pretty sure any Sunday matchup for the RMS is a complete outlier, but I could be wrong
Deleted member 807
Guest
The way I recall, Denver hosted the DNC, which required Mile High to accommodate Obama on a Saturday. CU-CSU was bumped to Sunday. Viewership went through the roof due to lack of other CFB viewing options.
Thereafter, CU and CSU would actively negotiate Laborday Sunday dates whenever possible in order to stand out. But when CU played CSU in week 3, the season when the Buffs opened the season in Hawaii, the game was on a regional network and didn't get much interest.