Menu
What's new
By:
Filters
AllBuffs | Unofficial fan site for the University of Colorado at Boulder Athletics programs

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • Prime Time. Prime Time. Its a new era for Colorado football. Consider signing up for a club membership! For $20/year, you can get access to all the special features at Allbuffs, including club member only forums, dark mode, avatars and best of all no ads ! But seriously, please sign up so that we can pay the bills. No one earns money here, and we can use your $20 to keep this hellhole running. You can sign up for a club membership by navigating to your account in the upper right and clicking on "Account Upgrades". Make it happen!

Sefo and Lindgren Cause of CUs Misery

Honestly I do not understand this guy with some weird vendetta against Sefo. His later posts aside, why isn't more being made about his list of QBs that are supposedly superior to Sefo?

  • By the numbers, Bercovici has had a fairly comparable year. I think you'd have a hard time arguing that he's clearly been superior.
  • Adams, Solomon, and Hogan have played well but they've also been supported by elite running games and offensive lines.
  • Kessler has been very, very, very good this year, but keep in mind that Shay Fields that he touts as being a great receiver probably would not be seeing the field for USC this year. In fact, I'd guess that fewer than 2 of CU's offensive players would get major snaps for USC
  • Wilson has been legit this year and Goff otherworldly. However, there are probably 110 or so programs in FBS that would trade what they have behind center for either of those guys in a heartbeat (probably 120 or so in the case of Goff) so that's not saying much.
 
Denver_sc said:
Honestly I do not understand this guy with some weird vendetta against Sefo. His later posts aside, why isn't more being made about his list of QBs that are supposedly superior to Sefo?

  • By the numbers, Bercovici has had a fairly comparable year. I think you'd have a hard time arguing that he's clearly been superior.
  • Adams, Solomon, and Hogan have played well but they've also been supported by elite running games and offensive lines.
  • Kessler has been very, very, very good this year, but keep in mind that Shay Fields that he touts as being a great receiver probably would not be seeing the field for USC this year. In fact, I'd guess that fewer than 2 of CU's offensive players would get major snaps for USC
  • Wilson has been legit this year and Goff otherworldly. However, there are probably 110 or so programs in FBS that would trade what they have behind center for either of those guys in a heartbeat (probably 120 or so in the case of Goff) so that's not saying much.
Click to expand...
I believe I said ASU (Thus Bercovicci) was comparable. The big difference? He's won @ #16 USC, @ #7 UCLA, and vs. #23 Stanford. Get this, 2 of those were AS THE BACKUP. Weird.

Sefo can't beat Hawaii even without his shoulder injury.

The point to the original post I made was MtnBuff's post stating "How many college teams have a QB who changes significant numbers of games into wins". I argue there are a minimum of 5, just in the PAC.

But by god, we've got Sefo, and we will NEVER EVER EVER EVER consider trying something different.

Didn't Einstein (or maybe Ben Franklin, multiple attributions of the quote) say:
"Insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results."
 
ZandiBuff said:
I believe I said ASU (Thus Bercovicci) was comparable. The big difference? He's won @ #16 USC, @ #7 UCLA, and vs. #23 Stanford. Get this, 2 of those were AS THE BACKUP. Weird.

Sefo can't beat Hawaii even without his shoulder injury.
Click to expand...
Interesting. I didn't realize Sefo was the cause of the blocked punt that led to Hawaii's first score on the opening drive. Was he the one that made a horrible decision on a punt return that gave it back to Hawaii after stopping them on their own 1 yardline and flipping field position? Was he responsible for Powell fumbling in FG range at the end of the 1st half? Crawley getting beat for a 70+ yard TD?

The point here, Zandi, is that you are comparing Sefo to all these other QBs in the Pac 12 that have infinitely more talent around them on Offense, Defense and Special Teams that can help make them look good and take some of the pressure off. Sefo isn't a world beater, and nobody here is saying that, but unfavorably comparing him to other Pac 12 QBs solely because of wins is ridiculous.
 
TSchekler said:
Interesting. I didn't realize Sefo was the cause of the blocked punt that led to Hawaii's first score on the opening drive. Was he the one that made a horrible decision on a punt return that gave it back to Hawaii after stopping them on their own 1 yardline and flipping field position? Was he responsible for Powell fumbling in FG range at the end of the 1st half? Crawley getting beat for a 70+ yard TD?

The point here, Zandi, is that you are comparing Sefo to all these other QBs in the Pac 12 that have infinitely more talent around them on Offense, Defense and Special Teams that can help make them look good and take some of the pressure off. Sefo isn't a world beater, and nobody here is saying that, but unfavorably comparing him to other Pac 12 QBs solely because of wins is ridiculous.
Click to expand...

So, Hawaii, 2-5, wins against CU and UC Davis, has more talent than CU? Seriously?

Our third year starting QB can't beat a team that has yet to score a SINGLE point against other power 5 schools? 1. Single. Point.

Sefo may not get the support that some of the other QBs do, but if you cannot lead your team to a win against an opponent like that, regardless of the other circumstances, you do not deserve to be a QB at this level.

Was it the punter who decided to throw the ball into the stands on 3rd and 6 when Sefo could have run for a first down in the 2nd period against AZ? Did Powell throw the Int to the Hawaii LB who was wide open while not being pressured? Did Crawley overthrow Fields by 15+ yds when he was wide open for a TD vs ORE? See, I can do it too.
Everyone makes Mistakes. Sefo makes too many and doesn't do enough on the other end to justify him being the ONLY OPTION.

Why does most on here say that any of these other QBs could probably have at least 2 more wins on this team, then turn around and say its NOT Sefo's fault? How does that make any sense?????
 
This is like when your girlfriend just wants to vent, and doesn't care what you say, but dammit, she's got to say it, and you better not suggest any thoughts, criticism, or good god, a solution. They just want to say what they need to say. So, in that vein, @ZandiBuff, you are totally right honey, definitely, she's a total bitch.
 
Darth Snow said:
This is like when your girlfriend just wants to vent, and doesn't care what you say, but dammit, she's got to say it, and you better not suggest any thoughts, criticism, or good god, a solution. They just want to say what they need to say. So, in that vein, @ZandiBuff, you are totally right honey, definitely, she's a total bitch.
Click to expand...


I've made a suggested solution, but the Sefo defenders refuse to even consider it.

Put in Apsay. During a real game. Before it is decided. You know, like AZ did against US. Or maybe like ORE did. Against US.

Why do our coaches keep getting their asses handed to them by the exact thing that MIGHT help, yet refuse to even consider it?

Sure, he may go 1-7 with two pick sixes. Maybe, he goes 5-7 for 80 and a TD, along with, get this, SOME RUNNING YARDS. Maybe he sparks something in the Offense when Sefo has gone 5 series in a row with no more than 11 yards per.

I don't want him to start. I just want to see B.L. and MM do anything to try to win.

So ****ing sick of playing to not lose, with a QB who can't or won't win games.
 
Let's just say the pitchforks and torches are going to start coming out if Colorado loses this weekend. CU has no business losing this game.
 
ZandiBuff said:
I've made a suggested solution, but the Sefo defenders refuse to even consider it.

Put in Apsay. During a real game. Before it is decided. You know, like AZ did against US. Or maybe like ORE did. Against US.

Why do our coaches keep getting their asses handed to them by the exact thing that MIGHT help, yet refuse to even consider it?

Sure, he may go 1-7 with two pick sixes. Maybe, he goes 5-7 for 80 and a TD, along with, get this, SOME RUNNING YARDS. Maybe he sparks something in the Offense when Sefo has gone 5 series in a row with no more than 11 yards per.

I don't want him to start. I just want to see B.L. and MM do anything to try to win.

So ****ing sick of playing to not lose, with a QB who can't or won't win games.
Click to expand...
Your solution is to play the backups. Given the performance of the backups, that's unlikely to be a good idea in large quantities. No one has rejected the idea of giving them some snaps (many of us have begged for it repeatedly), although I do say that benching sefo completely, if that is what you are advocating, is a stupid idea.

Repeating your rage is accomplishing what, exactly? Besides smearing Sefo?
 
Is there anyone on this site that doesn't think the backups should see the field for reps? I think he's just really vehemently agreeing with everyone.
 
Have we settled this yet? Someone please just tell me if Sefo is good or bad so I know who to blame for this year.
 
ZandiBuff said:
I've made a suggested solution, but the Sefo defenders refuse to even consider it.

Put in Apsay. During a real game. Before it is decided. You know, like AZ did against US. Or maybe like ORE did. Against US.

Why do our coaches keep getting their asses handed to them by the exact thing that MIGHT help, yet refuse to even consider it?

Sure, he may go 1-7 with two pick sixes. Maybe, he goes 5-7 for 80 and a TD, along with, get this, SOME RUNNING YARDS. Maybe he sparks something in the Offense when Sefo has gone 5 series in a row with no more than 11 yards per.

I don't want him to start. I just want to see B.L. and MM do anything to try to win.

So ****ing sick of playing to not lose, with a QB who can't or won't win games.
Click to expand...
I don't think I've seen anyone say that Apsay shouldn't have already seen more snaps; in fact, quite the opposite sentiment has been posted many, many times that I've seen.

As to your point about Bercovici and UCLA, USC, and Stanford; their defense allowed 23, 34, and 10 points respectively (23 points on average).

First of all, Sefo's yet to have the luxury of playing in a single Pac12 game where CU's held the opposition to 23 points, let alone 10. I suppose that's his fault?
Secondly, if CU held Pac12 opponents to that average points per game this year and last (same time frame you're looking at with Bercovici), he'd have 3 Pac12 wins this year and 6 last year, including wins over #16 ASU, @ #22 USC, vs. #25 UCLA, and vs. #25 Utah.
Thirdly, CU has given up 42 PPG in Pac12 play last season and this. You know how many wins Bercovici would have out of those three you mentioned with a defense giving up that many PPG? 0.

One player does not a football team make, and I find all your Sefo hate strange, especially right after his best game of the season. What's your agenda?
 
Denver_sc said:
I don't think I've seen anyone say that Apsay shouldn't have already seen more snaps; in fact, quite the opposite sentiment has been posted many, many times that I've seen.

As to your point about Bercovici and UCLA, USC, and Stanford; their defense allowed 23, 34, and 10 points respectively (23 points on average).

First of all, Sefo's yet to have the luxury of playing in a single Pac12 game where CU's held the opposition to 23 points, let alone 10. I suppose that's his fault?
Secondly, if CU held Pac12 opponents to that average points per game this year and last (same time frame you're looking at with Bercovici), he'd have 3 Pac12 wins this year and 6 last year, including wins over #16 ASU, @ #22 USC, vs. #25 UCLA, and vs. #25 Utah.
Thirdly, CU has given up 42 PPG in Pac12 play last season and this. You know how many wins Bercovici would have out of those three you mentioned with a defense giving up that many PPG? 0.

One player does not a football team make, and I find all your Sefo hate strange, especially right after his best game of the season. What's your agenda?
Click to expand...


I thought we ended the thread, but sure, I'll keep playing.

Winning. Winning games is my agenda. That's all, nothing else.

Can we do that? Yes, I think so. But we don't. Because we keep doing the same thing. Over. and Over. and Over.

You ask if it's Sefo's fault that we don't hold opponents to 23/34 pts per game? Yes. We had AZ at 17. Stopped them. 5 times in a row. What did Sefo / B.L. do? Combination of weak ass conservative play calling, that was consistently ****ed up by our 3rd year QB. Run for 5 yds on 3rd and 7. Dance and take an 18 yd sack on 3rd and 5. Throw the ball 5 yards over the head of open receivers. How many times would you like a rebuilding, no LB having defense to stop the #10 Offense in the damn country? They did it. Multiple times in a row. What did the offense do? Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt.

Last year's defense was a joke. This year, it's the only reason we haven't lost by 40+ per game.

But please, keep doing the same thing. Maybe it'll work this time.
 
ZandiBuff said:
I thought we ended the thread, but sure, I'll keep playing.

Winning. Winning games is my agenda. That's all, nothing else.

Can we do that? Yes, I think so. But we don't. Because we keep doing the same thing. Over. and Over. and Over.

You ask if it's Sefo's fault that we don't hold opponents to 23/34 pts per game? Yes. We had AZ at 17. Stopped them. 5 times in a row. What did Sefo / B.L. do? Combination of weak ass conservative play calling, that was consistently ****ed up by our 3rd year QB. Run for 5 yds on 3rd and 7. Dance and take an 18 yd sack on 3rd and 5. Throw the ball 5 yards over the head of open receivers. How many times would you like a rebuilding, no LB having defense to stop the #10 Offense in the damn country? They did it. Multiple times in a row. What did the offense do? Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt.

Last year's defense was a joke. This year, it's the only reason we haven't lost by 40+ per game.

But please, keep doing the same thing. Maybe it'll work this time.
Click to expand...
Giving up 42 ppg in Pac 12 play?
 
ZandiBuff said:
I thought we ended the thread, but sure, I'll keep playing.

Winning. Winning games is my agenda. That's all, nothing else.

Can we do that? Yes, I think so. But we don't. Because we keep doing the same thing. Over. and Over. and Over.

You ask if it's Sefo's fault that we don't hold opponents to 23/34 pts per game? Yes. We had AZ at 17. Stopped them. 5 times in a row. What did Sefo / B.L. do? Combination of weak ass conservative play calling, that was consistently ****ed up by our 3rd year QB. Run for 5 yds on 3rd and 7. Dance and take an 18 yd sack on 3rd and 5. Throw the ball 5 yards over the head of open receivers. How many times would you like a rebuilding, no LB having defense to stop the #10 Offense in the damn country? They did it. Multiple times in a row. What did the offense do? Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt, Punt.

Last year's defense was a joke. This year, it's the only reason we haven't lost by 40+ per game.

But please, keep doing the same thing. Maybe it'll work this time.
Click to expand...
This guy gets it!
 
TSchekler said:
Giving up 42 ppg in Pac 12 play?
Click to expand...
If we didn't give them 6 consecutive possessions against a dog-tired, been on the field for the entire 2nd half defense, we wouldn't give up 42 pts.

Argue me this. If we were to have gone up 14, maybe, god forbid, 21 in the 2nd half during our play to not lose, protect a 7 pt lead phase, do you think RRod puts in the running QB?
 
TSchekler said:
Giving up 42 ppg in Pac 12 play?
Click to expand...
If you weren't being narrow minded you would get his point and our point, if the offense scores once in those 5 series or doesn't fumble and/or scores after that, the defense would probably be in the 35 point give up per game.

But the one point that Darth says with he's a ****ty QB that isn't good enough to help a ****ty team mean, and this Zandi Buff are saying Sefo and Lindgren are not good enough to make a team that is close to winning get over that hump. The offense must do something they have not done against a Pac 12 team, not fall asleep for 4-6 series in a row. We will never win a Pac 12 game with that trend continuing!
 
DiggerBuffs said:
If you weren't being narrow minded you would get his point and our point, if the offense scores once in those 5 series or doesn't fumble and/or scores after that, the defense would probably be in the 35 point give up per game.

But the one point that Darth says with he's a ****ty QB that isn't good enough to help a ****ty team mean, and this Zandi Buff are saying Sefo and Lindgren are not good enough to make a team that is close to winning get over that hump. The offense must do something they have not done against a Pac 12 team, not fall asleep for 4-6 series in a row. We will never win a Pac 12 game with that trend continuing!
Click to expand...

Yeah, this!
 
ZandiBuff said:
If we didn't give them 6 consecutive possessions against a dog-tired, been on the field for the entire 2nd half defense, we wouldn't give up 42 pts.

Argue me this. If we were to have gone up 14, maybe, god forbid, 21 in the 2nd half during our play to not lose, protect a 7 pt lead phase, do you think RRod puts in the running QB?
Click to expand...
I think he put Randall in the game because that's what Arizona does just about every game. He is a legitimate part of their offense, not just a back up QB.
 
TSchekler said:
I think he put Randall in the game because that's what Arizona does just about every game. He is a legitimate part of their offense, not just a back up QB.
Click to expand...

So, on the road, facing a 21 pt deficit, you put in the non-throwing, running QB?

Guess I understand why you defend the QB play / play calling for this team.
 
DiggerBuffs said:
If you weren't being narrow minded you would get his point and our point, if the offense scores once in those 5 series or doesn't fumble and/or scores after that, the defense would probably be in the 35 point give up per game.

But the one point that Darth says with he's a ****ty QB that isn't good enough to help a ****ty team mean, and this Zandi Buff are saying Sefo and Lindgren are not good enough to make a team that is close to winning get over that hump. The offense must do something they have not done against a Pac 12 team, not fall asleep for 4-6 series in a row. We will never win a Pac 12 game with that trend continuing!
Click to expand...
I think pretty much everyone on this site has agreed that Sefo's overall play hasn't been stellar (although PFF says otherwise), and that Lindgren is way too conservative. Nobody is refuting that aspect. The issue with your and Zandi's commentary, is that you both believe Sefo is solely to blame for CU's inability to win. It's too much of a team game to to put 100% blame on any one person.
 
TSchekler said:
I think pretty much everyone on this site has agreed that Sefo's overall play hasn't been stellar (although PFF says otherwise), and that Lindgren is way too conservative. Nobody is refuting that aspect. The issue with your and Zandi's commentary, is that you both believe Sefo is solely to blame for CU's inability to win. It's too much of a team game to to put 100% blame on any one person.
Click to expand...
You are making assumptions and there is a big ASS to start that out with. It is not 100% on Sefo, BUT Sefo is the same guy averaging over 7 yds/attempt and doing all these wonderful stats people want to point out to make their point. The key factor for a QB is winning games. I am anti-Manning post-season but he is the best regular season QB I have ever seen. Post season give me Montana, Brady or Elway. Since this is college football, all that matters is regular season, so going recent memory; give me a boring ass Garrett Grayson that isn't going to make mistakes as a 3rd year starter and step up and win the close games. Sefo has plenty of weapons to throw to. The problem is his passes are less crisp and he can't sustain a drive in the 2nd half (until we are already down by two scores and have no chance).
 
I don't believe it is ENTIRELY Sefo's fault. I do feel a large majority of it falls on his and B.L.'s shoulders. Sefo has had so many opportunities to win a game, and he just can't do it. 1 throw against UCLA, CAL last year. Hawaii, Ore this year. He crumbles when it matters. His numbers look good, but how much of them are garbage time?

Where the fault lies with the rest of the coaching staff, specifically B.L. or MM not over-riding him, is the fact that we will never know what anyone else can do until Sefo get's really, really broken. Then, we're really furked. We know Apsay can hand the ball to Powell, and, well, that's about all we know. He's never had a chance to show anything else.

We've seen Gherke. There are 5 other QBs on the team. If we don't change something, we'll lose every remaining game we have.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top