Aaron Rodgers is “interviewing” for one of those ten jobs, and he is a) an outright asshole, and b) an over the hill 41-year old that now sucks at playing QB. Steelers don’t seem to care.
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Shedeur Sanders - 2023-25 Tracking History Thread - Drafted by the Cleveland Browns (NFL)
- Thread starter #1 pick
- Start date
Aaron Rodgers is “interviewing” for one of those ten jobs, and he is a) an outright asshole, and b) an over the hill 41-year old that now sucks at playing QB. Steelers don’t seem to care.
Aaron Rodgers’ career is essentially over and he’s going to be a first ballot HOF. So what’s your point?
My point is that Shedeur being disrespectful is the spin. Nothing Nik said was spin.
This was about the cartel shutting down NIL rich college students. The NFL and its media mouthpieces use phrases like “didn’t respect the process” to punish the player. The NFL wants total control, they want to continue to have the most favorable collective bargaining agreement in the sports world. The Sanders family was attempting to nibble at the edges of their control and were dealt with.
I was saying the spin was in the tweet. Saying someone wasn’t concerned with what their potential employer thought about them (to the point where it turned said employer off), and then saying that “his only crime was believing in himself…” is spin, IMO.
If he went into a pre draft meeting and came off as though he didn’t care what the Giants or whichever team thought about him, that’s not the same as him believing in himself.
I agree with you about what happened but I think we are all being disingenuous by saying there was nothing wrong with the way he approached the process.
If I'm being interviewed by the management of an unsuccessful organization and I know that I am one of only about 20 guys in the world who can do the job effectively (1 of about 3 who are even available), then I'm polite and respectful but I am also taking zero sh!t while refusing to humble myself for them.
To me this point really highlights that, without collusion happening, what Shedeur was doing was normal or at least not a huge character flaw especially he should have dropped five rounds.
There are som obvious differences in the analogies but I think the assumption that teams “gave him ****” is a leap. For all we know, teams asked him standard QB interview questions and he gave off the perception that he didn’t care what they thought, which I just don’t think is the right approach as a Rookie coming into the NFL.
As I understand it, it's standard NFL interview practice to be intentionally confrontational and even dishonest in opinions to the point of being insulting to test the guy's mettle and how he reacts to being treated that way. Almost every interviewee is coached by his agent on how to diplomatically handle that (like how a defense attorney would coach a client on how to deal with a belligerent prosecutor trying to trip him up or an unfriendly judge confronting him). Shedeur didn't get that agent prep and wasn't having it. Instead he took the attitude of "I know my worth, my character and my ability. If you aren't seeing it, then I'm not the right guy for you and I thank you for your time."
I have no knowledge of the NFL interview process outside of what has been shown in docuseries. The video of the Giants whiteboard talk with Dart didn’t give me that feel at all, but then again that was one interview.
It's like the recruiting visit story of Westbrook at CU. Allegedly, EB got in his face at a party, was disrespectful, and tried to challenge him. Westbrook supposedly picked him up and body slammed EB through a table. EB then popped up all smiles and said to everyone that he was our kind of guy. That is football culture, not some produced-for-tv classroom stuff.
That was marketing, imo. Also, Dart is white
GRM
I'm a ****ty troll
Your comments have gone from Aaron Rodgers to now a cartel shutting down NIL rich students, specifically SS.
For Rodgers, your comments could be right on even expended upon--difficult/a-hole, club-house cancer, injuries and washed-up. We really will not know the answer to injuries and washed-up unless he comes back and a team will take him. However, this comparison is misplaced given he took an NFL team to the playoffs 13 times 2007-2021 and won a ring. The guy won NFL MVP in 2021, his 4th one. In 2022 he went 8-9, missing the playoffs in week 18. The NYJ years are lost in the wilderness due to injuries. His NFL accolades are listed below and this is actually playing in the NFL, not college. So if Rodgers overcomes injuries and is not washed up even if he is difficult/A-hole, Rodgers can play tomorrow at the NFL level, no questions asked. Peyton Manning was "washed-up" with a rag arm and won the Broncos a SB. I'm not sure if as PM's career wound down he was not perceived as difficult/A-hole by some; but he went out a winner.
For SS, the calculus is completely different as he is transitioning from college to the NFL. @Buffnik & Yak made some very valid points. I agree, an agent could have really helped him. Think about it, of all the QBs drafted, if a QB showed NO confidence in their interviews, they would probably not be drafted. Also, if they are so over-confident expecting to be QB1 on Day 1, that can also be a problem. For SS, I believe the NFL analysis was whether is he was a starter Day 1 or a back-up prospect who can shine out w/ upside. This changes drafting dramatically and does not mean a cartel exists. I do not disagree that falling into Round 5 was points to a disgrace, but SS is not an NFL proven QB and SS will hopefully prove all those NFL teams that passed on him wrong. That said, he is just nowhere close to where as Rodgers has been. If there were no cap or $$ considerations, would Cleveland rather run with a healthy Rodgers over Flacco Day 1--I would!
Rodgers NFL Resume:
- Super Bowl champion (XLV)
- Super Bowl MVP (XLV)
- 4× NFL Most Valuable Player (2011, 2014, 2020, 2021)
- 4× First-team All-Pro (2011, 2014, 2020, 2021)
- Second-team All-Pro (2012)
- 10× Pro Bowl (2009, 2011, 2012, 2014–2016, 2018–2021)
- 4× NFL passer rating leader (2011, 2012, 2020, 2021)
- 2× NFL passing touchdowns leader (2016, 2020)
- NFL completion percentage leader (2020)
- NFL 2010s All-Decade Team
All that said, I hope SS shows out and proves all the doubters wrong. I just think that he needs to develop parts of his game and is not yet NFL ready Week 1. I believe that he can probably do it, but he has a few limitations as a pocket passer. If he was deemed truly NFL ready Day 1, the Giants, Raiders, Steelers, TB and/or another team would have snacted him up day 1 of the draft, end of story.
It's a crime that SS dropped as far as he did in the draft but frankly he is probably much better with how things went than if he had been drafted by the Giants.
Giants right now are one of those franchises that can kill a QBs career. They are so disfunctional that almost any rookie QB may be ruined by them.
Going that late in the draft cost SS a lot of money but in the NFL getting the money comes with the second contract and beyond. Giants may have damaged his value for that second contract compared to other places.
I do think that a lot of GMs/coaches are going to end up having to explain passing on Shedeur multiple rounds when their teams don't have the answer at QB. Despite their ridiculous take on it the Giants staff won't be included in that, they won't have jobs by then and nobody else is going to hire them for those jobs.
Nobody can question the resume of Aaron Rodgers but there are good reasons that GB decided to go with an unproven Jordan Love instead of keeping him around.
The last few years have given every indication that Rodgers is far from the guy who built all those lines on the resume and at his age things aren't going to go up for him. He is a desperate move for a team that knows they don't have a QB. The Jets found out and have moved on.
SS hasn't proven anything yet but he has potential. AR has proven that he is an overpriced distraction that isn't the future. And only one of them is going to cost a team a huge chunk of their salary cap.
BuffLuke80
Well-Known Member
Idk about this Jaxson Dart dude but whatever. It's not like I really give a shvt what he does anyway. Didn't he go to U$C first?
And play for Daboll. Shedeur lucked out. Now his road is a bit tougher, and not as lucrative yet. But f that Daboll guy.
On one side, the Sanders camp.
On the other side, the Sanders haters plus some guy with a lot of pull who inexplicably had a 2nd or 3rd round grade on Gabriel.
What are the odds that Gabriel ends up as one of those oft repeated trivia questions? Who was the QB that the Cleveland Browns drafted a couple rounds earlier in the same draft they picked Shedeur Sanders?
I actually like Gabriel as a potential quality backup. I think his ceiling is below a franchise starter but he could be a good guy to have on the bench. He could become similar to what Kubiak was for Elway.
On every measure of physical attributes and skills, Gabriel is average or below for an NFL QB. He's experienced, shows good poise, and has very good football character but I don't see how that equals him being able to play now or to have any upside. I think he's a poor man's Ewers.
Fair evaluation.
Looks like the guy you want to have around to go in at a moments notice and in case your starter has to miss a game or two. If he is playing a significant number of games you are moving up the draft order.
Honestly, I think he's an interception waiting to happen if a defense can force him to find windows 10+ yards downfield.
Where I struggle is that I don't think any 2025 QB would have been a top 6 QB in 2024. So when you get past the top 4 this year (I had it Ward, SS, Dart, Howard as rd 1-3 guys, fwiw, with Milroe athletic enough and Ewers flashing impressive "at his best" performance to make them upside picks as a flyer, and then Slough & Gabriel as end of the draft guys who are worth having there to develop as your QB3).
This was not a strong year for QBs.
Every year we see some QBs who are drafted high end up out of the league 3-5 years later.
Guys like Milroe and Howard have the athletic ability to become stars but the odds are they fall on the scrap heap. I see Gabriel as a guy who is very likely in the league 8-10 years from now but his ceiling is as a good backup.
With QBs a lot also depends on which team they end up with. A guy like Dart has the talent to eventually develop into a decent starter, the odds of him doing so are very low with the Giants.
BuffLuke80
Well-Known Member
Yep, they are saying next years QB class will be much better than this one. That said, if Shedeur does all the things he needs to do and work hard at it, I think he'll be a really good NFL QB.
#1 pick
Well-Known Member
I had Shedeur as QB1 last year as well and I had Ward ahead of Nix with the same grade as Penix and McCarthy. Daniels would have tied Shedeur at QB1 but when Shedeur was in the draft picture, I didn't have Daniels as more than QB5. Daniels moved ahead of McCarthy who dropped due to NFL readiness who was QB2. Then he moved ahead of Sanders due do to him returning back to college. I never was in love with Celeb Williams who was QB2 and Drake Maye who was QB3. Those two really dropped that year for me. I wasn't happy with their junior years. Daniels jumped to QB1 later in the process and ended up with a top 10 grade.
During the season last year it was
1. Sanders - Top 10, bluechip
2. McCarthy - Top 10, bluechip
3. Williams - 1st, special
4. Maye - 1st, special
5. Daniels - Late 1st, franchise QB potential
6. Penix - Late 1st, franchise QB potential
7. Ward - Late 1st, franchise QB potential
8. Rattler - 3rd, potential to eventually be a starter
9. Nix - 7th, training camp body and 3rd string QB
Before the draft
1. Daniels - Top 10 - Elite Running QB
2. Williams - 1st - Decent Balanced QB, most talented QB of all time. The way people talk about Sanders and the intangibles is really Caleb Williams. How the haters think Shedeur is personality wise, is exactly Williams.
3. Maye - 1st - Average Balanced QB, freakish talent and skill level. WIP as a QB.
4. Penix - Late 1st - average Balanced QB, WIP as a passer, throws an insane ball.
5. McCarthy- Late 1st - NFL readiness questions. Excellent GM, good running QB. I previously had him as an elite GM but I changed it during the process.
6. Rattler - 4th - Low floor QB who could develop into a franchise QB with the right situation.
7. Milton - 5th - talented toolsy QB who sucks as a QB.
8. Nix - 6th - Productive QB who I didn't trust could handle the NFL or translate to the league based on his unrealistic pocket he had at Oregon and his scheme which protected him from his weaknesses we saw at Oregon.
I was a Nix hater. I hated his Auburn film, was a massive hater of his Oregon stuff, acted like the good was system based and I just ignore him like he didn't exist and did what Shedeur haters do which is BS things to avoid facts. Based on his real film, he deserved a late 1st round grade. I literally ruled out 70% of his film off the fact that he was under pressure on just 14% of his total dropbacks. I was hating hard.
He's an excellent mobile QB and who's a good game manager. He massively improved at Oregon and he really should have been judged more fairly but when you don't like someone, sometimes you do not judge them fairly. I always believe you must love or like a guy to judge him fairly. For me, I try to avoid evaluating guys I don't like. It's not fair to them but luckily I usually like everyone as prospects. Drew Allar is trending in that don't like direction. It's usually QBs and it's QBs I just don't like to watch or I completely disagree with the hype. This is why I completely understand Shedeur haters, as a Nix hater, I know what it's like to not want a guy at ANY slot altogether. I just don't want him here, period.
Before this season
1. Sanders- Top 10
2. Beck - Late 1st
3. Ward - Late 1st
Gap
4. Allar - 4th
5. Gabriel - 4th
5. DJU - 5th
Before the draft:
1. Sanders - Top 10. Same as usual, elite pocket passer with elite elusiveness in a high football IQ way.
2. Ward - Late 1st, nothing changed for me. He was always a late 1st grade like Gabriel was a 4th round QB last year.
3. Rourke - 4th - Biggest mover. I think he could be a quality NFL starter in 3 years and he's already a decent QB right now who can play in spots.
4. Miller - 4th - I am a big Miller guy. I think he's a dynamic field general. He's a mobile QB of course but his floor is much higher than anyone with this grade for me. Only reason Rourke is rated higher is his ceiling clears a tier higher than Miller with a similar floor.
5. Howard - 4th - High floor, mid ceiling. Balanced QB. Below average.
6. Gabriel - 4th - Excellent mobile QB. I just worry once teams adjust to what he does well.
7. McCord - 4th - a mix between PP and GM. Liken to Jared Goff. Not as good obviously.
8. Milroe - 4th - the floor being extremely low is why he's here but his ceiling is extremely high if he could reach it.
9. Dart - 4th - See Milroe but his ceiling isn't as high.
10. Leonard - 4th - While his floor is higher than Milroe or Dart, it's not high enough to cover for the huge gap in potential.
11. Brady Cook - 4th, I think he's a better NFL QB than college guy. Get him into a favorable scheme.
12. Ewers- 4th - Ewers is as talented as anyone here in 2025 but he doesn't play to his strengths and it's frustrating plus he's not consistent.
13. Tyler Shough- 6th - The good is I liken him to Joe Flacco with even more mobility. The bad is his pocket foot speed reminds me of Josh Rosen and Rosen couldn't overcome it, can Shough? Balanced QB, below average
14. Martz- 6th - A true game manager who's very good. Some team will bet on him becoming an excellent GM and could hit a home run with him.
15. Elgersma - 6th, bad Balanced QB with potential franchise QB talent. Keep an eye on him and his long term development. He's a guy to check for in 2030.
16. Henigan- 7th - I like him but he's a camp body who's UFL status but he does have upside.
I don't see why people love the 2026 NFL class. I don't find it to be that impressive.
Intrigued by 2027 thus far.
I think the 2024 class is special. Thought it was special at the time. Didn't like the lack of depth and still don't like it. The 2025, I love the depth. I also think the hit rate with this QB class will be much higher than anyone expect. A scout said he likes this class a lot more than 2021 and I agree. It's nowhere near as talented but it's a lot of polished and high intangibles QBs going to good situations outside of Tyler Shough and Jaxson Dart.
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That's a hell of a lot more work than I put into my opinion.
#1 pick
Well-Known Member
I already had it finished awhile back. I just had to reformat it and add reasoning. Especially where I was wrong on NixThat's a hell of a lot more work than I put into my opinion.