The future of CU football

[DBT]

I was listening to 950’s pregame and they had Paul Klee from the CS Gazette. I think he’s a pretty good writer but haven’t read much of his stuff.

He said something that pissed me off. Essentially he said “CU will never attain the success they had in the 90’s. In good years they will win 7 or 8 games and go to a decent bowl game.”

I think that is a bunch of BS and still believe CU can be an elite program. Am I guilty of viewing CU through black and gold glasses?

 

[Highlander]

I was listening to 950’s pregame and they had Paul Klee from the CS Gazette. I think he’s a pretty good writer but haven’t read much of his stuff.

He said something that pissed me off. Essentially he said “CU will never attain the success they had in the 90’s. In good years they will win 7 or 8 games and go to a decent bowl game.”

I think that is a bunch of BS and still believe CU can be an elite program. Am I guilty of viewing CU through black and gold glasses?

We already blew past that in 2016.

 

[Shldr2Shldr]

I was listening to 950’s pregame and they had Paul Klee from the CS Gazette. I think he’s a pretty good writer but haven’t read much of his stuff.

He said something that pissed me off. Essentially he said “CU will never attain the success they had in the 90’s. In good years they will win 7 or 8 games and go to a decent bowl game.”

I think that is a bunch of BS and still believe CU can be an elite program. Am I guilty of viewing CU through black and gold glasses?

I don't know that we will ever be able to achieve the run of dominance we had in the 90's again. Not impossible, but the landscape of college football has changed so much. If you aren't one of the true elites, you are playing catch up in so many more ways than just on the field now.

Doesn't mean we can't win some conference titles and get in the playoff conversation every now and then.

 

[buff4bcs1985]

I was listening to 950’s pregame and they had Paul Klee from the CS Gazette. I think he’s a pretty good writer but haven’t read much of his stuff.

He said something that pissed me off. Essentially he said “CU will never attain the success they had in the 90’s. In good years they will win 7 or 8 games and go to a decent bowl game.”

I think that is a bunch of BS and still believe CU can be an elite program. Am I guilty of viewing CU through black and gold glasses?

i think they can be a 8-10 win team regularly but alabama elite is a bit of a stretch

 

[lvbuff]

You are too gullible. You get sucked in

 

[DrunkRalphie]

Paul Klee can eat my ass.

 

[patebuff]

The teams in the 90's were something we may never see again, but thinking the ceiling of 8 wins is laughable. 2016 would like a talk with him.

 

[hawg1]

Just achieve the goals in the AD plan. They seem correct.

MM has done a good job getting them to this point. He’s not the guy for the next step in my opinion.

He is recruiting at a 0.500 level. It needs to be juiced again with more recruiters like Chiv and Brown.

 

[CarolinaBuff]

I don't know that we will ever be able to achieve the run of dominance we had in the 90's again. Not impossible, but the landscape of college football has changed so much. If you aren't one of the true elites, you are playing catch up in so many more ways than just on the field now.

Doesn't mean we can't win some conference titles and get in the playoff conversation every now and then.

Pretty much this. I don't think this program will get back to a level of winning 10+ games over a multi-year stretch but yea every once in a while we can certainly be in the playoff discussion. We were just there 2 years ago with an outside shot at making the playoff going into conference championship weekend.

 

[Deleted member 807]

Short of some kind of anti-trust suit that levels the $$$$ playing field $$$$ against the SEC:B1G cartel and smattering of other blue bloods, it’s hard for me to envision CU consistently elevating into a top 10 team.

Not even Billion dollar donor programs like Okie Light, Oregon and Baylor have been able to grab the brass ring away from ESPN’s milk cows and golden gooses.

 

[Duff Man]

SEC/Big Cartel?

 

[jizzrag85]

Just achieve the goals in the AD plan. They seem correct.

MM has done a good job getting them to this point. He’s not the guy for the next step in my opinion.

He is recruiting at a 0.500 level. It needs to be juiced again with more recruiters like Chiv and Brown.

Here we go again with this nonsense. Square peg, round hole. If this was true every single team behind them in recruiting would be .500 or worse. You can’t use mathematics to gauge talent level, dedication, camaraderie or coaching. Your recruiting is only as good as your coaching and your schemes. We’re 16-10 from 2016 to now, is that .500? You can’t use a chart to explain football results, it doesn’t work. .500 should be the floor for CU from now on with the level of recruting they have. If the 60-80 teams behind them can manage 6+ wins so can they.

 

[onealcd]

Not a popular opinion but definitely not an outrageous take. I posted this a couple of weeks ago but I actually think Colorado is positioned really well for the next 20 or so years in college football. The biggest disadvantage was local talent but that should take a considerable step forward with the growth here. I just don’t see any reason this program should take a back seat to anyone in this conference other than usc and Washington so if we get the right coach in place we can compete for pac 12 championships. I also know a lot of people don’t think mac is the answer but man, he is so close to putting out a solid team year after year. If drake can get things together we should be pretty good and I am certainly not giving up on Adams with all of the positive things people have to say about him who are well connected.

The more annoying thing is that local reporters saying things like that hurt and it’s part of the problem in my opinion.

 

[Buffnik]

We already blew past that in 2016.

^THIS

I have no idea where this stuff comes from. How can the program be at a point where the ceiling is a 7 or 8 win season when we won 10 games just 2 seasons ago?

Same thing with people who say that the upside with MacIntyre is 7 or 8 wins when he won 10 here in 2016.

It's like that season didn't even happen with some people.

 

[Shldr2Shldr]

^THIS

I have no idea where this stuff comes from. How can the program be at a point where the ceiling is a 7 or 8 win season when we won 10 games just 2 seasons ago?

Same thing with people who say that the upside with MacIntyre is 7 or 8 wins when he won 10 here in 2016.

It's like that season didn't even happen with some people.

People in this state like to ignore that stuff because it busts the narrative that CU and CSU are equals.

 

[Not Sure]

I see two that things in the narrative: One, that we won’t be 90’s type elite again. This is probably correct. The business of college football has changed in the last 20 years. In order to be at that elite level, schools have to adopt a more liberal moral compass than what CU is willing to accept - look at Ohio State as a great example. So in that regard, the author is correct. However, the next item is that we can only hope for the occasional 8-win season. That’s pure garbage, as was evidenced by 2016. This is a solid program that can win 8-10 games a year, every year, with the occasional spike into the national playoff discussion. I’m OK with that.

 

[Buffnik]

I see two that things in the narrative: One, that we won’t be 90’s type elite again. This is probably correct. The business of college football has changed in the last 20 years. In order to be at that elite level, schools have to adopt a more liberal moral compass than what CU is willing to accept - look at Ohio State as a great example. So in that regard, the author is correct. However, the next item is that we can only hope for the occasional 8-win season. That’s pure garbage, as was evidenced by 2016. This is a solid program that can win 8-10 games a year, every year, with the occasional spike into the national playoff discussion. I’m OK with that.

Ummmm... do people mis-remember the 90s? What you're saying you think the program can be is exactly what it was in the 90s.

 

[Duff Man]

^THIS

I have no idea where this stuff comes from. How can the program be at a point where the ceiling is a 7 or 8 win season when we won 10 games just 2 seasons ago?

Same thing with people who say that the upside with MacIntyre is 7 or 8 wins when he won 10 here in 2016.

It's like that season didn't even happen with some people.

Pretty sure the idea being his ceiling is 7-8 wins CONSISTENTLY.

This program can be really good, but it requires better assistant coaching hires (on the first try) and better recruiting.

 

[Not Sure]

Ummmm... do people mis-remember the 90s? What you're saying you think the program can be is exactly what it was in the 90s.

Late 90’s, yes. Early 90’s with coach Mac was a different story.

 

[BuffsNYC]

There's no reason Colorado can't have a similar level of success as Washington has had recently.

 

[hawg1]

Here we go again with this nonsense. Square peg, round hole. If this was true every single team behind them in recruiting would be .500 or worse. You can’t use mathematics to gauge talent level, dedication, camaraderie or coaching. Your recruiting is only as good as your coaching and your schemes. We’re 16-10 from 2016 to now, is that .500? You can’t use a chart to explain football results, it doesn’t work. .500 should be the floor for CU from now on with the level of recruting they have. If the 60-80 teams behind them can manage 6+ wins so can they.

I hear you. The next level won’t be achieved without better recruiting. There is plenty of data out there to show you what you get with 3 star players. Better coaches and recruiters are needed.

 

[hawg1]

^THIS

I have no idea where this stuff comes from. How can the program be at a point where the ceiling is a 7 or 8 win season when we won 10 games just 2 seasons ago?

Same thing with people who say that the upside with MacIntyre is 7 or 8 wins when he won 10 here in 2016.

It's like that season didn't even happen with some people.

He had a great season. He won lots of awards. Just duplicate it.

 

[lvbuff]

I hear you. The next level won’t be achieved without better recruiting. There is plenty of data out there to show you what you get with 3 star players. Better coaches and recruiters are needed.

Broken record.

 

[LaserDeathHawk]

I was listening to 950’s pregame and they had Paul Klee from the CS Gazette. I think he’s a pretty good writer but haven’t read much of his stuff.

He said something that pissed me off. Essentially he said “CU will never attain the success they had in the 90’s. In good years they will win 7 or 8 games and go to a decent bowl game.”

I think that is a bunch of BS and still believe CU can be an elite program. Am I guilty of viewing CU through black and gold glasses?

Mrs LDH insists on getting that paper. Klee is a middling writer and world class ****. He views it as his responsibility to run down any sense of pride people may be able to generate in local sports teams

 

[hawg1]

Broken record.

The next level will not be achieved without better recruiting and coaching.

 

[jizzrag85]

I hear you. The next level won’t be achieved without better recruiting. There is plenty of data out there to show you what you get with 3 star players. Better coaches and recruiters are needed.

We’ve had the discussion before. I’ve always disagreed about MM as I disagreed with everyone here about Herm Edwards at ASU. Data is fine and I’m sure 3 star takent is good enough for .500. Are we talking about going 7-10 wins a season or are we talking about going 12-0 and being one of the 4 best teams in the country? Everyone here can agree we’re not even remotely close to the top 10 in talent level. There are maybe 10 teams a year (Alabama, Clemson, OSU, Georgia) that can win a championship and it’s the same teams every year anymore. 10 teams might be generous here. The next 10-15 are your elites, (LSU, Auburn, Washington, USC, Oregon) teams that can compete for their league championship and end up in a high level bowl or push into an occasional playoff with the right experience. Teams you wouldn’t be shocked to see there but teams that tend to lack the all around size and depth the top schools have. After that there’s about 20ish teams (where CU currently is) that fluctuate between division championships, .500 and maybe a deep run into playoff contention. Everyone who is recruiting after 45-50 are teams that are the bottom of their leagues in the power 5 followed by most of the MWC and other leagues.

Anyways yeah we can agree we need to recruit better if our goal is to be in the top 10. Ridiculously better if we ever want to sniff another championship. But I don’t agree with you that our current level of recruiting isn’t good enough to be in the top 10-40 teams every single year. Everyone pounds the recruting drum every year and every year it improves a little bit for 3-4 straight years now. The lowest rated players goes up, the highest rated players goes up, the average has gone up. Even the level of recruits has gone up so much since 2014. Kyle ford wouldn’t have even answered the phone in 2014. Most of these recruits wouldn’t have.

 

[lvbuff]

Everyone knows what opinions are like.

 

[MtnBuff]

There's no reason Colorado can't have a similar level of success as Washington has had recently.

This and more.

How far is Washington from being a regular contender for the NC playoffs?

To my knowledge they haven't become a haven for academic misfits and moral criminals, they aren't putting recruits in fast cars and parents in new homes.

Will CU ever be one of the huge money, huge crowd programs? Probably not but more than a few of those programs are not killing it on the field either. Texas, Florida, aTm, etc. have a lot of unhappy fans right now.

For CU to be successful we need a combination of things to happen. We need a dynamic coach who can sell a vision and who can lead a staff of recruiters into the talent centers and come out ahead. We need to have an athletic department focused on success and making it happen, not just doing okay. And most importantly we need an administration that understands and supports the value of a winning football team in accomplishing the mission of the university. This doesn't mean turning a blind eye or compromising basic values but it does mean allowing the program to work with some kids who might be marginal and accepting that there may be some kids who don't work out and will be gone after they don't.

Gordon Gee had us in that position under McCartney. We could be there again.

 

[Duff Man]

We’ve had the discussion before. I’ve always disagreed about MM as I disagreed with everyone here about Herm Edwards at ASU. Data is fine and I’m sure 3 star takent is good enough for .500. Are we talking about going 7-10 wins a season or are we talking about going 12-0 and being one of the 4 best teams in the country? Everyone here can agree we’re not even remotely close to the top 10 in talent level. There are maybe 10 teams a year (Alabama, Clemson, OSU, Georgia) that can win a championship and it’s the same teams every year anymore. 10 teams might be generous here. The next 10-15 are your elites, (LSU, Auburn, Washington, USC, Oregon) teams that can compete for their league championship and end up in a high level bowl or push into an occasional playoff with the right experience. Teams you wouldn’t be shocked to see there but teams that tend to lack the all around size and depth the top schools have. After that there’s about 20ish teams (where CU currently is) that fluctuate between division championships, .500 and maybe a deep run into playoff contention. Everyone who is recruiting after 45-50 are teams that are the bottom of their leagues in the power 5 followed by most of the MWC and other leagues.

Anyways yeah we can agree we need to recruit better if our goal is to be in the top 10. Ridiculously better if we ever want to sniff another championship. But I don’t agree with you that our current level of recruiting isn’t good enough to be in the top 10-40 teams every single year. Everyone pounds the recruting drum every year and every year it improves a little bit for 3-4 straight years now. The lowest rated players goes up, the highest rated players goes up, the average has gone up. Even the level of recruits has gone up so much since 2014. Kyle ford wouldn’t have even answered the phone in 2014. Most of these recruits wouldn’t have.

7-10 wins is a big range.

 

[jizzrag85]

7-10 wins is a big range.

I agree. I’m looking at it as top 10 recruiting teams are almost assured 10-12 wins a season every single season, sadly that’s the reality we’re seeing. The teams below them are probably 8-10 teams with 8 being their down year and every 2-3 years they might hit 11-12 and be in playoff contention. Next tier is 7-10 and I say this because that’s what you see. Loads of freshman and a young team? 7 wins. Experienced team and everything goes your way? 10. We witnessed that in 2016.