UA is killing it on the recruiting trail - added Alonzo Trier

[Buffnik]

It's the gem of the southwest.

Gallup doesn't hold a candle to Tucson.

 

[Deleted member 807]

Gallup doesn't hold a candle to Tucson.

There should be a poll.

 

[aik]

Gallup doesn't hold a candle to Tucson.

Clovis, El Paso, Pueblo, Barstow, and the military-industrial complex would like your consideration

 

[Buffnik]

Clovis, El Paso, Pueblo, Barstow, and the military-industrial complex would like your consideration

Kingman is offended by your lack of recognition.

 

[CVilleBuff]

That's tough. All it takes is one bad game, and you get bounced.

They had a chance last year and failed, now I'm giving them 5 more tries. That's 6 bad games. You simply have to break through at some point if you're recruiting at the level they're at right now.

 

[tante]

They had a chance last year and failed, now I'm giving them 5 more tries. That's 6 bad games. You simply have to break through at some point if you're recruiting at the level they're at right now.

They had a really nice roster last year. The guys all played well together. It is hard to match that chemistry every year.

 

[rolandftw]

They had a chance last year and failed, now I'm giving them 5 more tries. That's 6 bad games. You simply have to break through at some point if you're recruiting at the level they're at right now.

I dunno. I'm sure Zona fans feel similarly. Winning a title is the only outcome they would find satisfying.

But look at Roy Williams at Kansas. Regularly brought in top classes, but could not bring home a National Title. It's tough because as good as they are, they won't be the best team most years. And you're having to win six straight games. One mediocre game by you, or one great game by a similarly talented team and you're going home. The first couple might be easier, but after that you often face 3-4 straight teams that can beat you. Not easy.

 

[SECOBuffsFan]

Arizona has had great teams for almost 3 decades now and they have 1 National Title to show for it....I'm not giving Arizona any credit on a national level until they make it to the Final Four and win a title

 

[BuffG]

Already had a #1 recruiting class and can't even win a P12 tourney title let alone a Final 4.

 

[azbuff]

They haven't been to the Final Four in almost fifteen years and their lone national title is almost as far in the rear view mirror as our football national championship. They have been very good for a few years, but before that they were mediocre from 2005-2009. Let's stop talking about Arizona like it is a blue blood program.

 

[CVilleBuff]

I dunno. I'm sure Zona fans feel similarly. Winning a title is the only outcome they would find satisfying.

But look at Roy Williams at Kansas. Regularly brought in top classes, but could not bring home a National Title. It's tough because as good as they are, they won't be the best team most years. And you're having to win six straight games. One mediocre game by you, or one great game by a similarly talented team and you're going home. The first couple might be easier, but after that you often face 3-4 straight teams that can beat you. Not easy.

The expectation is you keep recruiting top talent and getting within striking distance, eventually you'll break through. Look at Duke 2010, it wasn't even close to one of their better teams. I can name a few years where Duke was more stacked...but you keep going deep in the tourney and one year things will break your way. They're recruiting at a level where that's a fair expectation. If their recruiting drops off then I'll change expectations accordingly.

 

[UACat]

It's a little deceiving to say "UA hasn't made a final 4 in forever" and act like they haven't been close or good enough to get there. They've had some really bad luck in the elite 8 to be fair. The huge meltdown against Illinois in the final minutes, and the Derrick Williams year they had two clean shots on the last play to advance and rimmed both. Ask any UConn fan about that game and they'll say they were very fortunate to get by. Ohio State also beat them on the last play in the Sweet 16 a few years ago. Last year they just got beat by Frank the Tank, but again it was another Elite 8 appearance, and they were down Brandon Ashley.

I'm not saying that UA is the only team to have bad luck in the tournament, or that anyone should be saying they're the top program right now. I'm just saying it's very unfair to say since they haven't won a title that they've failed, or to group them with other teams that haven't won it in that stretch.

Maybe if Colorado gets to the point that it's a title contender on a yearly basis and starts barely missing out, you'll realize there's a big difference between that and just being an average or above average program.

 

[Buffnik]

It's a little deceiving to say "UA hasn't made a final 4 in forever" and act like they haven't been close or good enough to get there. They've had some really bad luck in the elite 8 to be fair. The huge meltdown against Illinois in the final minutes, and the Derrick Williams year they had two clean shots on the last play to advance and rimmed both. Ask any UConn fan about that game and they'll say they were very fortunate to get by. Ohio State also beat them on the last play in the Sweet 16 a few years ago. Last year they just got beat by Frank the Tank, but again it was another Elite 8 appearance, and they were down Brandon Ashley.

I'm not saying that UA is the only team to have bad luck in the tournament, or that anyone should be saying they're the top program right now. I'm just saying it's very unfair to say since they haven't won a title that they've failed, or to group them with other teams that haven't won it in that stretch.

Maybe if Colorado gets to the point that it's a title contender on a yearly basis and starts barely missing out, you'll realize there's a big difference between that and just being an average or above average program.

Good post.

As good as we think the programs are that put themselves in position ever year... they're better. (This also holds true for football.)

At the end of the day, it's the Final 4s and Championships we remember. But I don't know if there's ever been a more impressive run of greatness than Dean Smith advancing to 13 straight Sweet 16s at North Carolina.

It's damn hard to win a title. It's probably harder to be in the conversation over a sustained timeline.

 

[sackman]

Winning a national title is tough. College basketball isn't like college football. In college football, there are maybe 10 teams that have a legitimate chance at a title. That number drops as the year goes on. In college hoops, there's probably 25 teams that, if the chips fall just right, could win a championship. UA is definitely in that group. CU isn't - yet. I think we're getting close, though. Once we're consistenly getting into the round of 32 and 16, then we'll be in that group, too. We're not there.

 

[Buffnik]

Winning a national title is tough. College basketball isn't like college football. In college football, there are maybe 10 teams that have a legitimate chance at a title. That number drops as the year goes on. In college hoops, there's probably 25 teams that, if the chips fall just right, could win a championship. UA is definitely in that group. CU isn't - yet. I think we're getting close, though. Once we're consistenly getting into the round of 32 and 16, then we'll be in that group, too. We're not there.

:nod:

I look at the sustained success Wisconsin has had with annual tourney appearances and a number of B1G reg/tourney titles. Despite all of that excellence, they have rarely gone deep in the Dance.

 

[BuffG]

It's a little deceiving to say "UA hasn't made a final 4 in forever" and act like they haven't been close or good enough to get there. They've had some really bad luck in the elite 8 to be fair. The huge meltdown against Illinois in the final minutes, and the Derrick Williams year they had two clean shots on the last play to advance and rimmed both. Ask any UConn fan about that game and they'll say they were very fortunate to get by. Ohio State also beat them on the last play in the Sweet 16 a few years ago. Last year they just got beat by Frank the Tank, but again it was another Elite 8 appearance, and they were down Brandon Ashley.

Maybe if Colorado gets to the point that it's a title contender on a yearly basis and starts barely missing out, you'll realize there's a big difference between that and just being an average or above average program.

Weak talk. Maybe if Dinwiddie doesn't tear his ACL, you're not on here talking smack. Maybe if the refs weren't scared, they'd confirm the Chen buzzer beater in Tucson. What ifs is weak talk. Save that for a Zona board, no sympathy here.

UofA has already brought in elite classes yet couldn't beat CU, Washington, or UCLA for a P12 tourney title. UCLA is the only blue blood west of the Mississippi. I never see their fans trolling on our board because they know that. They don't need to prove anything. I like Miller and I want to see P12 teams regularly make Final 4s, but UofA is hard to root for because 90% of their fan base are petty and juvenile.

 

[Deleted member 807]

Lawrence, Kansas is west of the mighty Mississippi.

**** KU.

But let's not pretend that program isn't a blue blood.

 

[AZBearDown]

Weak talk. Maybe if Dinwiddie doesn't tear his ACL, you're not on here talking smack. Maybe if the refs weren't scared, they'd confirm the Chen buzzer beater in Tucson. What ifs is weak talk. Save that for a Zona board, no sympathy here.

UofA has already brought in elite classes yet couldn't beat CU, Washington, or UCLA for a P12 tourney title. UCLA is the only blue blood west of the Mississippi. I never see their fans trolling on our board because they know that. They don't need to prove anything. I like Miller and I want to see P12 teams regularly make Final 4s, but UofA is hard to root for because 90% of their fan base are petty and juvenile.

UCLA doesn't have a fan base. Being in the PAC-12 a number of years now you'd think you guys would realize this. They renovated their whole arena and brought in the best class in the nation two years ago and still couldn't put butts in the seats. Yes they are a Blue Blood but right now Arizona owns this conference. We have the national recognition, fan base, money, talent, etc... UCLA is in our shadow now. That can't be denied.

 

[Deleted member 807]

UCLA doesn't have a fan base. Being in the PAC-12 a number of years now you'd think you guys would realize this. They renovated their whole arena and brought in the best class in the nation two years ago and still couldn't put butts in the seats. Yes they are a Blue Blood but right now Arizona owns this conference. We have the national recognition, fan base, money, talent, etc... UCLA is in our shadow now. That can't be denied.

It cannot be denied that CU has more P12 tournament titles, either.
Owning the conference means owning and holding on to that special piece of P12 hardware.

No doubt the 13-14 team was good when hitting on all cylinders. But all that national recognition, fan base, money, talent, etc didn't help in Vegas and sure didn't help in either you or my NCAA tournament brackets last April.

a little humility wouldn't kill you.

 

[Buffnik]

The thing UCLA has going for it that puts them in a special category is that they've got that history & cache while being in a recruiting hotbed and also owning Adidas AAUs in the west. As I've said before, some schmuck like me could recruit a Top 25 class there. Good coaching with dynamic recruiters and they're quickly among the most talented squads in the nation overnight, going right back to Final 4s.

 

[AZBearDown]

It cannot be denied that CU has more P12 tournament titles, either.
Owning the conference means owning and holding on to that special piece of P12 hardware.

No doubt the 13-14 team was good when hitting on all cylinders. But all that national recognition, fan base, money, talent, etc didn't help in Vegas and sure didn't help in either you or my NCAA tournament brackets last April.

a little humility wouldn't kill you.

You guys put way too much weight into the P12 tournament. Sure its nice to win and adds a trophy to your case but about the only thing it does is buy you an auto bid or helps your seeding in the real tournament, you know the one that actually matters. The actual PAC-12 champ is determined in the regular season. Not during a weekend in Vegas.

 

[Buffnik]

You guys put way too much weight into the P12 tournament. Sure its nice to win and adds a trophy to your case but about the only thing it does is buy you an auto bid or helps your seeding in the real tournament, you know the one that actually matters. The actual PAC-12 champ is determined in the regular season. Not during a weekend in Vegas.

Less true with the unbalanced schedule now.

 

[BuffG]

Lawrence, Kansas is west of the mighty Mississippi.

**** KU.

But let's not pretend that program isn't a blue blood.

You right. My B. Were there any Kansas trolls here last December before we beat them? Honest question.

UCLA doesn't have a fan base. Being in the PAC-12 a number of years now you'd think you guys would realize this. They renovated their whole arena and brought in the best class in the nation two years ago and still couldn't put butts in the seats. Yes they are a Blue Blood but right now Arizona owns this conference. We have the national recognition, fan base, money, talent, etc... UCLA is in our shadow now. That can't be denied.

UCLA certainly has a fan base, they just have better things to do than be trolls all day. They also beat Zona in the title game 5 months ago and produced 3 1st rd picks while Uofa had 1. Not to mention that they've actually played in Final 4s in the last decade. Heck of a shadow you've got, Napoleon.

You guys put way too much weight into the P12 tournament. Sure its nice to win and adds a trophy to your case but about the only thing it does is buy you an auto bid or helps your seeding in the real tournament, you know the one that actually matters. The actual PAC-12 champ is determined in the regular season. Not during a weekend in Vegas.

Yeah, that's all. Pretty meaningless, eh? Guess that's how the 2012 UDub reg season champs feel too.

Fact is, UofA hasn't won either tournament in over a decade.

 

[Deleted member 807]

You guys put way too much weight into the P12 tournament. Sure its nice to win and adds a trophy to your case but about the only thing it does is buy you an auto bid or helps your seeding in the real tournament, you know the one that actually matters. The actual PAC-12 champ is determined in the regular season. Not during a weekend in Vegas.

If it weren't a big deal, then why did Sean Miller make winning the tournament a team goal?

You sure like to pick and choose when U of A is awesome.

 

[AZBearDown]

If it weren't a big deal, then why did Sean Miller make winning the tournament a team goal?

You sure like to pick and choose when U of A is awesome.

Why would Miller say otherwise? He's the freakin head coach. Bottom line is it really only matters when you are a bubble team trying to make the dance. Arizona doesn't appear it will be in that position for a long time.

 

[AZBearDown]

UCLA certainly has a fan base, they just have better things to do than be trolls all day. They also beat Zona in the title game 5 months ago and produced 3 1st rd picks while Uofa had 1. Not to mention that they've actually played in Final 4s in the last decade. Heck of a shadow you've got, Napoleon.

This is what it looks like pretty much every tipoff, save for a UA game when those empty seats are filled with red.

 

[BuffG]

Why would Miller say otherwise? He's the freakin head coach. Bottom line is it really only matters when you are a bubble team trying to make the dance. Arizona doesn't appear it will be in that position for a long time.

If this argument were true then hoards of JUCO alumni pretending to be UofA alumni wouldn't flood MGM in March. Also, Miller would be mixing in his subs more and not playing to win. Nonetheless, even with your argument, Uofa failed to win in 2012 when they needed it most. How'd that work out? Oh yeah you guys got blown out by Bucknell in the NIT.

 

[Buffnik]

This is what it looks like pretty much every tipoff, save for a UA game when those empty seats are filled with red.

I can't imagine how much it must suck that they care so much less than you guys and still beat you whenever it matters.

 

[Deleted member 807]

Why would Miller say otherwise? He's the freakin head coach. Bottom line is it really only matters when you are a bubble team trying to make the dance. Arizona doesn't appear it will be in that position for a long time.

But, but, but...if U of A won a P12 tourney, you could shut up fans like me.

But since UofA didn't take care of business, this omission stands in the way of putting U of A on the lofty pedestal of your imagination.

 

[DBT]

Arizona is damned good and the team to beat in the PAC. There really isn't any argument there.