What do you do about HC if you're RG?

[sackman]

Remember Hawkins? We kept him around longer than we should have. That didn't work out very well.

The two situations are not equivalent. Hawkins was a fraud. He didn't have the first idea how to properly coach a football team. He was all about "getting your horns out" and doing the little things... Which meant he didn't have the first idea how to actually coach. MM isn't anywhere near Hawkins' level of incompetence. He's a real football coach who has never been in this kind of situation before. Plus, we kept Hawkins for a year five after it was obvious he needed to go. He got his four years. That's what MM will get, too.

 

[DBT]

Keep MacIntyre. He has built a family environment. His players play hard and they live and breath the 4F's that coach has built his foundation upon. MacIntyre is a good man. Coaching is a high turnover business so keep MacIntyre and his assistants to give them stability for themselves and their families. This program is so far ahead of 2012. Embree was the low point so we need to keep MacIntyre.

Hmm. I'm not quite sure if you are serious.

 

[Jens1893]

The two situations are not equivalent. Hawkins was a fraud. He didn't have the first idea how to properly coach a football team. He was all about "getting your horns out" and doing the little things... Which meant he didn't have the first idea how to actually coach. MM isn't anywhere near Hawkins' level of incompetence. He's a real football coach who has never been in this kind of situation before. Plus, we kept Hawkins for a year five after it was obvious he needed to go. He got his four years. That's what MM will get, too.

Hawkins overstayed his welcome and definitely had to be fired after that fourth season, that loss against CSU at Folsom opened everybody´s eyes but those of a selected few. Unfortunately, those were the ones who could fire him, but I´m fairly certain people would have similar comments like the ones about Hawkins above about MacIntyre if he was retained for a fifth season despite a 3 or 4 win 2016. Few people were calling for Hawkins to be fired after 2008, I think. Most were on the fence and even fairly supportive, the 2008 season could be spun and I believe we had some injury issues especially on the OL, but that CSU game at Folsom was a brutal wake up call for everyone and pretty much everybody realised he wasn´t the answer at that point.

 

[sackman]

It does make me wonder... Had we fired Hawkins in 2009 like we should have, who would we have hired as his replacement? Do we hire Embree then?

 

[Buffnik]

It does make me wonder... Had we fired Hawkins in 2009 like we should have, who would we have hired as his replacement? Do we hire Embree then?

McElwain would have been the hire at the end of 2009 for the 2010 season.

 

[fatbuff]

It does make me wonder... Had we fired Hawkins in 2009 like we should have, who would we have hired as his replacement? Do we hire Embree then?

Possibly. Both the firing and hiring were short-sighted financial decisions.

 

[aghcsm]

Hmm. I'm not quite sure if you are serious.

I am very sure he's not. Or at least shouldn't be.

 

[Jens1893]

Clemson, Auburn Tennessee and Washington were some big name vacancies that season. Coaches hired that year, among others, included Paul Rhoads (Auburn DC) at Iowa State, Dan Mullen (Florida OC) at Mississippi State, Brady Hoke at SDSU, Lane Kiffin at Tennessee, Sark at UW, Doug Marrone at Syracuse. Dabo Swinney and a certain Chip Kelly were in-house promotions at Clemson and Oregon. Guess you have to figure Sark would´ve been in play for us had we decided to make a change in 2009.

 

[Daaah]

Can anyone tell me what CU is on the hook for moneywise if they were to fire MMac this year?

 

[rosstr]

Just ask yourself one question. Is a guy who is 2-24 and can't recruit any better than 70th, has that guy been building a perennial top 25 program over the last three years?
No. So let him go.

 

[somebody]

I've been down on MM, especially the recruiting front. But I think that unless RG hears something positive from Les Miles (and I consider that different from generally "putting out feelers"), MM should get a 5th year. I would expect a bowl game next year and better recruiting. A bowl game and same-o recruiting would probably keep us in this seemingly endless cycle, but like my 401k, incremental improvement seems better than taking on a lot of risk.

 

[DBT]

Just ask yourself one question. Is a guy who is 2-24 and can't recruit any better than 70th, has that guy been building a perennial top 25 program over the last three years?
No. So let him go.

Ask Bill McCartney.

 

[aghcsm]

I would imagine MacIntyre is very aware he needs to make changes.

That may depend on whether he feels close losses are 'bad luck' or a pattern of failure. I think many of us thought 2014 was partly bad luck (multiple overtime losses - ), and it would be easy to superficially view close losses in 2015 the same way. In that case he may think he's on the right track and that major changes are not needed. With 2 straight years of many close losses, and with the serious pattern of red zone failure, I think most of us recognize the problems are systemic and require a fresh approach. My take is that MM will fail in 2016 if he doesn't make the correct adjustments, and certainly will fail if he makes no adjustments. However, I would have thought there could have been some moves to improve specific issues this year, and instead we're losing by 6 pts in the final game, failing in the red zone, missing FGs etc. so who knows, but assuming MM continues in 2016 as planned, nobody will feel he didn't get a fair shot.

 

[The Monk]

What are the recruiting consequences for a bad 4th year vs a new hire's first year? I don't think we have bad coaches at the coordinator level (minus lolnenias) or bad head coach when it comes to the actual game, but there really seems to be something missing in the management of where this team is going. Is anyone expecting this team to be significantly better next year, especially with regards to the OLine or QB, or the year after? We have new facilities, maybe we need to go with the momentum we have versus what we don't.

 

[ZandiBuff]

Ask Bill McCartney.

How many Bill Macs have occurred in the past 30 years of football vs. how many dan hawkins?

I'm tired of the "we just need to give him another year, mac had a losing record I year 3" arguments.

Anyone with brain cells can see lindgren is dead weight, neinas is actually brain dead and mac 2 can't even see it.

If we gave every coach 5 yrs, we'd have never had mac i

 

[leftybuff]

I cannot imagine RG sitting back and going: "OK, so we keep MikMac, on to the next agenda item". He is, IMO, looking around to see what he can do to upgrade, if he isn't he is a flop. I don't believe RG is a flop. Now is there an upgrade to be had? IDK, maybe not. The only way we see MikMac next year is if the pool of interested candidates is less attractive than him. Not very flattering.

 

[pcbuff]

B. My best friend would be meeting with Les Miles agents close Friend to see if an agreement on principle can be reached. In the interim I would set a meeting for this Thursday to hear MM's plans for the coming year. I don't know how he attracts any staff upgrades with his current predicament.

 

[DBT]

How many Bill Macs have occurred in the past 30 years of football vs. how many dan hawkins?

I'm tired of the "we just need to give him another year, mac had a losing record I year 3" arguments.

Anyone with brain cells can see lindgren is dead weight, neinas is actually brain dead and mac 2 can't even see it.

If we gave every coach 5 yrs, we'd have never had mac i

The point is it can be done and has been done. Mac's record so far is greatly attributable to what he inherited, isn't it?

 

[patebuff]

I don't see any issue with putting feelers out. Unless you can get a home run hire, you give Mac one more year.

 

[scbuff]

As much as I have watched the absurd amount of overtime, double overtime, close game after close game with the occasional blowout; MM took over a dumpster fire and worked to make a difference. There will have to be a change in OC, O line coach and ST. These are obvious. Rotation of running backs along with a QB not developing where there is the mental 3 second clock to get rid of the ball has been a killer over and over again. If (and a huge one) Miles is even remotely let go and wanted the job, then that's the go. If not, MM stays with the understanding that offensive changes will be made. If he's hard headed and wants to fight it then he needs to go and Leavitt is given the keys. It's unreal how the defense has turned. There has to be someone on the O side that would do the same as Leavitt has for the D. Those guys are doing everything they can and their is a true desire not to disappoint the man.

 

[DBT]

Who the hell knows what is going on behind the scenes? Who knows who RG is talking to or what he thinks? Who knows what Mac's plans are and who he's talking to? I"m not sure that anyone on this board does. I'd be pretty shocked and dismayed of changes aren't made. I just cannot imagine that Mac does not have a pretty good understanding of what needs to be fixed. He's a pretty astute guy from what I can tell. He's also really competitive. He has shown he has the wherewithal to make personnel changes.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

If you can get a Les Miles or obvious upgrade then we make the change.

Otherwise we stay with MM.

There are a lot of openings this year and I dont think we compete for anyone of consequence. Thus we are left taking a risk on an up and comer type like Scott Frost. Which makes Leavitt probably the safer hire.

 

[ebeyg]

Lindgren goes, new offensive coaches come in. Duplicate the improvements made on D this season. Mac has stabilized a toxic situation and most outside observers seem to be impressed with the positive momentum the program is showing. Just as frustrated as other buff fans (we should be 3 wins better, or more), but I'm realizing that the in game poor play calling is more correctable than dealing with another HC change. The overall play is vastly improved. Everything looks better. I say push forth and stay the course.






​

 

[Liver]

i'm not voting. i'm just going to watch and see what happens. i am not as down on lindgren as some. he looked like a genius last year when the o-line could protect a little bit better than truly awful. nienas is an easy target but he's a junior special teams coach-- if he's not getting the help he needs to not suck, then that is on mm.

my beef really breaks down to the strategy this staff employed: they went with what they knew worked at lower levels. diamonds in the rough and guys that can't play until they are 5th year seniors are not enough in the p5. we need raw talent. when he was hired, i expressed concern that he brought his whole staff and gave them huge raises. there wasn't a single p5 recruiter on the staff. he's definitely upgraded with the changes he's made, especially leavitt, and leavitt can recruit at this level, but you can't have your coordinators primarily responsible for prospecting. you need some stone cold killer assistants to go get blue chips. we don't have that. that's the failing in my view, fundamentally.

now, headed to year 4, i know for sure that if we made a big hire, we'd instantly upgrade recruiting and improve attendance and tv ratings and donations and press coverage.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

McElwain would have been the hire at the end of 2009 for the 2010 season.

His academic question responses during one interview would likely have been an obstacle.

 

[fatbuff]

Lindgren goes, new offensive coaches come in. Duplicate the improvements made on D this season. Mac has stabilized a toxic situation and most outside observers seem to be impressed with the positive momentum the program is showing. Just as frustrated as other buff fans (we should be 3 wins better, or more), but I'm realizing that the in game poor play calling is more correctable than dealing with another HC change. The overall play is vastly improved. Everything looks better. I say push forth and stay the course.






​

Yep. He stabilized us at the bottom of the conference. I'm constantly amazed at what is considered acceptable based on the season three years ago. Mediocrity ftw.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

i'm not voting. i'm just going to watch and see what happens. i am not as down on lindgren as some. he looked like a genius last year when the o-line could protect a little bit better than truly awful. nienas is an easy target but he's a junior special teams coach-- if he's not getting the help he needs to not suck, then that is on mm.

my beef really breaks down to the strategy this staff employed: they went with what they knew worked at lower levels. diamonds in the rough and guys that can't play until they are 5th year seniors are not enough in the p5. we need raw talent. when he was hired, i expressed concern that he brought his whole staff and gave them huge raises. there wasn't a single p5 recruiter on the staff. he's definitely upgraded with the changes he's made, especially leavitt, and leavitt can recruit at this level, but you can't have your coordinators primarily responsible for prospecting. you need some stone cold killer assistants to go get blue chips. we don't have that. that's the failing in my view, fundamentally.

now, headed to year 4, i know for sure that if we made a big hire, we'd instantly upgrade recruiting and improve attendance and tv ratings and donations and press coverage.

Im not as down on Lindgren because the OL really limited what we could do. Im not down on Sefo either since he had to play behind them and he had a shoulderr injury most of the year. He was a different qb without PRich

That said how does it get better next year?

And its probably not going to get a lot better. Part of what were witnessing is the lack of maturity from the players we have and some of that came from poor recruiting by the current and past coaches.

 

[DBT]

i am not as down on lindgren as some. he looked like a genius last year when the o-line could protect a little bit better than truly awful.

I agree. I'm kind of confused with the Lindgren hate. Maybe we can upgrade, I don't know. But he had a difficult task this year. And, be honest, with Sefo going out, we definitely had a drop in talent at QB. That isn't to say Apsay can't be the guy next year, but he was a downgrade from Sefo this year. I think we have a good shot at winning 2 of the last 3 if Sefo doesn't go down.

 

[BuffinCali]

MM - Is not a great recruiter. Is not a very good in-game time coach. Is not preparing his team in practices (how many times has the coaching cost CU this season via improper clock management, poor call selection, inability to make changes?).
The team has improved from an effort stand point. But MM looks lost on the field. I would prefer to see Leavitt elevated before he leaves for a head coaching position. He is already making a difference in the players effort, attitude, recruiting and in-game changes. If recruiting, coaching, preparing and increasing effort are overlooked, at least looking at his FBS record vs. MM should tilt the scales.
I trust Leavitt leading the program - MM, not so much!

 

[96 Buff]

Time to move onto someone who understands the importance of recruiting.