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What is Tadball?

CU doesn't deserve Tad Boyle after reading through a lot of this. Tad has worked his butt off to build this program. If we didn't lost our big man to injury and had Battey, this team jumps up a tier. Look at what he has been able to do in his short time here. Tad has put players into the NBA who are performing at a high level while pulling CU from an abyss. I have seen him around campus handing out tickets to get kids to go to games. If Tad isn't the type of coach we want, what are our expectations? I couldn't be more thrilled to call him a Buff and he has genuine drive, he's stated multiple times that this job is his dream job.

The board definitely has some posters that are way more negative than necessary. I'm a Tad supporter, but also think he deserves some fair criticism - both extremes of positivity or negativity are flawed views imo. That's great to hear that he's interacting with students on campus - didn't know that story. Lastly, we may be his dream job, but if he rights the ship and becomes a hot national name again, and Self gets caught for his loose morals with coeds, I can see his dream job changing.

I just finished a little research related to recruiting and players Tad and his staff have attempted to get. Since 2012, besides the players that have been signed, the coaching staff has extended offers to an additional (15) Top 100 recruits. That list includes "familiar names" like : Jabari Bird [Cal] : Dakarai Allen [San Diego State] : Tyler Dorsey [Oregon] : Bennie Boatwright [USC] : Chance Comanche [Arizona] : De'Ron Davis [Indiana] ... among many others.

So they are definitely trying to reach out and snag the best players that they can, It's just so difficult! In fact, back in 2014/2015 CU had extended offers to another 10 recruits, six of whom were in the Top 100, before (this is conjecture on my part) they kind of finally had to settle in on two lower rated recruits in Akyazili and Guzonjic.

Fair, and I remember those names. However, I wonder how strong we go after top 100 kids we offer. Perhaps I do not give Tad enough credit for chasing more talented HS kids bc of his lack of success, but for now, my opinion is still what it is. His latest moves with assistant coaches is promising though.
 
I just finished a little research related to recruiting and players Tad and his staff have attempted to get. Since 2012, besides the players that have been signed, the coaching staff has extended offers to an additional (15) Top 100 recruits. That list includes "familiar names" like : Jabari Bird [Cal] : Dakarai Allen [San Diego State] : Tyler Dorsey [Oregon] : Bennie Boatwright [USC] : Chance Comanche [Arizona] : De'Ron Davis [Indiana] ... among many others.

Also Ethan Chargois who signed with SMU, like the Aussie Froling did.
Ethan averaging 12.6 points, 5.6 rebounds and shooting 53.2% from field (43.9 from 3)
So players have been identified and chose to go elsewhere
 
Also Ethan Chargois who signed with SMU, like the Aussie Froling did.
Ethan averaging 12.6 points, 5.6 rebounds and shooting 53.2% from field (43.9 from 3)
So players have been identified and chose to go elsewhere
As far as I can remember, Boyle had the choice of Battey and Chargois and chose Battey. Though maybe he took Battey after Ethan left.

For more of these near misses, they killed Boyle in 2015. We were in the top 2 for Landry Shamet and Tyler Dorsey. Caruso was between CU and A&M, Thomas Welch visited CU before he chose UCLA, the list goes on. We do well until the end.
 
As far as I can remember, Boyle had the choice of Battey and Chargois and chose Battey. Though maybe he took Battey after Ethan left.

For more of these near misses, they killed Boyle in 2015. We were in the top 2 for Landry Shamet and Tyler Dorsey. Caruso was between CU and A&M, Thomas Welch visited CU before he chose UCLA, the list goes on. We do well until the end.

Very good points. 2014/2015 is the A #1 year that initially destabilized the program. They suddenly went from 3-peat NCAA tourney program to a losing season. Then Booker quit the team in the postseason and that created some weird vibes. Then both Hopkins and Thomas left and things suddenly felt very wobbly.
Then they went after so many promising players for their 2015 recruiting class, and one by one got nothing. They settled for two lower grade players (Akyazili and Guzonjic) and hoped for the best. What that "recruiting class" did was only add fuel to the building flames, as they got zero relief from either player.
 
I used to view Tadball as defense and rebounding. Both can be done well with effort and don't require the most talent in the gym (of course a baseline of talent is required to go with the effort). Not seeing enough of that this year.
Tadball offense? I have no clue. I recall the days of RPatton coaching and zero offensive strategy or plays. Always expect Tad to NOT coach offense in that manner but sometimes I wonder.
 
I used to view Tadball as defense and rebounding. Both can be done well with effort and don't require the most talent in the gym (of course a baseline of talent is required to go with the effort). Not seeing enough of that this year.
Tadball offense? I have no clue. I recall the days of RPatton coaching and zero offensive strategy or plays. Always expect Tad to NOT coach offense in that manner but sometimes I wonder.

Because I was curious (NR - National Rank):

Year CU OR%NROpp OR%NROpp eFG% NR
2017-1830.5%13524.5%2949.7% 129
2016-17 33%5828.3% 134 50.3% 161
2015-1634.8%3624.8% 10 46.8% 47
2014-15 34.4%6628%45 48.9% 162
2013-1434%8526.1%6 49.4%159
2012-13 33.6%10530.4%108 45.9% 69
2011-12 28.7%13428.2% 58 46.9% 75
2010-11 33%2131.3% 210 50.6% 242
[TBODY] [/TBODY]

Obvious disclaimer of this season is only 2 conference games so far, but....

We're not hitting the boards as hard on the offensive side - probably a side effect of being small. Tad is holding the guys back. We are doing a pretty good job of keeping opponents off of the boards though. And our D is actually middle of the pack.
 
That was Tadball.
Yep. At a certain point midway through the 2nd half, we were down by 8 but were closing the rebound gap while ASU's shooting percentage had been going down. I turned to @Darth Snow and said "We're going to win this game".

To his credit, he predicted a win before it even started because he knew we could match up on size. Tadball carried the night.
 
Yep. At a certain point midway through the 2nd half, we were down by 8 but were closing the rebound gap while ASU's shooting percentage had been going down. I turned to @Darth Snow and said "We're going to win this game".

To his credit, he predicted a win before it even started because he knew we could match up on size. Tadball carried the night.
Still thought you were crazy
 
One of his best coaching jobs ever. He gave a lot of credit to one of his assistants for the game plan. He said the switched between zone and man and kept ASU out of kilter. They played zone after misses and man after makes. (I think I got that right.)
 
This is Tadball, too:
Colorado: The Buffaloes improved to 16-29 against ranked teams under Boyle. The 16 wins represents more than 25 percent of the school's victories over ranked opponents (60) since 1949-50
http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/recap?gameId=400988298

To put this in perspective, Tad has coached 11% (7 seasons) of the last 67, while delivering 27% of the victories over top 25 teams.
 
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Yep. At a certain point midway through the 2nd half, we were down by 8 but were closing the rebound gap while ASU's shooting percentage had been going down. I turned to @Darth Snow and said "We're going to win this game".

To his credit, he predicted a win before it even started because he knew we could match up on size. Tadball carried the night.

I looked up at the stats board with about 5 minutes to go and couldn't believe the Buffs FG% was higher than ASU's, especially after the dismal start in the 1st half.
 
Think Tad self-mutilates after the amount of zone he's played the last few games?
I think he's coming around to the benefits. It keeps the other team off balance and also makes his own offense better because they have to practice against multiple looks.
 
I think he's coming around to the benefits. It keeps the other team off balance and also makes his own offense better because they have to practice against multiple looks.
I was also impressed with the offense from this game. They ran 4 high at the free throw line bringing Ayton and Ristic away from the hoop. I've noticed Boyle giving credit to Grier and English for some game plans. Does anyone know who was in charge of this one? Obviously Boyle signs off on them, but it seems some of the new blood and ideas on the coaching staff is starting to show.
 
I was also impressed with the offense from this game. They ran 4 high at the free throw line bringing Ayton and Ristic away from the hoop. I've noticed Boyle giving credit to Grier and English for some game plans. Does anyone know who was in charge of this one? Obviously Boyle signs off on them, but it seems some of the new blood and ideas on the coaching staff is starting to show.
The staff has been seriously upgraded the last two years, and it shows
 
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Tadball? That's easy.

To me Tadball is a function of three things:

1. A Head Coach that truly does not get the game on a sophisticated enough level to compete in Pac-12 men's basketball. Tad is a gimmicky coach that wants to preach defense and rebounding, and will cite statistics showing when he gets what he wants with his metrics how successful the program can be. However, good coaches don't just coach the 25% of the games where the outcomes align with their preferences. Good coaches understand offensive and defensive schemes well enough to put the players they do have in positions to be successful, not bemoaning what the players they do have, aren't doing. Remember, Tad was just a Greeley prep star that was a nobody in college. This isn't John Stockton whose knowledge of the game allowed him to be successful at every level.

2. A Head Coach that is constantly and consistently throwing his own players under the bus to temper and deflect expectations of his abilities. How many seasons have we seen Tad bemoan "a lack of leadership" amongst his players, or complain about how "this group" is committing too many turnovers and making poor decisions with the ball? In successive seasons we've seen Tad try to diminish expectations, essentially throwing in the towel saying, "I haven't recruited good enough players, I'm not a good enough coach to work with what I do have. The hallmark of a Tad coached team is that he can't work with what he has to make them successful, he needs them to be what he wants. Well so does every other coach in the land. McDonald's All-Americans are scarce. This is a Pac-12 school, and the group of recruits we have access to do not believe Tad can develop their game and help them get better. Josh Scott could have been a veritable superstar under a competent coach.

3. Tad is not a natural leader. I was in Greeley last summer on the UNC campus for some basketball camps and it was amazing how many people had a story about not liking Tad Boyle. It seemed everybody and their brother around the NoCo camp had a husband or a brother that had played with Tad in high school and did not have positive things to say about him as a person. His message works at CU because college sports are tyrannical, and he can play the role of the despot, and he gets smiling new shiny faces at worst every five seasons that haven't heard his tired script before.

4. He's just a decidedly mediocre Pac-12 coach and really hasn't accomplished any different track record than Ricardo Patton. Say what you want about the lack of tradition of men's basketball at CU. Say what you want about the Pac-1 2 being a tough basketball conference. However, at the end of the day no reasonable argument can be made that Tad Boyle is anything but decidedly mediocre as a Pac-12 coach. Through his first seven full seasons at CU Tad Boyle was 149-95 but was only 64-61 in conference play. Successful Pac-12 programs don't rely on non-conference wins to get to the CBI or NIT, or NCAA tourneys. After his first seven full seasons at CU, and Ricardo Patton was starting from a lower floor, he was 121-94 but was only 51-61 in conference play. There is a difference, but Tad coached CU over 244 games those first seven seasons and Ricardo Patton only coached CU over 215. After his first seven years Tad Boyle only had a .610 winning percentage whereas after his first seven years Ricardo Patton had a .562 winning percentage. That's a variance of just .048 between Tad Boyle and Ricardo Patton's winning percentage after seven years. If we just look at conference play after their first seven full seasons, Tad Boyle has a conference winning percentage of just .512, the very definition of mediocre. In comparison Ricardo Patton had a conference winning percentage of .455. The variance between Tad Boyle and Ricardo Patton in conference winning percentage is just .057

(can someone check my maths?)

Ricardo Patton coached four more years for the Buffs and had a winning record and managed a 20 win season. Something that was very rare in Colorado. Additionally, our Buffs hadn't been to the NCAA tournament since 1969 when Ricardo Patton turned the program around and made the Buffs nationally relevant again. Even more impressive was the fact that Patton did that following the train wreck era of Bzdelik's Buffs who only won .383 of their games. Ricardo Patton got the Buffs to the NCAA tournament twice, and the NIT four times at CU.

At Northern Colorado Tad coached four years and managed only ONE season with a winning record. Tad Boyle was just 28-36 in the Big Sky conference play during his time at NoCo. If you hire Tad Boyle for the Ricardo Patton years, and then hire Ricardo Patton for the Tad Boyle years do you expect Ricardo to improve upon what he inherited? I think you reasonably do.

I think its hilarious that a couple of years ago fans were worried that Boyle was going to leave CU to take the Kansas job, or some other higher profile job. At this point can anyone seriously consider Tad Boyle a good college basketball coach? He's been treading water for CU making millions of dollars, and neither has the recruiting aptitude nor the X's and O's scheme acumen to effectively coach at this level. He literally is just a Colorado high school star that flamed out at the college level, and has been handed the golden goose at CU, a program with almost zero expectations. Why? Because Tad Boyle managed to not have a losing season one year out of his four at NoCo! He didn't lose that one time at NoCo, let's give him a lifetime appointment to Coach CU!

What is Tad Ball? Here are his conference final placements in the Pac-12:

5th (tied)
5th (tied)
5th
3rd (tied)
8th (tied)
5th
7th

The Buffs currently sit 6th overall in the Pac-12 for 2017-18 with a mediocre 3-3 conference record.

What is Tad Ball?

Its mediocrity by a coach in over his head, without the chops to develop incoming players, and without the recruiting aptitude to trend the program upward, who quite frankly is just happy to cash his million plus annual salary. Its a stagnant program with a coach that is trying to just survive, not thrive. Tad Boyle gets better player at CU than he did at NoCo, unfortunately, CU doesn't get a better coach.

It will be interesting to compare Rodney Billups's development as a coach at DU (with Ricardo Patton on his staff) to Tad's first four years at NoCo. In the end I think we need to bring Chauncey back to CU to run this program. Unlike Tad, Chauncey wasn't just a HS player who flamed out in college. Chauncey would have the recruiting chops and understands being a HS phenom in Colorado. He would relate to the recruits and kids better.

It is baffling to me how there are no expectations or standards for Men's Basketball at CU. Its like Tad Boyle has compromising pictures of Rick George or something. Nothing else seems to make sense.
 
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Tadball? That's easy.

To me Tadball is a function of three things:

1. A Head Coach that truly does not get the game on a sophisticated enough level to compete in Pac-12 men's basketball. Tad is a gimmicky coach that wants to preach defense and rebounding, and will cite statistics showing when he gets what he wants with his metrics how successful the program can be. However, good coaches don't just coach the 25% of the games where the outcomes align with their preferences. Good coaches understand offensive and defensive schemes well enough to put the players they do have in positions to be successful, not bemoaning what the players they do have, aren't doing. Remember, Tad was just a Greeley prep star that was a nobody in college. This isn't John Stockton whose knowledge of the game allowed him to be successful at every level.

2. A Head Coach that is constantly and consistently throwing his own players under the bus to temper and deflect expectations of his abilities. How many seasons have we seen Tad bemoan "a lack of leadership" amongst his players, or complain about how "this group" is committing too many turnovers and making poor decisions with the ball? In successive seasons we've seen Tad try to diminish expectations, essentially throwing in the towel saying, "I haven't recruited good enough players, I'm not a good enough coach to work with what I do have. The hallmark of a Tad coached team is that he can't work with what he has to make them successful, he needs them to be what he wants. Well so does every other coach in the land. McDonald's All-Americans are scarce. This is a Pac-12 school, and the group of recruits we have access to do not believe Tad can develop their game and help them get better. Josh Scott could have been a veritable superstar under a competent coach.

3. Tad is not a natural leader. I was in Greeley last summer on the UNC campus for some basketball camps and it was amazing how many people had a story about not liking Tad Boyle. It seemed everybody and their brother around the NoCo camp had a husband or a brother that had played with Tad in high school and did not have positive things to say about him as a person. His message works at CU because college sports are tyrannical, and he can play the role of the despot, and he gets smiling new shiny faces at worst every five seasons that haven't heard his tired script before.

4. He's just a decidedly mediocre Pac-12 coach and really hasn't accomplished any different track record than Ricardo Patton. Say what you want about the lack of tradition of men's basketball at CU. Say what you want about the Pac-1 2 being a tough basketball conference. However, at the end of the day no reasonable argument can be made that Tad Boyle is anything but decidedly mediocre as a Pac-12 coach. Through his first seven full seasons at CU Tad Boyle was 149-95 but was only 64-61 in conference play. Successful Pac-12 programs don't rely on non-conference wins to get to the CBI or NIT, or NCAA tourneys. After his first seven full seasons at CU, and Ricardo Patton was starting from a lower floor, he was 121-94 but was only 51-61 in conference play. There is a difference, but Tad coached CU over 244 games those first seven seasons and Ricardo Patton only coached CU over 215. After his first seven years Tad Boyle only had a .610 winning percentage whereas after his first seven years Ricardo Patton had a .562 winning percentage. That's a variance of just .048 between Tad Boyle and Ricardo Patton's winning percentage after seven years. If we just look at conference play after their first seven full seasons, Tad Boyle has a conference winning percentage of just .512, the very definition of mediocre. In comparison Ricardo Patton had a conference winning percentage of .455. The variance between Tad Boyle and Ricardo Patton in conference winning percentage is just .057

(can someone check my maths?)

Ricardo Patton coached four more years for the Buffs and had a winning record and managed a 20 win season. Something that was very rare in Colorado. Additionally, our Buffs hadn't been to the NCAA tournament since 1969 when Ricardo Patton turned the program around and made the Buffs nationally relevant again. Even more impressive was the fact that Patton did that following the train wreck era of Bzdelik's Buffs who only won .383 of their games. Ricardo Patton got the Buffs to the NCAA tournament twice, and the NIT four times at CU.

At Northern Colorado Tad coached four years and managed only ONE season with a winning record. Tad Boyle was just 28-36 in the Big Sky conference play during his time at NoCo. If you hire Tad Boyle for the Ricardo Patton years, and then hire Ricardo Patton for the Tad Boyle years do you expect Ricardo to improve upon what he inherited? I think you reasonably do.

I think its hilarious that a couple of years ago fans were worried that Boyle was going to leave CU to take the Kansas job, or some other higher profile job. At this point can anyone seriously consider Tad Boyle a good college basketball coach? He's been treading water for CU making millions of dollars, and neither has the recruiting aptitude nor the X's and O's scheme acumen to effectively coach at this level. He literally is just a Colorado high school star that flamed out at the college level, and has been handed the golden goose at CU, a program with almost zero expectations. Why? Because Tad Boyle managed to not have a losing season one year out of his four at NoCo! He didn't lose that one time at NoCo, let's give him a lifetime appointment to Coach CU!

What is Tad Ball? Here are his conference final placements in the Pac-12:

5th (tied)
5th (tied)
5th
3rd (tied)
8th (tied)
5th
7th

The Buffs currently sit 6th overall in the Pac-12 for 2017-18 with a mediocre 3-3 conference record.

What is Tad Ball?

Its mediocrity by a coach in over his head, without the chops to develop incoming players, and without the recruiting aptitude to trend the program upward, who quite frankly is just happy to cash his million plus annual salary. Its a stagnant program with a coach that is trying to just survive, not thrive. Tad Boyle gets better player at CU than he did at NoCo, unfortunately, CU doesn't get a better coach.
Yeah, he's just Ricardo Patton.

Winning % at CU:

Tad overall 60.9%, conference 51.2%
Patton 53.5%, 43.8%

Those look like effective numbers to me, and they are very different. I'm not sure why you chose Patton as a comparison to Tad. How do you define effective coaching?
 
You know, I thought for a second you might have some decent insight to provide. Even though I disagree with you, I was willing to engage in conversation.

Then you mentioned how no coach uses the OOC to get to the tourney. Yes they do. Every year. You have to be a scheduling guru sometimes to get your RPI to the correct levels, which Tad has shown a knack for doing. But even this I was willing to forgive.

However, you completely lost all legitimacy when you claim Patton turned around the program after Bzdelik. Tad Boyle turned the program around after Bzdelik. Boyle has had 5 20win seasons at Colorado. Patton had 3. Walseth has 1. I would argue that the only reason Patton got to his first NCAA tournament is because he had an NBA all-star and potential hall of famer in Chauncey Billups. Since Sox Walseth was coach, CU has only been to the dance 6 times. 4 of those come from Tad Boyle.

In the 115 years of Colorado basketball, CU has only won the regular season conference title 19 times and those were way back in the Mountain Sports Conference, and the Big 7/8. They have only won the conference tournament once. Tad Boyle did that.

3-3 in conference is not a great record. It is pretty mediocre as you say. However it involves 3 road losses (honestly expected), 2 top 15 wins and a road win at UCLA. While the number looks pretty mediocre, that is a damn good start to conference play if you ask any objective person.
 
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