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What's the Story on S & C ?

DBT said:
I'd bet most programs have a very competent S&C coach. It isn't like Forman has some magic formula that no one else has. It has more to the guys you are working with than the work those guys are doing.
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True to an extent. But the S & C guy can change attitudes about the purpose of wthat work: Weight room competition (lauding the heavyist lifts, etc.) isn't the same as competing on the field.

If you compete in the WRm (as the Buffs did under the WB regime, you're working on your strengths to "win" there, instead of on your weaknesses as Foreman requires; which makes much more sense. (In my brief coaching experience working with my kids in our greenbelt/playground trainings, I always made 'em work with their "opposite" hand or foot(weakness) twice as much, since both were right-handed and its plain hard and unnatural to do so. Yet, a few seasons of that and I frequently had other parents come up to me during a game to say "they had no idea my kid was "left-handed/left-footed" after watching a nifty play with that off-hand/foot. So I get where Foreman is coming from.
 
DBT said:
I'd bet most programs have a very competent S&C coach. It isn't like Forman has some magic formula that no one else has. It has more to the guys you are working with than the work those guys are doing.
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In my experience, quite the opposite. Every single "breakthrough" in terms of noticeable differences in S&C have always come down to advances in "nutritional formulas"....

How people can look at Ray Lewis' physique (or any number of NFL players) and think you can look like that without Steroids or HGH continues to boggle my mind.

Certainly for strength and speed (not flexibility, injury prevention, etc), Chemistry is playing a much larger role than any slight edge in terms of "designed workouts".
 
DBT said:
I'd bet most programs have a very competent S&C coach. It isn't like Forman has some magic formula that no one else has. It has more to the guys you are working with than the work those guys are doing.
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I think it also has to do with motivation...which is on the coach. Get these kids believing and feeling it and they will go beyond expectations.
 
buffaholic said:
In my experience, quite the opposite. Every single "breakthrough" in terms of noticeable differences in S&C have always come down to advances in "nutritional formulas"....

How people can look at Ray Lewis' physique (or any number of NFL players) and think you can look like that without Steroids or HGH continues to boggle my mind.

Certainly for strength and speed (not flexibility, injury prevention, etc), Chemistry is playing a much larger role than any slight edge in terms of "designed workouts".
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Ray Lewis did it with the blood of his two victims, a vampire dont'cha know? Or did he just settle with their families out of a sense of charity?
 
BuffClass90 said:
I think it also has to do with motivation...which is on the coach. Get these kids believing and feeling it and they will go beyond expectations.
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Apparently he doesn't allow music in the weight room. If the players can't get motivated without it they shouldn't be there.
 
Also, and I don't know what level of importance it is, the S&C guy is the "coach" during summer workouts. So the more he knows X's and O's the better. I'm sure he observes and reports to the HC.
 
'Tini said:
I disagree completely with your last sentence.
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There have been studies done that interestingly show that certain music, (usually with a heavy beat and bass), will quite literally cause strength to fail during exercise.

Call it harmonic disconvergence or whatever, I've watched some examples of it. Seems like voodoo or hocus pocus, but, then again other studies show listening to Mozart measurably increases the brain's alpha waves. Who knows? I remember Jeff Madden was real big on music during workouts. When he went to U Tex, after a couple of years, observers down there really got on his case for lack of strength improvement of the team.

But, hey, this team needs every edge, trick, break, or whatever, it can get! I'll go with Forman's judgement on music over yours.
 
WizzersGhost said:
There have been studies done that interestingly show that certain music, (usually with a heavy beat and bass), will quite literally cause strength to fail during exercise.

Call it harmonic disconvergence or whatever, I've watched some examples of it. Seems like voodoo or hocus pocus, but, then again other studies show listening to Mozart measurably increases the brain's alpha waves. Who knows? I remember Jeff Madden was real big on music during workouts. When he went to U Tex, after a couple of years, observers down there really got on his case for lack of strength improvement of the team.

But, hey, this team needs every edge, trick, break, or whatever, it can get! I'll go with Forman's judgement on music over yours.
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Why don't ya go ahead and back up that claim
 
'Tini said:
Why don't ya go ahead and back up that claim
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Not a claim, just a report. I'll still go with Forman and leave you with this humorous little quote*:

SHUT THE F**K UP and train! Somewhere out there, a guy is doing a curl with your squat max!



*Don't get all solipsistic on me, its not about you!
 
WizzersGhost said:
Not a claim, just a report. I'll still go with Forman and leave you with this humorous little quote*:

SHUT THE F**K UP and train! Somewhere out there, a guy is doing a curl with your squat max!



*Don't get all solipsistic on me, its not about you!
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You're making a claim without backing it up with evidence. Music can give you a psychological advantage from experience
 
Don't listen to Tini and his 145lb frame.

I've lifted with some badasses at powerlifiting gyms. No music was ever played unlike a lot of globo gyms. I find music helps with endurance events more so than squatting, bench press and deadlifts. You have to be focused on the movement. So I have as much experience as you do.

But I'd also like to see the report as well. It would validate what I've seen.
 
NMBuff said:
Don't listen to Tini and his 145lb frame.

I've lifted with some badasses at powerlifiting gyms. No music was ever played unlike a lot of globo gyms. I find music helps with endurance events more so than squatting, bench press and deadlifts. You have to be focused on the movement. So I have as much experience as you do.

But I'd also like to see the report as well. It would validate what I've seen.
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And I've seen plenty of "badasses" who lift with headphones in
 
I love weightlifting slap fights. Whoever can bench the most and grunt the loudest wins.
 
'Tini said:
And I've seen plenty of "badasses" who lift with headphones in
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Yup, but I've never seen a competitive powerlifter or oly lifter do so. You think guys that play in the NFL or at CU are strong? :lol:
 
NMBuff said:
Yup, but I've never seen a competitive powerlifter or oly lifter do so. You think guys that play in the NFL or at CU are strong? :lol:
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When did I say they were? I'm not opposed to the idea that headphones decrease performance, but I want to see a study that actually says that, not just some random post.
 
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CUSoldier said:
Apparently he doesn't allow music in the weight room. If the players can't get motivated without it they shouldn't be there.
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IIRC, I read an article this week that said that there would be music in the weight room, just not to expect to hear Metallica.
 
'Tini said:
You're making a claim without backing it up with evidence. Music can give you a psychological advantage from experience
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While I agree that music can help some people when lifting, your anecdotal evidence doesn't prove anything. As a lifter and coach, sometimes I've used music to help with the atmosphere, but other times I don't allow it in the weight room.
 
WizzersGhost said:
Do we have a new coach for strength and conditioning? Has he set up a new regime for this team? What are the major changes in emphasis? What are the preliminary assessments on his style?
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I can guarantee you that S&C will have literally zero effects on W/L column. Evidence? CU's last ten years.

Let them do P90x and save the money. Use that money to pay for recruits like Oregon and you'll get far better ROI.
 
rosstr said:
I can guarantee you that S&C will have literally zero effects on W/L column. Evidence? CU's last ten years.

Let them do P90x and save the money. Use that money to pay for recruits like Oregon and you'll get far better ROI.
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Wow
 
Many of the reasons SF has been such a good team this year has been their health throughout the year. The reason? The players say its because they spend so much time stretching. There was an entire SI article on it. Not sure if there is anything to it, but I bet it is part of the new ST program.
 
14er said:
I love weightlifting slap fights. Whoever can bench the most and grunt the loudest wins.
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Eggzackly what Forman hopes to avoid! Don't need "wins" in the WRm, need 'em on the field.

Go to any gym and watch the noobs with headphones straining to do their lifts with too much weight and gawd-awful form. You just feel sorry for their lower backs. Easier to concentrate on form and technique when you're not blasting Iron Maiden into your skull.
 
WizzersGhost said:
Eggzackly what Forman hopes to avoid! Don't need "wins" in the WRm, need 'em on the field.

Go to any gym and watch the noobs with headphones straining to do their lifts with too much weight and gawd-awful form. You just feel sorry for their lower backs. Easier to concentrate on form and technique when you're not blasting Iron Maiden into your skull.
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I see you still haven't provided proof of your claim
 
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