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CU Buffs hire former Minnesota OC Mike Sanford as their new OC

It still makes me mad and I'm not even a real Minnesota fan (ASU). Rarely do us "also ran" type teams have what UMN had going for it, so when one blows it, it kinda sucks. Minnesota's offense wasn't "Bad". They were actually pretty alright at a glance. Ball control, converted first downs, etc. The problem is that for a team that probably recruits on a similar level to Colorado, or at least is decidedly not pulling an abundance of 4 and 5 star types, the Gophers were LOADED. QB? Threw for 3k, 30 TDs at a better than 4 to 1 TD to Int rate before he got there and rough since. Running back? Mo ****ing Ibrahim, who prior to his Achilles blowing up was in the argument for best RB in the country (and was an established star prior to Sanford). Also a deep room of backups. OL? Arguably the best in the country, unarguably top 5. Several NFL players, I think 3 with 40+ starts. It might have been the biggest and most experienced offensive line in college football history with the COVID year. TE's? Kieft was one of the best blocking TE's in football and Spann-Ford is an exceptional athlete for his size that didn't get used. WRs? Two good ones who spent some time hurt, so that's sort of an excuse for his "passing is evil" frame of mind, but still. UMN wasn't bad off there.

Then they had a top 5-10ish defense where Nyles Pinckney, former Clemson captain, All ACC and National Championship winning DT, was the 3rd best DL on the team (the other 2 were Senior Bowl invites).

For a lower to mid echelon recruiting P5 team, Minnesota had the goods. It was the sort of experience and talent level most programs are building towards. It would have been the exclamation point on their top 10 2019 season. And they blew two games against awful teams while giving up only 14 points a piece. They were probably better than Iowa too. The problems were almost exclusively on a predictable offense that could be just woudn't punish people for loading up. Minnesota should have gone 10-2 or 11-1 in the regular season, and the reasons they didn't all point to Sanford just not being very good.

Even if Colorado does go out and develop a whole bunch of NFL caliber talent, he'll still find a way to **** it up. But hey, maybe he's learning and will get better, or something. So I guess there's that.
Well reasoned and stated.

At best, the hire is filled with cautionary tales and hope. At worst, the nowhere-near MN level OL talent, pipeline, recruiting, etc. will doom CU into further sputter and suck. The staff will all be fired in two years. Rinse, repeat.
 
Yeah, something obviously changed somewhere. I am starting to wonder if the loan RG took out was part of this or at least was earmarked for this? If so, that money won't be around forever, but would at least show some forward thinking on his part.
The loan was forced on RG. CU was the only school to take it. Why? Because every other PAC 12 school stepped up and covered the budget shortfall. Not at CU. DiStefano refused to do what every other school in our own conference was willing to do.
 
The loan was forced on RG. CU was the only school to take it. Why? Because every other PAC 12 school stepped up and covered the budget shortfall. Not at CU. DiStefano refused to do what every other school in our own conference was willing to do.
Then Phil said that KD & RG couldn't make certain personnel changes because of the optics of taking that loan & then having new dead money on the books.
 
I don't know big Phil. But I don't see anything wrong with him trying to be fiscally responsible. Football is not the only thing that defines CU. CU can win games and also be fiscally responsible. When you start covering budget shortfalls or writing them off. It will lead to irresponsible activity that will lead to a larger budget deficit. CU is not a money bag.
 
I don't know big Phil. But I don't see anything wrong with him trying to be fiscally responsible. Football is not the only thing that defines CU. CU can win games and also be fiscally responsible. When you start covering budget shortfalls or writing them off. It will lead to irresponsible activity that will lead to a larger budget deficit. CU is not a money bag.
Because we are better than Cal, UCLA and UW in that way!
 
It still makes me mad and I'm not even a real Minnesota fan (ASU). Rarely do us "also ran" type teams have what UMN had going for it, so when one blows it, it kinda sucks. Minnesota's offense wasn't "Bad". They were actually pretty alright at a glance. Ball control, converted third downs, etc. The problem is that for a team that probably recruits on a similar level to Colorado, or at least is decidedly not pulling an abundance of 4 and 5 star types, the Gophers were LOADED. QB? Threw for 3k, 30 TDs at a better than 4 to 1 TD to Int rate before he got there and rough since. Running back? Mo ****ing Ibrahim, who prior to his Achilles blowing up was in the argument for best RB in the country (and was an established star prior to Sanford). Also a deep room of backups. OL? Arguably the best in the country, unarguably top 5. Several NFL players, I think 3 with 40+ starts. It might have been the biggest and most experienced offensive line in college football history with the COVID year. TE's? Kieft was one of the best blocking TE's in football and Spann-Ford is an exceptional athlete for his size that didn't get used. WRs? Two good ones who spent some time hurt, so that's sort of an excuse for his "passing is evil" frame of mind, but still. UMN wasn't bad off there.

Then they had a top 5-10ish defense where Nyles Pinckney, former Clemson captain, All ACC and National Championship winning DT, was the 3rd best DL on the team (the other 2 were Senior Bowl invites).

For a lower to mid echelon recruiting P5 team, Minnesota had the goods. It was the sort of experience and talent level most programs are building towards. It would have been the exclamation point on their top 10 2019 season. And they blew two games against awful teams while giving up only 14 points a piece. They were probably better than Iowa too. The problems were almost exclusively on a predictable offense that could be be terrific but just wouldn't punish people for loading up. Minnesota should have gone 10-2 or 11-1 in the regular season, and the reasons they didn't all point to Sanford just not being very good.

Even if Colorado does go out and develop a whole bunch of NFL caliber talent, he'll still find a way to **** it up. But hey, maybe he's learning and will get better, or something. So I guess there's that.

edited: I undeleted it since it was quoted. Originally just didn't want to fill your forum up with an anti Sanford text wall but since the cat's out of the bag...
Do you live in the Cities? Because you nailed this like you do. This is pretty much spot on and goes to show why an excellent coach like Fleck dumped some dead coaching weight this offseason.
 
I don't know big Phil. But I don't see anything wrong with him trying to be fiscally responsible. Football is not the only thing that defines CU. CU can win games and also be fiscally responsible. When you start covering budget shortfalls or writing them off. It will lead to irresponsible activity that will lead to a larger budget deficit. CU is not a money bag.
The CU AD had been in the black for many years proving fiscal responsibility. This was an unprecedented time where ever other university in the conference chose to cover their athletic department so they did not have to take out a loan. CU did not. Not sure how you can defend this.
 
last I saw the interest rate CU is paying on that loan to the Pac-12 wasn't known. hard to judge whether the decision to take the money was sound or not without that piece of information.
 
The CU AD had been in the black for many years proving fiscal responsibility. This was an unprecedented time where ever other university in the conference chose to cover their athletic department so they did not have to take out a loan. CU did not. Not sure how you can defend this.
The AD department is not the only department struggling financially due to Covid. There is nothing wrong with taking a loan. Well it depends on the terms of the loan.
 
last I saw the interest rate CU is paying on that loan to the Pac-12 wasn't known. hard to judge whether the decision to take the money was sound or not without that piece of information.
We don’t know it but CU and their peer institutions across the PAC12 know what the terms were. This is either a case of CU being wiser and more opportunistic than their peers, taking great advantage of a lucrative offer of $ or CU being forced to do something that no other peer institution was willing to undertake.

So, CU being a) super savvy or, b) exposed for poor administrative execution and support. Which could it be?
 
If the interest rate is low, then there’s no reason not to take the loan, it would be irresponsible not to. If the interest rate is high, then don’t take the loan.

Comparing schools overarching AD budgets is futile given the differences in accounting practices so all that matters is CU’s specific value they can get out of the loan in relation to the rate.

Does anyone know the interest rate?
 
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If the interest rate low, then there’s no reason not to take the loan, it would irresponsible not to. If the interest rate is high, then don’t take the loan.

Comparing schools overarching AD budgets is futile given the differences in accounting practices so all that matters is CU’s specific value they can get out of the loan in relation to the rate.

Does anyone know the interest rate?
I think Hokie has that info. If not Hokie, then maybe Miami.
 
last I saw the interest rate CU is paying on that loan to the Pac-12 wasn't known. hard to judge whether the decision to take the money was sound or not without that piece of information.
Is it, though? When 11 of 12 schools step up and cover the shortfall, and you’re the 12th team, what does that say about that level of support provided? We are placing unnecessary restrictions on ourselves and making it harder to compete with our peers. That’s dumb in any line of work. The cost of that loan is largely irrelevant when you’re the only one paying it.
 
Is it, though? When 11 of 12 schools step up and cover the shortfall, and you’re the 12th team, what does that say about that level of support provided? We are placing unnecessary restrictions on ourselves and making it harder to compete with our peers. That’s dumb in any line of work. The cost of that loan is largely irrelevant when you’re the only one paying it.
Yes, I think it's still hard to make that judgement.

CU's AD may very well be setup for financial distress -- you follow that way more closely than I do. But, even if it's completely the case, that doesn't inform as to whether taking the loan was an unsound decision, but it would inform that the financial arrangements between the CUAD, the CU general fund and the State of CO may be unsound.

edit: in other words, I'm making a distinction between the decision to take the loan in 2020 vs the decisions that went into the funding model over the decades prior. I understand you're not making that distinction.
 
Is it, though? When 11 of 12 schools step up and cover the shortfall, and you’re the 12th team, what does that say about that level of support provided? We are placing unnecessary restrictions on ourselves and making it harder to compete with our peers. That’s dumb in any line of work. The cost of that loan is largely irrelevant when you’re the only one paying it.
FCS level thinking and actions. Might as well make the move. Just think of the success we could have there!
 
Yes, I think it's still hard to make that judgement.

CU's AD may very well be setup for financial distress -- you follow that way more closely than I do. But, even if it's completely the case, that doesn't inform as to whether taking the loan was an unsound decision, but it would inform that the financial arrangements between the CUAD, the CU general fund and the State of CO may be unsound.

edit: in other words, I'm making a distinction between the decision to take the loan in 2020 vs the decisions that went into the funding model over the decades prior. I understand you're not making that distinction.
It’s an unsound decision because we are the only ones taking it. Doing so puts us immediately at a financial disadvantage with our peers. It wouldn’t matter if it was a zero interest loan. As long as the expectation is to repay it, it was a bad choice.
 
It’s an unsound decision because we are the only ones taking it. Doing so puts us immediately at a financial disadvantage with our peers. It wouldn’t matter if it was a zero interest loan. As long as the expectation is to repay it, it was a bad choice.
ok. you're the SME on financial loans. I trust you know what you're talking about.
 
Here is info on the loans provided to Pac 12 Schools
According to a series of emails obtained by the Hotline through public records requests, the loan would provide a maximum of $83 million for each university at a rate of 3.75 percent over 10 years.
I am not an expert in this area but that seems like a good rate over 10 years. However, I'd imagine most Schools aren't charging their athletic departments interest on loans or very minimal, but CU will be CU.
 
I would imagine that most institutions are just covering it without an expectation for the AD to pay it back, even at 0% interest. That's the whole point of this discussion, that CU expects the AD to do things that other ADs don't have to do, such as cover the full cost of "out-of-state" tuition even though the actual cost to the University is the same for all kids, regardless of what state they come from. Out of State tuition is what the market will bare, not what it costs to educate the kid.
 
I would imagine that most institutions are just covering it without an expectation for the AD to pay it back, even at 0% interest. That's the whole point of this discussion, that CU expects the AD to do things that other ADs don't have to do, such as cover the full cost of "out-of-state" tuition even though the actual cost to the University is the same for all kids, regardless of what state they come from. Out of State tuition is what the market will bare, not what it costs to educate the kid.
I thought the "out of state tuition" thing was debunked.
 
Wow... hot take. Way to take a stand.
It’s also a stupid, uninformed take. Loans are used to improve something - either buy something or to take advantage of favorable terms that come with paying now instead of later. This loan does neither of those things. All it does is encumber the athletic department while EVERY OTHER TEAM IN OUR CONFERENCE avoids the same type of encumbrance. It’s spectacularly stupid. If we are wondering why RG is mailing it in, it’s because the idiot he reports to has made it virtually impossible for him to do the things that he knows need to be done in order to be successful. But he’s still getting paid, so why not mail it in? The consequences to him are nothing more than a hit to his reputation, and honestly, when you’re making that kind of money, who cares?
 
So if the AD budget is written off by the school that is having financial problems, where is the school going to get the money that the school will use to cover the AD budget?

A. Loans
B. Municipal bonds
C. Not sure will write a check
D. Government print the money.
 
If we aren’t parsing the balance sheet, cash flow, p+l, I don’t see how we can make a strong assessment of good or bad.

3.75 is cheap money and if they were smart (IF being the operating word here), then that loan could be a boon to anyone smart enough to use it correctly.

That said, if our financial acumen at the top level of CU is “pay some bills on credit” and the thought process stopped there without a greater plan for investment and growth, then we should roll a guillotine out.
 
It’s also a stupid, uninformed take. Loans are used to improve something - either buy something or to take advantage of favorable terms that come with paying now instead of later. This loan does neither of those things. All it does is encumber the athletic department while EVERY OTHER TEAM IN OUR CONFERENCE avoids the same type of encumbrance. It’s spectacularly stupid. If we are wondering why RG is mailing it in, it’s because the idiot he reports to has made it virtually impossible for him to do the things that he knows need to be done in order to be successful. But he’s still getting paid, so why not mail it in? The consequences to him are nothing more than a hit to his reputation, and honestly, when you’re making that kind of money, who cares?
Hate to say it, but bing bong is correct here. It is dependent on the terms of the loan.
 
If we aren’t parsing the balance sheet, cash flow, p+l, I don’t see how we can make a strong assessment of good or bad.

3.75 is cheap money and if they were smart (IF being the operating word here), then that loan could be a boon to anyone smart enough to use it correctly.

That said, if our financial acumen at the top level of CU is “pay some bills on credit” and the thought process stopped there without a greater plan for investment and growth, then we should roll a guillotine out.
CU and financial acumen do not belong in the same sentence
 
It’s also a stupid, uninformed take. Loans are used to improve something - either buy something or to take advantage of favorable terms that come with paying now instead of later. This loan does neither of those things. All it does is encumber the athletic department while EVERY OTHER TEAM IN OUR CONFERENCE avoids the same type of encumbrance. It’s spectacularly stupid. If we are wondering why RG is mailing it in, it’s because the idiot he reports to has made it virtually impossible for him to do the things that he knows need to be done in order to be successful. But he’s still getting paid, so why not mail it in? The consequences to him are nothing more than a hit to his reputation, and honestly, when you’re making that kind of money, who cares?
Well, I am waiting to see what this new coaching staff's salary pool has increased to because the quality has increased significantly. If the only way they were able to increase it to this point was to take a loan, I would say it's being used to improve something, arguably the most important thing to the success of the program. Maybe they also used it to help boost the recruiting infrastructure and hire new folks in that department. Both of those would qualify as investing in the program with the goal of seeing a good ROI.
 
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