CU has rejoined the Big 12 and broken college football - talking out asses continues

[Creebuzz]

I don’t understand why there doesn’t seem to be more concern coming from the ASU / Utah side at least if the money gap is that bad. Are we getting rope a doped into killing the P12 and then the other AAU schools plus ASU get facilitated to the ACC by ESPN. That would suck for the school from an academic association perspective.

This is the prisoner’s dilemma that all the teams are in. There are advantages and disadvantages to either striking first or laying back. Depends how strong you think your hand is. I definitely understand that position by, say, Washington. Utah has a lot of risk.

Define “draw”. Does anyone in the NE really care about UConn football? All I’m hearing is they are geographically proximate to NY. Is that really all it takes to “draw” that market? If that’s the case why not add Rhode Island and lock up Boston too?

Nobody cares about Connecticut football. However, based on Yormark’s Big 12 strategy, having UCONN, Kansas, Arizona in your basketball league isn’t too shabby. Basketball and football are almost equal in popularity among the younger generations. I believe that’s his angle.

 

[Bison]

43-44 min into Podcast-

Expects things happening quickly. Hearing Colorado, Arizona, UConn, SDSU and Gonzaga in the mix- not so sure about ASU and Utah.
Didn't say if UConn would be basketball only.

Big 12 spring meetings end tomorrow. We could see movement after that.

 

[manhattanbuff]

I guess this thing is gonna happen.

 

[1989Buff]

I don’t understand why there doesn’t seem to be more concern coming from the ASU / Utah side at least if the money gap is that bad. Are we getting rope a doped into killing the P12 and then the other AAU schools plus ASU get facilitated to the ACC by ESPN. That would suck for the school from an academic association perspective.

Yeah...why are we so freaked out and other Pac teams don't seem to be (at least not like we are)? If Utah really isn't interested in a Big 12 offer for example (because of BYU or whatever) why aren't they as afraid as we are of the effects long term of the lower payout impacting competitiveness?

It's possible they are and we just aren't as aware of it. But if they AREN'T it's worth wondering why. It's a bit like the Sherlock Holmes "curious bark in the night" situation.

 

[torero]

How do the post season distributions work in basketball? Is it X amount per team that makes the tournament?

Conferences earn units for each round a team advances. Easy explainer here.

 

[SINKRATZ]

You think Big12 officials were sitting around, strategizing about how to stay relevant in modern college athletics after losing their 2 most valuable properties to the SEC and decided, what we really need is another basketball school?? Ok dude.

 

[Bison]

Yeah...why are we so freaked out and other Pac teams don't seem to be (at least not like we are)? If Utah really isn't interested in a Big 12 offer for example (because of BYU or whatever) why aren't they as afraid as we are of the effects long term of the lower payout impacting competitiveness?

It's possible they are and we just aren't as aware of it. But if they AREN'T it's worth wondering why. It's a bit like the Sherlock Holmes "curious bark in the night" situation.

Or it is true that the P12 isn't as passionate as the B12 when it comes to football & basketball. The P12 is proud of all the oly sports NCs they won. Cool stuff but that's not what CU fans grew up with.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Conferences earn units for each round a team advances. Easy explainer here.

So I’d have to look into the Big 12 payouts sans UT/OU, but adding Cincy, Houston, BYU, UCF, Arizona, UConn, Gonzaga, and maybe SDSU.

I imagine the idea is that there could theoretically be many millions more in distributions each year by adding those programs. If the NCAA tournament expands and if the future units become worth more, maybe MBB starts to move the needle if you have 10+ tournament bids and multiple teams with S16-F4 potential

 

[Creebuzz]

Yeah...why are we so freaked out and other Pac teams don't seem to be (at least not like we are)? If Utah really isn't interested in a Big 12 offer for example (because of BYU or whatever) why aren't they as afraid as we are of the effects long term of the lower payout impacting competitiveness?

It's possible they are and we just aren't as aware of it. But if they AREN'T it's worth wondering why. It's a bit like the Sherlock Holmes "curious bark in the night" situation.

Based on what I’ve read, the Arizona fan base is the one that seems to want to go to the Big 12 more than anyone. CU is about 50/50.

Utah doesn’t want to be with BYU, may not even have an offer from the Big 12, and they massively overvalue themselves.

ASU is 60/40 for PAC, but very much in wait and see mode.

OSU and Wazzu have zero leverage and basically get whatever they get.

Cal and Stanford fans do not actually seem to exist from what I can tell.

Ore and Wash think they are heading to the B1G, and even if they don’t immediately, they are fine with an 8 team Conference on a short term deal that they can easily terminate. They will just play a few more OOC games against patsies.

 

[Bison]

You think Big12 officials were sitting around, strategizing about how to stay relevant in modern college athletics after losing their 2 most valuable properties to the SEC and decided, what we really need is another basketball school?? Ok dude.

Football isn't the only thing paying the bills. Given the P12's performance with the BCS/CFP and basketball post season tourneys, it's safe to assume that the bowl/CFP & tourney money isn't going to be great on top of what the rumored media rights deal is going to bring in.

And speaking of sitting around, it's probably the P12 officials doing the sitting around not the B12 officials.

 

[SINKRATZ]

Nobody cares about Connecticut football. However, based on Yormark’s Big 12 strategy, having UCONN, Kansas, Arizona in your basketball league isn’t too shabby. Basketball and football are almost equal in popularity among the younger generations. I believe that’s his angle.

Then they’ll be the first conference to try to remain relevant by emphasizing basketball, let’s see how that works out for them. And I’d love to see data showing that college basketball is almost equal in popularity with college football, I’m skeptical on that.

 

[rosstr]

Hello schools who care about football

Like UCF and ****ing Gonzaga. It would be a complete disaster to join that dumpster fire conference. The Pac12 is sinking but it’s not hopeless.

 

[SINKRATZ]

Football isn't the only thing paying the bills. Given the P12's performance with the BCS/CFP and basketball post season tourneys, it's safe to assume that the bowl/CFP & tourney money isn't going to be great on top of what the rumored media rights deal is going to bring in.

And speaking of sitting around, it's probably the P12 officials doing the sitting around not the B12 officials.

I’m not talking about the Pac12, I’m talking about why the Big12 would want UConn or believe they are accretive to that conference. And if these expansion rumors are even partially true the Big12 certainly is sitting around planning their future right now.

 

[InTheBuff]

I don’t understand why there doesn’t seem to be more concern coming from the ASU / Utah side at least if the money gap is that bad. Are we getting rope a doped into killing the P12 and then the other AAU schools plus ASU get facilitated to the ACC by ESPN. That would suck for the school from an academic association perspective.

Why do people still think that a PAC & ACC merger is on the table ? It isn't.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Like UCF and ****ing Gonzaga. It would be a complete disaster to join that dumpster fire conference. The Pac12 is sinking but it’s not hopeless.

Yes it is. Oregon and Washington are the supposed tent pole programs and they aren’t wanted by the P2. They aren’t valued by the networks. The only way the Pac survives is by adding G5 programs out west, none of which really move the needle, and all that does is make the Pac a slightly different version of the B12.

 

[InTheBuff]

New Athletic article about Colorado out this morning.
If you don't have a subscription then this video goes over it in detail.

“No Pac-12 school has been more receptive to joining the conference, those sources said, than Colorado.”
“Colorado is the one they’re having the most productive talks with,” one of the sources said.

 

[Not Sure]

It's unlikely anyone is an addition to the ACC till 2036

Unless the entire conference dissolves and member schools establish a new conference in its place.

 

[#1 pick]

Unless the entire conference dissolves and member schools establish a new conference in its place.

ESPN is making that a challenge

 

[jaybird]

Yes it is. Oregon and Washington are the supposed tent pole programs and they aren’t wanted by the P2. They aren’t valued by the networks. The only way the Pac survives is by adding G5 programs out west, none of which really move the needle, and all that does is make the Pac a slightly different version of the B12.

A slightly different version...making less money. That's why I think whether the PAC survives or not, Colorado is B12 bound.

 

[Creebuzz]

Then they’ll be the first conference to try to remain relevant by emphasizing basketball, let’s see how that works out for them. And I’d love to see data showing that college basketball is almost equal in popularity with college football, I’m skeptical on that.

Look I have mixed feelings on all of this. CU should never have been in this position, but CU contributed nothing to the PAC 12 during its membership. USC failed to be the standard bearer. The presidents failed on oversight of a greedy CEO in Larry Scott. The PAC 12 network was a total failure. The league was snooty about adding members. It was never bold. And it couldn’t even get its forking accounting right. The west coast has mediocre passion. So, while I understand why some fans want to stay, I also understand why some wish to go.

As far as the rest, I think Yormark would say that his football league is already better than the PAC with fans that watch games on TV and on campus more. He is angling to be #3 in football and #1 in basketball.

Here is one link to basketball‘s popularity among the yoots.

Preferred sport for adults in the U.S. by age 2019 | Statista

Many sports are played in the United States, either as hobbies or professional careers.

www.statista.com

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Look I have mixed feelings on all of this. CU should never have been in this position, but CU contributed nothing to the PAC 12 during its membership. USC failed to be the standard bearer. The presidents failed on oversight of a greedy CEO in Larry Scott. The PAC 12 network was a total failure. The league was snooty about adding members. It was never bold. And it couldn’t even get is forking accounting right. The west coast has mediocre passion. So, while I understand why some fans want to stay, I also understand why some wish to go.

As far as the rest, I think Yormark would say that his football league is already better than the PAC with fans that watch games on TV and on campus more. He is angling to be #3 in football and #1 in basketball.

Here is one link to basketball‘s popularity among the yoots.

Preferred sport for adults in the U.S. by age 2019 | Statista

Many sports are played in the United States, either as hobbies or professional careers.

www.statista.com

All to remain associated with Oregon and Washington who will leave at first opportunity and Stanford and cal because… academics

 

[SINKRATZ]

Look I have mixed feelings on all of this. CU should never have been in this position, but CU contributed nothing to the PAC 12 during its membership. USC failed to be the standard bearer. The presidents failed on oversight of a greedy CEO in Larry Scott. The PAC 12 network was a total failure. The league was snooty about adding members. It was never bold. And it couldn’t even get is forking accounting right. The west coast has mediocre passion. So, while I understand why some fans want to stay, I also understand why some wish to go.

As far as the rest, I think Yormark would say that his football league is already better than the PAC with fans that watch games on TV and on campus more. He is angling to be #3 in football and #1 in basketball.

Here is one link to basketball‘s popularity among the yoots.

Preferred sport for adults in the U.S. by age 2019 | Statista

Many sports are played in the United States, either as hobbies or professional careers.

www.statista.com

Agree on the series of debacles that got us here, it’s infuriating.

I sort of understand the Yormack angle but realistically the Big12 is, at best, a distant #4 right now in football well behind the ACC. It’s fine if you want to be #1 in basketball but the Big12 already has their media deal in place so I still don’t understand what UConn brings? Maybe more basketball prestige, but that doesn’t translate to revenue so what’s the point? It’s not like other conferences are fighting over them. Why UConn and why now? But I’ve made my point on the Huskies so I’ll leave it there.

Appreciate the stats, though that has to do with popularity of sports in general, not college sports. I doubt you’d see the same response if the question were popularity of college basketball versus college football.

 

[BerkeleyBuff]

Agree on the series of debacles that got us here, it’s infuriating.

I sort of understand the Yormack angle but realistically the Big12 is, at best, a distant #4 right now in football well behind the ACC. It’s fine if you want to be #1 in basketball but the Big12 already has their media deal in place so I still don’t understand what UConn brings? Maybe more basketball prestige, but that doesn’t translate to revenue so what’s the point? It’s not like other conferences are fighting over them. Why UConn and why now? But I’ve made my point on the Huskies so I’ll leave it there.

Appreciate the stats, though that has to do with popularity of sports in general, not college sports. I doubly you’d see the same response if the question were popularity of college basketball versus college football.

For basketball, the goal is to make the Big XII even stronger so that their next deal (only a few years from now - they signed a short one) is more lucrative. Especially since Yormark has repeatedly said he wants to decouple the football and basketball contracts. He thinks there's more money to be made out of basketball, and he wants the Big XII to come out on top in that regard.

 

[Creebuzz]

Agree on the series of debacles that got us here, it’s infuriating.

I sort of understand the Yormack angle but realistically the Big12 is, at best, a distant #4 right now in football well behind the ACC. It’s fine if you want to be #1 in basketball but the Big12 already has their media deal in place so I still don’t understand what UConn brings? Maybe more basketball prestige, but that doesn’t translate to revenue so what’s the point? It’s not like other conferences are fighting over them. Why UConn and why now? But I’ve made my point on the Huskies so I’ll leave it there.

Appreciate the stats, though that has to do with popularity of sports in general, not college sports. I doubly you’d see the same response if the question were popularity of college basketball versus college football.

I think everyone wants the PAC to work. CU has certainly been patient and continues to be. The reported number continues to hover around $20 million with a lot of lesser broadcasting options. If some white knight scenario emerges at the eleventh hour, then CU will stay. As it should. But it’s been a year.

When I say #3 in football, I’m presuming the best brands in the ACC get poached by the SEC and B1G, with a couple of the remaining ACC members heading to the Big 12.

I think the takeaway on basketball is that it is rising in popularity. Baseball is collapsing. Football is still #1.

 

[SINKRATZ]

For basketball, the goal is to make the Big XII even stronger so that their next deal (only a few years from now - they signed a short one) is more lucrative. Especially since Yormark has repeatedly said he wants to decouple the football and basketball contracts. He thinks there's more money to be made out of basketball, and he wants the Big XII to come out on top in that regard.

Eh, ok. I thought I saw somewhere that the Big 12 media deal allows for the conference to keep the per school payout in tact if they expand by adding current P5 schools. Am I mistaken? If not, I wonder how that calculus works if they try to add UConn and SDSU and Gonzaga. I assume they’ve worked that out to not dilute the rest of the league.

I wonder how Tad Boyle feels about potentially ending up in a conference with Kansas, UConn, Gonzaga, Arizona, Baylor and TTU. Good times!

 

[SINKRATZ]

I think everyone wants the PAC to work. CU has certainly been patient and continues to be. The reported number continues to hover around $20 million with a lot of lesser broadcasting options. If some white knight scenario emerges at the eleventh hour, then CU will stay. As it should. But it’s been a year.

When I say #3 in football, I’m presuming the best brands in the ACC get poached by the SEC and B1G, with a couple of the remaining ACC members heading to the Big 12.

I think the takeaway on basketball is that it is rising in popularity. Baseball is collapsing. Football is still #1.

When the ACC breaks apart and is poached only 2 conferences will still matter in football so being #3 in that context feels like cold comfort. They better hope the basketball angle works, but maybe it’s their only hope.

 

[Creebuzz]

When the ACC breaks apart and is poached only 2 conferences will still matter in football so being #3 in that context feels like cold comfort. They better hope the basketball angle works, but maybe it’s their only hope.

Yes, CU put itself in a bad position by not caring about athletics. If only there was a message board of dedicated fans that could’ve warned them about the consequences of its actions well in advance.

 

[Buffnik]

Define “draw”. Does anyone in the NE really care about UConn football? All I’m hearing is they are geographically proximate to NY. Is that really all it takes to “draw” that market? If that’s the case why not add Rhode Island and lock up Boston too?

The only major team(s) in an area will get more sports entertainment consumer attention than an equivalent team from out of market.

I thought that was a basic fact we would all agree on, but apparently not.

Anyway, UConn is actually in New England but with a lot of people who work in NYC or moved from there. It's also home base for ESPN. It's a much better bet for bringing value to a P5 conference than at least half of the current ACC.

 

[SuperD]

Interesting news regarding AAU status since it relevant as to appeal of a school for realignment, particularly for the B1G. Six new schools were admitted to the AAU, including ASU, Notre Dame, and Miami. Really improves ASU's profile as a B1G candidate, though they've looked like an AAU school for a while now in terms of sheer research volume.

https://www.aau.edu/newsroom/press-...sities-join-association-american-universities

The inclusion of Notre Dame seems really suspect if you look at where they fall on the research rankings. Wonder if the B1G and the ACC just got together and voted them in regardless of their research profile. They are 109th on the National Science Foundations ranking of research expenditures. I'd be pretty pissed if I were the the President of CSU (61), WSU (78), Florida State (83), Nebraska (87), or Oregon State (94). I wonder if its due to that "Ag research doesn't count" policy.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Eh, ok. I thought I saw somewhere that the Big 12 media deal allows for the conference to keep the per school payout in tact if they expand by adding current P5 schools. Am I mistaken? If not, I wonder how that calculus works if they try to add UConn and SDSU and Gonzaga. I assume they’ve worked that out to not dilute the rest of the league.

I wonder how Tad Boyle feels about potentially ending up in a conference with Kansas, UConn, Gonzaga, Arizona, Baylor and TTU. Good times!

Since Tad and CU have been mediocre at best during their time in the Pac 12, I can’t imagine the thought is much different. Does the Big 12 being the elite hoops conference make CU more attractive for recruiting like the SEC does for football?