Has Jon Embree's behavior today damaged the University and football program?

[89BUFF89]

Very interesting take on the press conference and the situation at CU. Hard to argue with him. He is also pretty objective yet agrees that Embree was way over his head and should have been fired.

http://www.gazette.com/articles/graveyard-147751-klee-boulder.html

Lots of truth in this one....We need more than a new HFC, we also need to decide if we are serious about football, and if so, fund it appropriately. Scary to think that Benson and DiStefano have no clue how to do it right though. I hope someone with the chops is helping them or were doomed...

 

[gobuffs58]

what jon said and did yesterday will soon be forgotton... i would have liked to see another recruiting class or two from jon...BUT in the end i just could not get past how poorly coached the buffs were this season... could not tackle, gave up in games etc. I think Folsom would have had 25k people per game next year and thats what the admin was nervous about... i know i was wavering about renewing my 6 seats in sec 105... attending buffs games this year was like a death march... and other than the tailgating it was "no fun"... most of the people i attend with were back to the parking lot by halftime every week. im sure alot of the press and other's dont shell out $3500 to watch what went down on the field this year!

 

[1989Buff]

It also might be worth adding that Bohn might have been doing Embree a favor (in hindsight of course) had the presser NOT been held. This can only hurt Embree's future career (there's no scenario where a crying slam at his firing helps it with future employers).

I wonder if Bohn could have divined Embree's mood with a pre-press conference discussion with him and just have said something like "You know Jon, it's not fair to throw you out there right now. You haven't been given the chance to deal with this long enough to respond the way you would like to to the sorts of questions these reporters are going to be lobbing at you. I'd hate for you to do anything you regretted later."

Oh well. What's done is done. Put me in the camp with those who say that leaving Hawk at the helm too long played a role in pulling the plug here when they did. That REALLY hurt us...and I think Bohn rightly felt that another year of what we just experienced would hurt us for several more years down the road (as the extra year Hawk got has). That's a good thing to have learned. It wasn't "one more year"...if it was a mistake to leave Jon at the helm again in 2013 it would hurt us until 2016 at least.

And finally...sorry to those who feel Embree got a raw deal...but unless it's the very first year they take over as head coach, it should be a general rule that any coach presiding over a 120 year program's worst football season ever has no right to expect they will have a job the following season. Ever.

 

[Buffnik]

The administration and especially the SID's office expected that these guys would have their 2 or 3 days of conflama that the media would eat up. This will quickly run out of steam as CU get ahold of the story and is releasing new stories about coaches and facilities. While the Camp Embree folks could regurgitate these same things for a year, most of the local media will quickly grow tired and realize that their ability to do their jobs is much more dependent on having sources within CU (including the cultivation of sources on the new coaching staff) than their jobs rely on their ability to get Barnett or Mac on record.

Edit: Press conference had to happen. And it had to happen with this timing. The media tour was going to happen regardless and it was better that the presser was out of the way.

 

[Buffskier]

Hawkins beat #3 Oklahoma, #17 WVU, #17 KU, UGA, went to a bowl game and was COMPETITIVE against most opponents except Mizzou. He was not very good as a coach, didn't do well in the PR aspect of the job, and dismissed the history of the program.

Embree beat CSU, Wazzu, UA, and Utah in 2 years.... but was blown out in about HALF of the games played in the last year. We set records for futility on the defensive side of the ball both years. This year being the 2nd worst defense in the history of the nation since 1997 and he doesn't understand why he was fired.

 

[Buffskier]

Just did some math - CU outscored by 1027 to 471 during Embree era.

 

[Walter White]

JE's response to this situation is making it very clear he was not ready to be a head coach. He's not a pro. This is amateur hour.

Everyone can understand emotions and everyone has emotions, but a real pro keeps his emotions in check and does what he has to do.

 

[Deleted member 807]

DISAGREE:

1) Embree was NOT hired into a "no-win" situation. It was a tough to win with current resources, but not "no-win". The Colo Legislature does not throw money at any state school's FB program; unlike MI, NB, Ohio or Cali. Nor does CU currently have a big $$$ alum/donor, like Phil Knight. willing to fund the AD. Nor does CU bend the rules on admitting kids that can't read; unlike every SEC school. Embree knew this coming in.

2) The trajectory looked good when DH beat OK, NU, CSU and went to a Bowl game; followed up with a decent recruiting class. But DH screwed the pooch playing QB games with his son. That's when the trajectory went south. DH was out only for CH and for DH and already was a legend in his own mind. The critical point came when lack of resources forced MB to keep DH one more year. Money doesn't grow on Colorado blue spruces and our fickle fan base doesn't help----ever heard of fights in divorce or probate court over CU season tix? Me neither! So who cares about "galvanizing" the typical bandwagon-jumping CU fan ? Play competently, with a chance to win and you'll see 50K in Folsom. Win and they'll return to sell-outs.(Funny: Same lack of resources forced MB to hold onto R Patton one more year, but hiring the right couple of guys fixed up men's BB is a hurry! Now they're sold out.)

3) The presser was mostly an accurate represetation of where Embree was as a professional, a head coach and a leader: NOWHERE! It was a natural follow-up to coaching the worst team in college FB in 2012, maybe ever. If MB made a mistake for the presser, it was assuming that Embree would act maturely and professionally. But after watching JE on the sidelines for 2 years that was a huge mistaken assumption on his part.

4) For anyone rationally looking at the situation, releasing Embree actually creates the impression that "dysfunction" will not be tolerated in FB . No more excuses will serve. If Tad Boyle can make a "no-tradition, non-basketball" scenario, a hotbed of college hoops, then the right FB coach can do the same at CU, now that CU is where it belongs in the Pac 12, and with Pac 12 $$$.

1) Would you disagree that Embree believes he was put in a no-win situation? Its not what I or you think, but what Embree and his supporters think. There is a vocal group that holds a belief Embree was the real deal, and that he has been played. The Embree view is that 23 months is not sufficient to bring in recruits to make up for the empty cupboard caused by yr5 under Hawkins, the mismanagement of Tyler Hansen's red shirt, and the injury of PRich, the biggest play maker on the team. Embree had been dealt a very weak hand to play given no chance to ever develop any of his recruits beyond their underclassman years, and he was unwilling to cut corners. Embree was always about uoholding a standard and manned up during his tenure to avoid using his player depth as an excuse...until yesterday after the axe fell.

2) Remember when Bill Clinton asked what the definition of "is" is? The word trajectory is proving just as slippery. There has been a downward trajectory from 1990 to 2012. Yes, Hawkins had an upward trajectory between years 1 and 2, and a flat trajectory between years 1 and 5. Who knows which points Mike Bohn is using, but probably not the trajectory between 2006 and 2007.

3) agree. No dispute.
4) A message was sent that CU is (finally) serious about winning. Although there is a big difference between words and deeds. The university is under the gun to hire the best coach possible and needs to allure candidates with the position that they are really serious this time. Time will tell if Benson and DiStephano are really serious about football, or are simply playing the political game to sooth over some angry constituents.

 

[J.R. Ewing]

Just did some math - CU outscored by 1027 to 471 during Embree era.

That's only 22+ ppg.

 

[sackman]

JE's response to this situation is making it very clear he was not ready to be a head coach. He's not a pro. This is amateur hour.

I completely agree with this. I think it goes to the OP as well. Embree's behavior hasn't damaged CU. It's damaged Embree. Had he shown some class, he'd probably have very little trouble lining up another TE job, probably in the NFL. Now he's damaged goods. Sad.

 

[Sexton Hardcastle]

I completely agree with this. I think it goes to the OP as well. Embree's behavior hasn't damaged CU. It's damaged Embree. Had he shown some class, he'd probably have very little trouble lining up another TE job, probably in the NFL. Now he's damaged goods. Sad.

This is a bit dramatic. Jon may take some time off, but i highly doubt he'll have any issues finding a job as an assistant in the NFL/CFB. He's far from damaged goods.

Now if were talking about him finding a HC job at another school....that can be argued.