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Have I been too fair to Karl Dorrell?
- Thread starter Buffnik
- Start date
That's why I put avg rank in. I think that is a normalizer. Class rank is driven by size, but the bigger factor is signing top rated guys. A class of 10 4* & 10 2* is going to rate a lot better than 20 3*.
I think that explains why nearly identical avg ratings for MT & KD classes had the MT one ranked better. My take is that KD's recruiting delivers better depth with fewer guys projected as potential game changers.
That Air Force loss was painful.
Master Blaster
Ramblin Wreck from Golden Tech
At a school like CU you either need a head coach that offers some schematic advantage or a salesman that can really punch above their weight in recruiting. KD is neither. The "CEO Style" coach won't work long term because there isn't enough money to retain good assistants. I like the staff he's put together but if there's any on field success a lot of those guys will be gone. How many times is KD going to be able to make hires before he stumbles upon another Mitch Rodrigue?
Meh. Despite what things have looked like for the last 20 years, competent football programs should go to bowl games regularly. I would say it's a failure to have bowl eligibility only half the time.
So, though I understand the purpose of a college athletics-based message board, all this discussion is irrelevant. KD either gets this team bowl-eligible or he's failed. None of the "circumstances" he came into really matter. Neither do recruiting takes or "program trajectory" or any of the other discussion topics that keep this place going.
So, though I understand the purpose of a college athletics-based message board, all this discussion is irrelevant. KD either gets this team bowl-eligible or he's failed. None of the "circumstances" he came into really matter. Neither do recruiting takes or "program trajectory" or any of the other discussion topics that keep this place going.
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This. So much this.
If HCKD gets a pass for 2020 because of the late hire and COVID, then he shouldn't get credit for getting W's over sleepwalking Cali teams hobbled by the some of the same hurdles. Scratch 2020. He is a 4-8 coach until proven otherwise.
Off the field he has failed to recruit classes likely to strengthen the talent level. Most every P12 caliber player with eligibility hit the transfer portal, very few stayed. Any chance of CU being successful before year five, best case scenario, of HCKD's reign of terror (for cameramen at least) went with them.
His downfall at fUCLA some 14 years ago was largely because he could not recruit well there, could not improve the team's overall performance from his predecessor and accordingly was never in consideration another HC gig since. His one foray back into CFB resulted in an OC position with Vandy so moribund, even by Vandy standards, he was let go after one year. Nobody was pursuing him for a HC position. Collective wisdom should not be lightly ignored.
In short, no, you have not been too hard on him. He is, by all reports, a good guy, a former Buff, and a solid position coach. You don't hang around the NFL, even as position coach, if you are not very good at your job. He just isn't a HC. No crime in that.
It was a catastrophic hire. A very bad decision at a critical juncture for CU in the changing landscape of CFB. RG, Dr. Phil, Lance Carl and anybody involved need to go.
Off the field he has failed to recruit classes likely to strengthen the talent level. Most every P12 caliber player with eligibility hit the transfer portal, very few stayed. Any chance of CU being successful before year five, best case scenario, of HCKD's reign of terror (for cameramen at least) went with them.
His downfall at fUCLA some 14 years ago was largely because he could not recruit well there, could not improve the team's overall performance from his predecessor and accordingly was never in consideration another HC gig since. His one foray back into CFB resulted in an OC position with Vandy so moribund, even by Vandy standards, he was let go after one year. Nobody was pursuing him for a HC position. Collective wisdom should not be lightly ignored.
In short, no, you have not been too hard on him. He is, by all reports, a good guy, a former Buff, and a solid position coach. You don't hang around the NFL, even as position coach, if you are not very good at your job. He just isn't a HC. No crime in that.
It was a catastrophic hire. A very bad decision at a critical juncture for CU in the changing landscape of CFB. RG, Dr. Phil, Lance Carl and anybody involved need to go.
End thread.
Only if you ignore last year. He may have been set up to fail but he doubled down and totally ****ed up.
You don't get to go from chastising media for thinking your team would suck AFTER A LOSS to shoving a cameraman and putting forward one of the worst offensive seasons of all time without some serious doubt. And the worst coaching issue was not with Chev, but the OL coach he hired.
Show me the goddamn competence, Karl. Or GTFO.
You don't get to go from chastising media for thinking your team would suck AFTER A LOSS to shoving a cameraman and putting forward one of the worst offensive seasons of all time without some serious doubt. And the worst coaching issue was not with Chev, but the OL coach he hired.
Show me the goddamn competence, Karl. Or GTFO.
I would be indifferent to Karl Dorrell considering all the extenuating factors (Covid, Late Hire, Incompetent Administration) except for one big thing. He actually thought Rich Rodrigue was a capable and competent OL coach. It is so blatantly obvious that that unit was completely inept and got significantly worse under that man's instruction. I'm not someone who is all that knowledgeable about scheme and design, but even the most casual of fans knew that the OL was a disaster. How can a competent head coach not move on from that **** show immediately.
The failure to interview and recruit the players at the end of the season was a bigger failure in my mind. Just absolutely out of touch with the pulse of modern college football. It's not the 90s anymore, bro. Players got options.
oh yea, this too. Anyone who didn't see this coming is completely insular and too mentally rigid to be given the benefit of the doubt.
Wait until you see the one this year
Especially after fielding one of the most inept offenses in our history. Why would players stick around for more if they have choices?
"Hey coach, your offense put up negative 200 yards this week. Gonna do anything different?"
"Yeah, I'm thinking of poking my head in the offensive meetings."
Karl is what he is. I've maintained that he is a 6-7 win coach at maximum. I think he is a coach that can maintain that 5-7 win mark and keep CU competitive. He simply doesn't have the recruiting power or personality to be above average or elite in that area. I do think he is a good coach who has pretty good connections in football. I'm very impressed with his staff he put together this year.
I'm not necessarily down on KD as I am on the AD and the School administration. If most would utilize their angst at these two areas, we might start seeing some progress with a successful football program. Ultimately, a successful AD and School admin would have never been ok with a Dorrell hire. Plain and simple
However, Karl does have enough tools to get to that 6-7 win range. He was dealt a terrible hand but this is his team and his coaches. The excuses have run dry. This year will tell me everything I need to know if he can get to what I think he is.
I believe Karl can win here and has a talented enough coaching staff and team to get to a bowl game this year. Fair or unfair, he is here for the next two years so I want him to win.
I'm not necessarily down on KD as I am on the AD and the School administration. If most would utilize their angst at these two areas, we might start seeing some progress with a successful football program. Ultimately, a successful AD and School admin would have never been ok with a Dorrell hire. Plain and simple
However, Karl does have enough tools to get to that 6-7 win range. He was dealt a terrible hand but this is his team and his coaches. The excuses have run dry. This year will tell me everything I need to know if he can get to what I think he is.
I believe Karl can win here and has a talented enough coaching staff and team to get to a bowl game this year. Fair or unfair, he is here for the next two years so I want him to win.
He MAY have been a 5-7 win type guy twenty years ago. He's NOT a 5-7 win guy in today's college football.
I feel as if Karl is learning to be a head coach for the very first time because he has been away from the college game for so long and everything has changed so drastically.
Where do I sign up for a gig that pays that well for OJT?
****, man. we would worship this guy if he can get us 6 wins this season. that would so so so so far exceed expectations among the press, the pundits, our opponents, and our fans....
deliver 6 Ws this year and i will be quite happy to drink the karl kool-aid. sure, the bar goes up from there and maybe he does have some potential hard cap on upside, but if he can get us bowling this year, the program should stabilize some and there will be some reasons for hope. we can worry about who should be the next hc later.
of course, CU being CU, it will give him a 10 year guaranteed contract extension with escalators if he delivers 6 wins this year AND someone here and in the press and in the CUAD will compare it to when Coach Mac got extended without a lot of proof of glory yet.
deliver 6 Ws this year and i will be quite happy to drink the karl kool-aid. sure, the bar goes up from there and maybe he does have some potential hard cap on upside, but if he can get us bowling this year, the program should stabilize some and there will be some reasons for hope. we can worry about who should be the next hc later.
of course, CU being CU, it will give him a 10 year guaranteed contract extension with escalators if he delivers 6 wins this year AND someone here and in the press and in the CUAD will compare it to when Coach Mac got extended without a lot of proof of glory yet.
Paging Dave Plati.
95 BUFF
Member
Last year really sucked the life out of the fan base. It is one thing to lose more than you win but to be boring and impotent offensively is just a dick punch. If CU had gone 4-8 with a terrible defense but a middle of the road offense that gave fans something to get excited about during games (points), I don’t think it would have been so demoralizing.
I don’t have much reason to be optimistic but here is my best attempt.
In the investment world, I start to get really nervous when everyone thinks the stock market is easy money. You better get out at that point. I start getting really intrigued when everyone is scared to death thinking the market is in free fall. That is the time to start buying.
The only people dumber than every day investors are college football fans. So I am going to apply the same principle and hope it works out. Everyone is so down in KD and the program, this might be the point where the program is about to take off.
Nah. I don’t have the expectation I did with MT. Also, don’t think this years AF loss is the difference between 5-7 and 6-6. Also, I don’t expect us to be leading for lost or the game…at home…against a much worse AF team than this year.
Either way he was a meh recruit and a project.
Welcome back, 96's Dad!