The talent level of the second group is significantly better. The consistent effort level of the first group is significantly better. KJ and Ski I think are pretty much a wash, this comment doesn't really apply to them.
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Looking ahead 22-23
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WWCD
Well-Known Member
Sorry man, but this take...
The core we have now beat Arizona, Gordon, XJ and Booker lost to Pitt by 50 points
That's a great way to compare things! Look at one group at their absolute best, look at the other group at their absolute worst. No other data points are relevant.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
You and apparently others are wildly overrating XJ and Gordon's talent level.
vs Clifford and daSilva? C'mon. XJ and Gordon weren't world beaters, but I'd take XJ over Clifford EVERY day of the week and twice on Sunday and Gordon (when he was dialed in) over daSilva in a close one. Distracted, disinterested Gordon loses to daSilva, however.
No, I don't think I am. XJ is probably in the top 5 raw talent guys in the Tad era (sidebar Jabari, Spencer, Josh Scott, Derrick White for one year, I guess I wasn't counting Burks and Higgins, who are transition Tad guys. For comparison, I think XJ has more raw talent than Kin. Kin was the vastly superior player, it isn't even close). His deficiencies were in other areas that are also very important. Wes also was a talented guy.
XJ's skill set was a matchup nightmare. But he didn't always rebound or defend. He'd go games disinterested in doing anything on offense besides floating behind the arc.
I take prime XJ over prime Cliff, but I think we'll look back at the end of Cliff's career at CU and say we'd take Cliff over XJ on body of work.
haha, I hope we keep referring to Nique as Cliff, I love that nik-name
I have trouble calling anyone "Nique" besides Wilkins. Just like I'll never refer to our media guy as "MJ".
jumped ship
Well-Known Member
Gordon over TDS?! 
it's amazing how, even after beating everyone's expectations last year and being one of the most consistent contributors on the team, TDS is still not getting enough love. Gordon was a better low post defender and more consistent rebounder as a sophomore (likely dude to Jelly's injury that year), but his offense was limited to 6 feet from the hoop
TDS shot over 45% from 3, 80% from FT and just about averaged 10 ppg in league play
Cliff has all the tools, but of all returning players, we need him to take the biggest leap from last year for us to make the tourney. he really hasn't shown much yet
it's amazing how, even after beating everyone's expectations last year and being one of the most consistent contributors on the team, TDS is still not getting enough love. Gordon was a better low post defender and more consistent rebounder as a sophomore (likely dude to Jelly's injury that year), but his offense was limited to 6 feet from the hoop
TDS shot over 45% from 3, 80% from FT and just about averaged 10 ppg in league play
Cliff has all the tools, but of all returning players, we need him to take the biggest leap from last year for us to make the tourney. he really hasn't shown much yet
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
Timely.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
Yeah, it's stupid honestly. TDS is 6'9", can handle the ball, sees the floor great as a passer, can shoot at all three levels, has some genuine play making ability, and some here like the guy who just rebounded and was a good, not great defender.Gordon over TDS?!
it's amazing how, even after beating everyone's expectations last year and being one of the most consistent contributors on the team, TDS is still not getting enough love. Gordon was a better low post defender and more consistent rebounder as a sophomore (likely dude to Jelly's injury that year), but his offense was limited to 6 feet from the hoop
TDS shot over 45% from 3, 80% from FT and just about averaged 10 ppg in league play
Cliff has all the tools, but of all returning players, we need him to take the biggest leap from last year for us to make the tourney. he really hasn't shown much yet
As for XJ, not as quick or bouncy as Cliff (don't anyone dare come in here and call XJ explosive, he has a few good dunks, but was NOT a high riser), and XJ wasn't the perimeter defender Cliff is.
I cannot wait for Oct 30! Who has their tix and who will be at the Darkhorse! Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
This guy
Adam's got a nice article up on Lawson today. One particular quote stood out and I think makes the point many of us have been trying to say about how it takes a bit longer for bigs to be successful at this level.
Lovering--"As bigs, we don't play the same type of style as we played in high school here. We have to learn a little bit more. Guards are playing basically the same as they were in high school. So I've had to adapt and just listen to what the coaches say and just work hard. You'll develop if you are consistent every day. That's what I have been trying to do."
247sports.com
Lovering--"As bigs, we don't play the same type of style as we played in high school here. We have to learn a little bit more. Guards are playing basically the same as they were in high school. So I've had to adapt and just listen to what the coaches say and just work hard. You'll develop if you are consistent every day. That's what I have been trying to do."
Colorado basketball notes: Buffaloes counting on Lawson Lovering to step up
Colorado basketball notes: Buffaloes counting on Lawson Lovering to step up
247sports.com
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
Same. He moves so well for 7'1" guy, and he can shoot, despite him looking terrible at it last year. Also hope he has matured a bit mentally because he had a bad habit of getting down on himself when he'd screw up last year. You could see it in his face and body language.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
I'll just say again...XJ was a slow footed, under sized 4 who lacked explosiveness. The knock on Jabari from NBA scouts was below average athleticism.
On raw athleticism it's Roberson, Bey, King, Burks, Booker
Spencer, Scott, White, and Higgins were more skilled but not on those aforementioned guys' level in terms of raw athletic ability with the exception of Burks.
Raw talent ≠ athleticism. They are different things. FWIW Jaron Hopkins was as athletic as anybody Tad has recruited.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
To me talent and athleticism are the same thing. Skill is the other half of the equation.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
NM
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I really like this - someone asked Rooney about Clifford bulking up:
"On the eye test, I feel like it's Clifford and KJ Simpson that have bulked up the most. But strength coach Steve Engelhart told me the guy who made the biggest offseason gains in the weight room was Tristan da Silva."
1. I just love the idea of him coming out stronger and tougher.
2. You make the biggest gains, through desire and hardwork. He is obviously gearing up to be the best he can be.
If LL puts it together this year, it could be a great year. My problem is I moved to the east coast - a lot of real late games.
Go Buffs.
"On the eye test, I feel like it's Clifford and KJ Simpson that have bulked up the most. But strength coach Steve Engelhart told me the guy who made the biggest offseason gains in the weight room was Tristan da Silva."
1. I just love the idea of him coming out stronger and tougher.
2. You make the biggest gains, through desire and hardwork. He is obviously gearing up to be the best he can be.
If LL puts it together this year, it could be a great year. My problem is I moved to the east coast - a lot of real late games.
Go Buffs.
Going to be busy for me the next week or so, so thought I'd post this now while I think of it.
Wednesday is the MBB Pac 12 Media Day. (WBB's is Tuesday'.)
Schedule and more info available at https://pac-12.com/article/2022/10/20/pac-12-networks-set-cover-mens-and-womens-basketball-never .
Wednesday is the MBB Pac 12 Media Day. (WBB's is Tuesday'.)
Schedule and more info available at https://pac-12.com/article/2022/10/20/pac-12-networks-set-cover-mens-and-womens-basketball-never .
I think he can really help this team on D and the glass, but the shooting might take more than a season to develop. Last year wasn't the biggest sample size, but he shot 30% from the floor and 44% from the line.
He was completely lost on offense last season. If he really can shoot, Tad needs to run a play for him once or twice a game just to try to get him comfortable.
CU fans were so spoiled by Josh Scott it's not even funny. Not only was he an amazing player and a good dude, but he was the rare freshman big that came in and contributed from day one. Most of these guys are gonna take 1-2 years to produce. It's a whole other level in college for bigs. I remember being stunned at the difference between high school ball and AAU ball and I grew up in a small area that had no talent what-so-ever. And I sucked! I can't imagine the difference between high school (especially in WY or ND) and the Pac-12.
I want to see flashes from Lovering this year. That's all I'm asking. Next year I expect him to contribute hardcore.
I want to see flashes from Lovering this year. That's all I'm asking. Next year I expect him to contribute hardcore.
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