Menu
What's new
By:
Filters
AllBuffs | Unofficial fan site for the University of Colorado at Boulder Athletics programs

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • Prime Time. Prime Time. Its a new era for Colorado football. Consider signing up for a club membership! For $20/year, you can get access to all the special features at Allbuffs, including club member only forums, dark mode, avatars and best of all no ads ! But seriously, please sign up so that we can pay the bills. No one earns money here, and we can use your $20 to keep this hellhole running. You can sign up for a club membership by navigating to your account in the upper right and clicking on "Account Upgrades". Make it happen!

Official CU Head Coach Search Thread - Primetime

Status
Not open for further replies.
Liver said:
ok, a few things before anyone panics further...

we don't actually know how kd got to CU.

CU likely executed and exclusive contract with the search firm, wherein they get paid regardless of whether it is one of "their" candidates or another. this is not unusual in a lot of circumstances including hiring scenarios and investment banks.

just because they were working for CU at the time of the kd hire doesn't mean they recommended him or even arranged his visits or whatever.

search firms and i-banks take "credit" any time one of their exclusive clients gets the outcome they hired the firm to help with. in the case of CU, it was the successful hiring of a new hc. even if that hc was not sourced by the firm or anything else.

the fact that the firm may have edited their site to remove the reference is a good thing-- it shows they are aware of the optics.

also, you all don't know what the firm said to CU about kd or whether it supported or recommended the hire or if they had alternative options.

clients make ****ty choices on their own, all the time.

settle down.
Click to expand...
The firm hasn’t edited their site - KD is still on there and he’s shown in a rotating banner of “Recent Placements”. I think most of us are poking some fun at the situation and acknowledge it’s ultimately not the search firm’s fault if a school makes a terrible hire, but I’m also not buying that the firm just happened to be engaged when the hire happened so they’re taking credit. “Placement” suggests some active role in him getting the job - where’s Hokie when we need him to obsess over the specific language?
 
Hank said:
Welp - here's RG's opening statement when KD was introduced:

"Long time no see, for some of you. Welcome back and thanks for coming out today. I want to thank Coach (Darrin) Chiaverini for leading the program on an interim basis over the past two weeks, and ensuring that our student athletes were taken care of. Darrin is a great Buff who cares deeply about our program. I have a lot of respect and admiration for him. I also see some of our former football players here. Barry (Remington), Dave (Thistle), Conley Smith, it's great that you're here. Coach (Tad) Boyle is here. It's about family, and it's about us taking care of each other. I also would be remiss if I didn't thank Lance Carl, who was my partner in crime on this to be able to get somebody like Karl Dorrell here. I couldn't be more excited about that and also Eastman & Beaudine and their support through this process."

https://cubuffs.com/news/2020/2/24/football-karl-dorrell-introductory-press-conference-quotes
Click to expand...
I think they were involved-that's where the Sarkisian name came from. I think you're on the right track......only I think Rick and Lance saw the Dolphins' promotion on twitter. That's something a beat writer likely would still put out on a platform like that.
 
ahoelsken said:
I think they were involved-that's where the Sarkisian name came from. I think you're on the right track......only I think Rick and Lance saw the Dolphins' promotion on twitter. That's something a beat writer likely would still put out on a platform like that.
Click to expand...
Who knows? But Joe Schad did put it out mid-day on Feb 20. Rick George follows him.

 
I have no idea why everyone is having this debate. The Mercury News has direct quotes from Rick George on exactly how it went down. A search firm did not recommend him. Perhaps one got involved after the fact, as a way to communicate to the agent. But it is crystal clear that the name of Karl Dorrell was generated internally by the two men most in charge of football at CU (unless of course they lied to the Mercury News, which I doubt). Below is the snip from the Mercury News article in 2020. It also answers what RG was looking for in a coach. I agree with @manhattanbuff that RG panicked, or more specifically, he overcorrected based on his experience with Tucker, who clearly lied to him (although all employees will deny looking around until they suddenly resign to take a new job. Right? Tucker simply played both sides for the best deal. Boo Hoo, CU pussies.)

Mercury News:

The tumult created by Tucker’s departure, just 14 months after his arrival, helped frame the search:

George wanted stability, discipline, experience, “somebody the players could look up to” — somebody who shared his vision of reviving what was once a heavyweight program.

Former Colorado star Eric Bieniemy had his sights on an NFL job. Air Force’s Troy Calhoun, Arkansas’s Bret Bielema and Alabama playcaller Steve Sarkisian were among the names linked in the media to the vacancy.

For various reasons, nobody worked.

Nine days into the search, it was time for a pause.

Sitting in his office, George turned to his chief lieutenant on football matters, associate athletic director Lance Carl.

“Why haven’t we considered Karl Dorrell?”

“I don’t know,’’ Carl responded.

“Let’s call him.”
 
Liver said:
that is why i said apparently-- there was a post earlier suggesting it had been deleted and i am far too uncorked to verify that.

"hey mister lawyer, i know you have advised me to the best of your ability and i have made my own decisions but i still want to blame you for my own stupidity."
Click to expand...
"The fact that apparently" ain't the best writing I've seen come from a lawyer.
 
Liver said:
that's the thing-- search firms and i-banks are whores with no self awareness. they think they add value even if they don't actually directly deliver the retained result.

they undoubtedly set up some kind of a process, reached out to candidates, did some vetting and background and "worked" with CU to identify what CU wanted in a hire. etc.

the last one to blame in the hiring of kd is a search firm... i find it highly improbable that the firm said hey ignore these other candidates who are now left and hire kd.
Click to expand...
I lay all blame at the feet of Rick George. Trust.

Me wondering about the search firm is mostly to build an additional layer to my case against Rick George.
 
Creebuzz said:
I have no idea why everyone is having this debate. The Mercury News has direct quotes from Rick George on exactly how it went down. A search firm did not recommend him. Perhaps one got involved after the fact, as a way to communicate to the agent. But it is crystal clear that the name of Karl Dorrell was generated internally by the two men most in charge of football at CU (unless of course they lied to the Mercury News, which I doubt). Below is the snip from the Mercury News article in 2020. It also answers what RG was looking for in a coach. I agree with @manhattanbuff that RG panicked, or more specifically, he overcorrected based on his experience with Tucker, who clearly lied to him (although all employees will deny looking around until they suddenly resign to take a new job. Right? Tucker simply played both sides for the best deal. Boo Hoo, CU pussies.)

Mercury News:

The tumult created by Tucker’s departure, just 14 months after his arrival, helped frame the search:

George wanted stability, discipline, experience, “somebody the players could look up to” — somebody who shared his vision of reviving what was once a heavyweight program.

Former Colorado star Eric Bieniemy had his sights on an NFL job. Air Force’s Troy Calhoun, Arkansas’s Bret Bielema and Alabama playcaller Steve Sarkisian were among the names linked in the media to the vacancy.

For various reasons, nobody worked.

Nine days into the search, it was time for a pause.

Sitting in his office, George turned to his chief lieutenant on football matters, associate athletic director Lance Carl.

“Why haven’t we considered Karl Dorrell?”

“I don’t know,’’ Carl responded.

“Let’s call him.”
Click to expand...
Regardless what RG said to some newspaper, the reason people are having this debate is that the search firm in question, on its own website, lists Karl Dorrell to CU among its “Recent Placements.” At a minimum the story of how the hire went down is murky.
 
How come every time CU is searching for a head coach we are told “there is a high level of interest” but we always end up with schmucks? I can only assume the “high level of interest” comes from fired coaches, high school coaches, inexperienced coaches and Russian bots.
 
DBT said:
How come every time CU is searching for a head coach we are told “there is a high level of interest” but we always end up with schmucks? I can only assume the “high level of interest” comes from fired coaches, high school coaches, inexperienced coaches and Russian bots.
Click to expand...
"High level of interest" means the practice of using CU as a threat to get a raise from their current employer.
 
SINKRATZ said:
Regardless what RG said to some newspaper, the reason people are having this debate is that the search firm in question, on its own website, lists Karl Dorrell to CU among its “Recent Placements.” At a minimum the story of how the hire went down is murky.
Click to expand...

The search firm process is listed below. I think the firm can assist with the placement without being the source of the name. They could’ve been involved in only the last part, the contract negotiation. Keep in mind that the Mercury News article quotes RG as saying he offered Dorrell the job before leaving his house. So, you could blame E&B for a terrible contract too, but a lot of the negotiating power could be lost when a candidate is selected prior to negotiations under its process. Regardless, there is no way to be 100% certain, but I firmly believe that Dorrell was sourced internally by RG and LC, and the contemporaneous facts support that. The picture of Dorrell on the website is marketing, and just indicates that it was involved in the process at some point in his “placement” at CU.

1666132204927.gif

Again, from the Mercury News:

George’s recall was similar.

“He was there for McCartney and Neuheisel and knew what we needed. And he had a recruiting plan. He knew what to sell, the campus and the way of life.”

The doorbell rang: FedEx.

Instantly, Dorrell’s dogs, a Yorkie and Basenji, went wild.

Dorrell excused himself and headed to the door.

George turned to Carl.

“I like this guy, and I’m going to offer him the job before we leave the house.”

Carl looked at George.

“Yep, this is the guy.”

Dorrell returned, and the discussion continued for another hour or so.

By 4 p.m., George was in a great place. Dorrell? He wasn’t sure where things stood.

“I walked them to the door and thought they would be calling later to tell me if I was in or out.”

Before he reached the door, George turned to Dorrell.

“I want you to be our head coach.”
 
Last edited:
Creebuzz said:
The search firm process is listed below. I think the firm can assist with the placement without being the source of the name. They could’ve been involved in only the last part, the contract negotiation. Keep in mind that the Mercury News article quotes RG as saying he offered Dorrell the job before leaving his house. So, you could blame E&B for a terrible contract too, but a lot of the negotiating power could be lost when a candidate is selected prior to negotiations under its process. Regardless, there is no way to be 100% certain, but I firmly believe that Dorrell was sourced internally by RG and LC, and the contemporaneous facts support that. The picture of Dorrell on the website is marketing, and just indicates that it was involved in the process at some point in his “placement” at CU.

View attachment 55100
Click to expand...
I love this rabbit hole. I think it is a possible quid quo pro situation and perhaps RG misused Department funds.
 
Listen, I don’t even care that we are using this search firm so long as we learn from whatever mistakes have been made in the past. It really feels like we are doing the exact same thing we did last time and expecting different results.
 
Hank said:
"The fact that apparently" ain't the best writing I've seen come from a lawyer.
Click to expand...
ex-lawyer, although still licensed.

you've seen my writing here, right? my record stands for itself. totally.
 
Creebuzz said:
The search firm process is listed below. I think the firm can assist with the placement without being the source of the name. They could’ve been involved in only the last part, the contract negotiation. Keep in mind that the Mercury News article quotes RG as saying he offered Dorrell the job before leaving his house. So, you could blame E&B for a terrible contract too, but a lot of the negotiating power could be lost when a candidate is selected prior to negotiations under its process. Regardless, there is no way to be 100% certain, but I firmly believe that Dorrell was sourced internally by RG and LC, and the contemporaneous facts support that. The picture of Dorrell on the website is marketing, and just indicates that it was involved in the process at some point in his “placement” at CU.

View attachment 55100

Again, from the Mercury News:

George’s recall was similar.

“He was there for McCartney and Neuheisel and knew what we needed. And he had a recruiting plan. He knew what to sell, the campus and the way of life.”

The doorbell rang: FedEx.

Instantly, Dorrell’s dogs, a Yorkie and Basenji, went wild.

Dorrell excused himself and headed to the door.

George turned to Carl.

“I like this guy, and I’m going to offer him the job before we leave the house.”

Carl looked at George.

“Yep, this is the guy.”

Dorrell returned, and the discussion continued for another hour or so.

By 4 p.m., George was in a great place. Dorrell? He wasn’t sure where things stood.

“I walked them to the door and thought they would be calling later to tell me if I was in or out.”

Before he reached the door, George turned to Dorrell.

“I want you to be our head coach.”
Click to expand...
JFC man, I’m not going to read all that. What I know is KD is listed on their website as recently placed with CU and George thanked them at the KD introductory presser. I’m not going to pretend to know how much involvement that means and I really don’t care.
 
The KD image is on a carousel, you can drag with your mouse or swipe to move it, or just wait and it will scroll eventually.

kd.png
 
SINKRATZ said:
JFC man, I’m not going to read all that. What I know is KD is listed on their website as recently placed with CU and George thanked them at the KD introductory presser. I’m not going to pretend to know how much involvement that means and I really don’t care.
Click to expand...
Which is fine as long as you're not bitching or cheering over their involvement. Anyone who is should try to have an informed opinion.
 
Buffnik said:
Which is fine as long as you're not bitching or cheering over their involvement. Anyone who is should try to have an informed opinion.
Click to expand...
I don’t know enough about this firm to have a strong opinion about their capabilities, but it does appear George is going back to what is familiar and comfortable for him and that gives me some pause I suppose.
 
It's a glorified employment agency in a bland Dallas exurb. I'd guess the principals wear $80 ties and go home at 3:30.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top