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Official Late Signing Day Thread:

Heres a breakdown of sorts. This goes by P5 offers and what players had including the offer from the Buffs.

Glad I did this as I thought the Buffs had a much better class. Now I'm pissed! Mac either goes 2-0 to start the year or gtfo! Sorries jmho

Dimitri Stanley 10
Israel Antwine 10
Deion Smith 11
Aaron Maddox 8
Derrick Abrams 6
Frank Fillip 6
Davrion Taylor 5
Darrion Jones 5
Dylan thomas 5
Daniel Arias 4
Clyde Moore 3
Jarek Broussard 3
Lavon Wallace 3
Mustafa Johns 2
Joshua Gustav 2
Jake Finav 2
Hassan Hypolite 2
Josh Jones 2
Alex 2
Blake 1
Ray 1
 
CarmelBuff said:
Heres a breakdown of sorts. This goes by P5 offers and what players had including the offer from the Buffs.

Glad I did this as I thought the Buffs had a much better class. Now I'm pissed! Mac either goes 2-0 to start the year or gtfo! Sorries jmho

Dimitri Stanley 10
Israel Antwine 10
Deion Smith 11
Aaron Maddox 8
Derrick Abrams 6
Frank Fillip 6
Davrion Taylor 5
Darrion Jones 5
Dylan thomas 5
Daniel Arias 4
Clyde Moore 3
Jarek Broussard 3
Lavon Wallace 3
Mustafa Johns 2
Joshua Gustav 2
Jake Finav 2
Hassan Hypolite 2
Josh Jones 2
Alex 2
Blake 1
Ray 1
Click to expand...

I'm not sure this is really an accurate representation of the offers that players received. For example, 247 reports Abrams had offers from 11 schools, Ray had offers from 16 schools, Blake committed early and didn't seem to entertain/ report any other offers.. etc. Not sure where you pulled your data from but it's mostly incorrect.

EDIT: I see that you said P5 Offers including the Buffs. Even then I think you need to check your numbers.
 
All the numbers came from 247 and skimmed rivals so it is what it is. Blake may have committed early and I was going to give him the benefit but this ain't no gentleman game. If he would have been gunslinging the big boys would have been all over his a$$.

Been a Buffs fan for years but how in the hell did Mac just have a class like this with arguably the best facilities in the country and the Folsom view and experience. I hope like hell RG has his finger on the trigger and a Brinks truck ready!!!
 
CarmelBuff said:
All the numbers came from 247 and skimmed rivals so it is what it is. Blake may have committed early and I was going to give him the benefit but this ain't no gentleman game. If he would have been gunslinging the big boys would have been all over his a$$.

Been a Buffs fan for years but how in the hell did Mac just have a class like this with arguably the best facilities in the country and the Folsom view and experience. I hope like hell RG has his finger on the trigger and a Brinks truck ready!!!
Click to expand...
I honestly think people oversell the facilities and what it means to a recruit. Yes CU has good ones but they aren’t so vastly superior to sway someone who’s on the fence from choosing between let’s say us and USC or UO. And on the list of what’s important to an 18 year old, facilities aren’t necessarily the top thing. You know what is? Winning. Winning. Then there is winning. Or a path to the NFL. Or academics. Or liking a programs “brand”. CU doesn’t have that brand, yet, to overcome a decade of losing.

Edit: and frankly, the facilities are where they are supposed to be for a P5. Not better.
 
vinniew_11 said:
I honestly think people oversell the facilities and what it means to a recruit. Yes CU has good ones but they aren’t so vastly superior to sway someone who’s on the fence from choosing between let’s say us and USC or UO. And on the list of what’s important to an 18 year old, facilities aren’t necessarily the top thing. You know what is? Winning. Winning. Then there is winning. Or a path to the NFL. Or academics. Or liking a programs “brand”. CU doesn’t have that brand, yet, to overcome a decade of losing.
Click to expand...
1. Coaches
2. Program success
3. Facilities
4. Academics/School

When a school has all 4 of those pulling in the right direction that is when things come together like Georgia this recruiting class. Obviously CU has some work to do with bringing in better recruiters but it has gotten better over the last couple of seasons.
 
onealcd said:
1. Coaches
2. Program success
3. Facilities
4. Academics/School

When a school has all 4 of those pulling in the right direction that is when things come together like Georgia this recruiting class. Obviously CU has some work to do with bringing in better recruiters but it has gotten better over the last couple of seasons.
Click to expand...
I’d actually flop 3 and 4 with CUs acidemic reputation.

Edit: nevermind! Not a ranking. Ha.
 
vinniew_11 said:
I’d actually flop 3 and 4 with CUs acidemic reputation.

Edit: nevermind! Not a ranking. Ha.
Click to expand...
It was a ranking, certain kids can definitely put things in a different order but those 4 usually go in that order. CU's facilities are amazing, probably top 30 in the country but that can only take you so far when you are lacking on the first two and that is what you saw this year, a solid class but missed opportunities.
 
onealcd said:
1. Coaches
2. Program success
3. Facilities
4. Academics/School

When a school has all 4 of those pulling in the right direction that is when things come together like Georgia this recruiting class. Obviously CU has some work to do with bringing in better recruiters but it has gotten better over the last couple of seasons.
Click to expand...
With coaches though comes relationships.
1st relationships with other schools coaches.
2nd with the kid being recruited.

I watched Indiana tear it up this year in Florida and especially Tampa. Currently there are 19 Florida kids on the roster from built relationships the coaches had with high school staffs down in Florida.

You mentioned Georgia. I need to find the article but Smart has a 550,000 budget for his recruiting staff alone. They are out in front all the time and not only the asst. coaches but Smart is building the relationship as well.

I would say if you have the relationship built, the kid visits and feels "AT HOME" you are gonna get the kid or at least be at the top of the list.
Then of course a tour of the school as this is where the kid will be spending his days.
Next Facilities/Program success OR direction.

BUT how do you think CU would fare with the old facilities?

Facilities plays a part but my point about Mac was RG just invested major dollars. Its time for some ROI so if Mac doesn't put up and soon how long do you give him? If you compare the other Mac (Bill) and his rocky start at this point he was bringing in major recruits and setting it up for a kill. Mike Mac though???
 
CarmelBuff said:
With coaches though comes relationships.
1st relationships with other schools coaches.
2nd with the kid being recruited.

I watched Indiana tear it up this year in Florida and especially Tampa. Currently there are 19 Florida kids on the roster from built relationships the coaches had with high school staffs down in Florida.

You mentioned Georgia. I need to find the article but Smart has a 550,000 budget for his recruiting staff alone. They are out in front all the time and not only the asst. coaches but Smart is building the relationship as well.

I would say if you have the relationship built, the kid visits and feels "AT HOME" you are gonna get the kid or at least be at the top of the list.
Then of course a tour of the school as this is where the kid will be spending his days.
Next Facilities/Program success OR direction.

BUT how do you think CU would fare with the old facilities?

Facilities plays a part but my point about Mac was RG just invested major dollars. Its time for some ROI so if Mac doesn't put up and soon how long do you give him? If you compare the other Mac (Bill) and his rocky start at this point he was bringing in major recruits and setting it up for a kill. Mike Mac though???
Click to expand...
Can’t compare the two. The recruiting game is 2000x more sophisticated than it used to be.

And in regards to Indiana, they still suck with FL players
 
CarmelBuff said:
Heres a breakdown of sorts. This goes by P5 offers and what players had including the offer from the Buffs.

Glad I did this as I thought the Buffs had a much better class. Now I'm pissed! Mac either goes 2-0 to start the year or gtfo! Sorries jmho

Dimitri Stanley 10
Israel Antwine 10
Deion Smith 11
Aaron Maddox 8
Derrick Abrams 6
Frank Fillip 6
Davrion Taylor 5
Darrion Jones 5
Dylan thomas 5
Daniel Arias 4
Clyde Moore 3
Jarek Broussard 3
Lavon Wallace 3
Mustafa Johns 2
Joshua Gustav 2
Jake Finav 2
Hassan Hypolite 2
Josh Jones 2
Alex 2
Blake 1
Ray 1
Click to expand...
I assume by 'Ray' you mean, Kanan Ray? If that is the case, you may want to recheck your facts on his reported P5 offers.
 
Juco's rarely pick up a ton of P5 offers. They are "special circumstances". Maddox, Abrams, Taylor, Jones all have much better offer lists than Jucos we've been taking.
Mustafa and Tchangam each had two P5 offers.
Laguda had 2 P5 offers, and was a 2 year starter here.
Carrell had 0 P5 offers, and plays for the Dallas Cowboys.
Leo Jackson had 0 other offers of any sort, and started the equivalent of 2 full seasons here.
Witherspoon had 3 P5 offers, and plays for the SF 49ers.

In contrast, the Juco Class above is far and away much more highly coveted than any Jucos we've had here. I think you're not properly weighting the often lower number of offers that Jucos get in your analysis.
 
vinniew_11 said:
Can’t compare the two. The recruiting game is 2000x more sophisticated than it used to be.

And in regards to Indiana, they still suck with FL players
Click to expand...
Simply using IU as an example of what coaches relationships can do for recruiting. The past 5 years they have made 2 bowl games and CU just one. I follow the Buffs and IU but IU did well in recruiting this year and someone posted something similar on an IU board in regards to P5 offers so it got me wondering about CU's class. For IU to beat CU on the recruiting trail just shows which direction CU is headed and sorry but it doesn't make me happy! The Buffs have a MUCH better football tradition than IU and its not even close. Meanwhile, CU comes off a bowl game last year, hires a defensive wtf hire (I was hoping the freakin guy could at least recruit) and now ends up with a subpar class like this and the d-coord is still employed. Plus the first two games next year are against crew and knu. So if we go 0-2 next year what are your thoughts?
 
CarmelBuff said:
Simply using IU as an example of what coaches relationships can do for recruiting. The past 5 years they have made 2 bowl games and CU just one. I follow the Buffs and IU but IU did well in recruiting this year and someone posted something similar on an IU board in regards to P5 offers so it got me wondering about CU's class. For IU to beat CU on the recruiting trail just shows which direction CU is headed and sorry but it doesn't make me happy! The buffs have a MUCH better football tradition than IU. Meanwhile, CU comes off a bowl game last year, hires a defensive wtf hire (I was hoping the freakin guy could at least recruit) and now ends up with a subpar class like this and the d-coord is still employed. Plus the first two games next year are against crew and knu. So if we go 0-2 next year what are your thoughts?
Click to expand...
They won’t go 0-2. Period. So that doesn’t enter my mind at all. Secondly, this class is better than you are giving it credit for.
 
buffaholic said:
Juco's rarely pick up a ton of P5 offers. They are "special circumstances". Maddox, Abrams, Taylor, Jones all have much better offer lists than Jucos we've been taking.
Mustafa and Tchangam each had two P5 offers.
Laguda had 2 P5 offers, and was a 2 year starter here.
Carrell had 0 P5 offers, and plays for the Dallas Cowboys.
Leo Jackson had 0 other offers of any sort, and started the equivalent of 2 full seasons here.
Witherspoon had 3 P5 offers, and plays for the SF 49ers.

In contrast, the Juco Class above is far and away much more highly coveted than any Jucos we've had here. I think you're not properly weighting the often lower number of offers that Jucos get in your analysis.
Click to expand...
Didn't realize there were that many jucos and the fact that some of these guys with hardly any P5 offers are in the league means that they were developed. BUT if the development is that good why the drop off this past year? I honestly thought as did most of you that with Montez returning and all the receivers CU would go bowling again. The defense sucked and went backwards. Anyone have faith in Elliot? I just can't live with a f*cking knu loss next year.
 
CarmelBuff said:
Didn't realize there were that many jucos and the fact that some of these guys with hardly any P5 offers are in the league means that they were developed. BUT if the development is that good why the drop off this past year? I honestly thought as did most of you that with Montez returning and all the receivers CU would go bowling again. The defense sucked and went backwards. Anyone have faith in Elliot? I just can't live with a f*cking knu loss next year.
Click to expand...
They lost 7 guys who either made it to the NFL or camped with NFL teams. That’s a hell of a lot of talent. They were extremely young on D last season. And I honestly don’t think Montez is all that good, so I was not hanging my hopes on him anyways.
 
Duff Man said:
Sure, but that's partly on the coaches for developing very little depth to take over.

I think acting like the sharp defensive decline in 2017 was inevitable is a copout.
Click to expand...

I think the biggest part of our defensive decline was due to not having an effective nose tackle ready to go when Tupou went to the NFL. We had hopes for Edwards but last year he wasn't it.

This all directly relates back to the utter failure over the past few years to recruit and develop interior D-line prospects out of high school.

Hard to play defense when the opponent controls the LOS.
 
CarmelBuff said:
Didn't realize there were that many jucos and the fact that some of these guys with hardly any P5 offers are in the league means that they were developed. BUT if the development is that good why the drop off this past year? I honestly thought as did most of you that with Montez returning and all the receivers CU would go bowling again. The defense sucked and went backwards. Anyone have faith in Elliot? I just can't live with a f*cking knu loss next year.
Click to expand...

I'm totally in agreement with Duff here. Your team is only as good as the weakest link. Our weakest link was DL/pass rush. We lost Tupou, Kafovalu, Carrell and Jimmy Gilbert as well as Falo. The pipeline did not develop, and they were left with more band-aiding.

We are band-aiding again in 2017, and frankly will probably be doing so on the DL for another few years, as the underclass pipeline is in trouble even if EVERY guy we took develops. You don't fix poor HS recruiting at an entire position group quickly, and we are not taking numbers there (yet). Looks tough.

I am unprepared to have a well-informed debate about Eliot and his play-calling because I think it's pretty tough on a DC to make adjustments to having your DL getting blown off the LOS. Would Jim Leavitt have had better results? Could MM do better? Eliot didn't create this problem. In less than one year on staff, Eliot personally recruited Antwine and helped move Jeffcoat along. At this point, all I can say is that at least he sees the problem. Quick fixes are not available.
 
onealcd said:
1. Coaches
2. Program success
3. Facilities
4. Academics/School

When a school has all 4 of those pulling in the right direction that is when things come together like Georgia this recruiting class. Obviously CU has some work to do with bringing in better recruiters but it has gotten better over the last couple of seasons.
Click to expand...
I think we were all wrong. Here's an interesting article http://picksixpreviews.com/how_to_win_in_recruiting.html
 
Didn't really follow recruiting this year. Mustafa Johnson looks like a good prospect from the little I have watched of him. I also like Hypolite style.
 
Last edited:
buffaholic said:
I'm totally in agreement with Duff here. Your team is only as good as the weakest link. Our weakest link was DL/pass rush. We lost Tupou, Kafovalu, Carrell and Jimmy Gilbert as well as Falo. The pipeline did not develop, and they were left with more band-aiding.

We are band-aiding again in 2017, and frankly will probably be doing so on the DL for another few years, as the underclass pipeline is in trouble even if EVERY guy we took develops. You don't fix poor HS recruiting at an entire position group quickly, and we are not taking numbers there (yet). Looks tough.

I am unprepared to have a well-informed debate about Eliot and his play-calling because I think it's pretty tough on a DC to make adjustments to having your DL getting blown off the LOS. Would Jim Leavitt have had better results? Could MM do better? Eliot didn't create this problem. In less than one year on staff, Eliot personally recruited Antwine and helped move Jeffcoat along. At this point, all I can say is that at least he sees the problem. Quick fixes are not available.
Click to expand...

Didn't we also lose Umu? Hell i consider Lopez a loss as well since there was high hope for him replacing Tupo if recall correctly. Yes coaches faults for not recruiting better, but hardly Eliots fault.
 
"This process gave us a peek into the minds of the most important demographic: teenage football players. Everyone who follows college football surely has an opinion on every program and, consciously or unconsciously, has their own personal ranking system comprised of all the brands. However, a middle-aged man probably has a different, more favorable perception of a once-gloried program than a young teenager who never witnessed a winning season. Rather, the lifeblood of a college program lies in the minds of high school football players." from the picksixpreview article. Important to consider that minus the 10-2 season, CU hasn't really done anything since the early 2000's. This perspective is my reasoning for thinking that Chev and MM need more time to build up legacy at CU for this generation.

Also, not really going to comment on the actual ratings. CU may not be as low as they say but they probably are not as high as I'd like to think.
 
BuffNut said:
Didn't we also lose Umu? Hell i consider Lopez a loss as well since there was high hope for him replacing Tupo if recall correctly. Yes coaches faults for not recruiting better, but hardly Eliots fault.
Click to expand...
Umu was being talked about as a starter or in contention for starting time, but it's difficult to say. Certainly a loss, but I suppose it's one that was self-inflicted. Recruit better people?

You're flat out confused on Lopez. He wasn't ever going ot replace Tupo (sic).
 
CarmelBuff said:
I think we were all wrong. Here's an interesting article http://picksixpreviews.com/how_to_win_in_recruiting.html
Click to expand...

Mostly good medicine! The best quote in this article is for all those outspoken allbuffers who believe in the magical recruiter-the position coach who can convince top recruits to come here with some superhuman charisma. This magical recruiter mythos is complete fantasy.

"Yet, despite all the phone calls, letters, text messages, unofficial visits, or any other obscure recruiting tactics that coaches deploy to attract elite talent, the final recruiting rankings align precisely with the high school demographic’s perceived brand rankings. The actual act of recruiting, apparently, is one giant charade. Is it necessary? Sure. Will marginally better recruiting execution lead to better results? No."

So lets focus on getting position coaches that can motivate and teach (while projecting ability to teach and motivate to recruits) and let the HC/AD build the brand.
 
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