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Official Michigan State/Mel Tucker Hate Thread
- Thread starter ahoelsken
- Start date
I understand this but I think the combination of the MSU history and Tucker's lack of response to the charges puts the odds solidly in the universities favor. Part of their response to the Nasser situation was putting in mandatory training and strict policy. He can't claim he didn't know.
Tugger has a viable defense by arguing that consensual sexual conduct does not violate the morality clause in his contract. I'm not saying that's true (either that the conduct was consensual or that it wouldn't be a breach even if it were), I'm saying that MSU will not want to have a jury decide that issue--just reading this thread should give you a decent understanding of why.
Maybe the deleted texts, if recovered, will be the evidence that’ll swing this thing one way or the other.
You’re probably right and if so, then it boils down to your previous point.
You are not a “finder of fact.” No one has any interest in nor obligation to provide you with any “evidence” or “proof.”
Being a bystander, asserting your preconceived notions on how you think a victim of a rape would/should act when faced with yet more unexpected, improper conduct (in this case by a trusted male authority figure)…. This is not a good or helpful plan.
Not to mention that “Finder of fact” on the internet is an oxymoron
If MSU decides to litigate, Tucker can open up a can of worms in discovery. There may be some favorable jury pool populations out there for Tucker. Settlements are all about loss mitigation. Losses can be financial or reputational.
MSU can offer a nice GTFO financial settlement and still be a huge winner since they were on the hook for $80 million to a dude stinking up the joint. This is not difficult.
MSU can offer a nice GTFO financial settlement and still be a huge winner since they were on the hook for $80 million to a dude stinking up the joint. This is not difficult.
Wouldn't Tugger want UM fans on the jury thinking they would want to stick it to MSU and make them pay.
Yeah. And the opposing counsel would want MSU fans eager to stick it to Tucker and save the University from having to pay him. Everybody on that jury will have a bias one way or the other.
Tucker goes after the moral turpitude clause in his response today.
It seems to me that there are two clauses that could lead to his termination for cause.
Section III refers to “early termination” and states the school can end the contract, without liability, if Tucker “engages in any conduct which constitutes moral turpitude” or “would bring public disrespect, contempt or ridicule upon the university.”
SeanMSan
Well-Known Member
Can Mel make turpitude into a hashtag slogan?
I agree on the two clauses. However, Moral Turpitude is vague, and the only reason public ridicule was brought upon the university is because someone affiliated with the university allegedly leaked it to a journalist, an act which the university is investigating from within.
I simply do not see how it’s in the interest of the university to litigate this versus settling it where Tucker takes a massive haircut on his remaining contract. Settling makes sense. Of course, this is Michigan State so maybe they decide to not hit the easy button.
#RelentlessTurpitude
That last part is really vague. It could be argued, for instance, that being ****ty at football would bring a great deal of ridicule upon the university.
buffalo1
Club Member
But who was the coach who had the AD employee girl on the back of his motorcycle when he wrecked. Some SEC school perhaps. Do I have the story half correct and is he coaching again?
The early termination clauses are problematic.
As listed above he was at Arkansas when the motorcycle incident happened. And he's the OC at A&M now
He's the OC at Texas A&M, a job that probably pays a lot more than many G5 head coaches are making.
Lot of differences here.
A lot of schools still wouldn't touch him but he gave himself a chance to get back into it.
He handled it much differently than Mel though. It didn't take him long after to admit what he did and ask forgiveness instead of trying to maintain his innocence (harder to do that with the photos out there,) This is a big part of why I think Mel would be much better off to negotiate and out, admit his role, and move on. What Mel did does not appear to rise to a level of criminal charges so if he begs forgiveness he will probably get it.
Petrino also chose to be an idiot at a school that hadn't recently been the focus of national attention and massive settlements in a sex scandal involving university employees.
The bigger difference is that Petrino is also a white good ol' boy who won a lot of football games. That gets him a lot of slack in the south.
MSU has a big problem in all this in that they slow walked Brenda Tracys complaint. This after failing on two previous Title IX inquiries.
I would assume if MT were fired for cause/moral turpitude it would pretty quickly go trial. The man is owed money and in his mind he was in a consensual relationship. And he probably wants to try to salvage his reputation even though a trial might not do that. Anyway, that means all kinds of witnesses being called by both sides that say they saw X, Y, or Z.
One would assume that Brenda Tracy counter sues Tucker and MSU. And if she does you probably see the AD or Assoc AD, Chancellor, Provosts, Deans, Compliance, HR and on and on called to the stand to explain why it took a FOIA request to move this along. And "Mrs HR manager could you please tell the court who appeared to be slow walking this?"
Since the Department of Educations Office of Civil Rights has stepped into the picture and opened yet another investigation into MSU. So with that I am not sure how any of this proceeds. Why pay Turcker or Tracy If DOE-OCR eventually makes a lot of this public anyways. On the other hand a trial as I describe above might give DOE-OCR a road map of who to talk to.
In the end I think MT and Tracy get paid a lot to keep this out of court and quietly go away. Just my 2 cents.
I would assume if MT were fired for cause/moral turpitude it would pretty quickly go trial. The man is owed money and in his mind he was in a consensual relationship. And he probably wants to try to salvage his reputation even though a trial might not do that. Anyway, that means all kinds of witnesses being called by both sides that say they saw X, Y, or Z.
One would assume that Brenda Tracy counter sues Tucker and MSU. And if she does you probably see the AD or Assoc AD, Chancellor, Provosts, Deans, Compliance, HR and on and on called to the stand to explain why it took a FOIA request to move this along. And "Mrs HR manager could you please tell the court who appeared to be slow walking this?"
Since the Department of Educations Office of Civil Rights has stepped into the picture and opened yet another investigation into MSU. So with that I am not sure how any of this proceeds. Why pay Turcker or Tracy If DOE-OCR eventually makes a lot of this public anyways. On the other hand a trial as I describe above might give DOE-OCR a road map of who to talk to.
In the end I think MT and Tracy get paid a lot to keep this out of court and quietly go away. Just my 2 cents.
SeanMSan
Well-Known Member
I can see the movie now…”from the directing crew that brought you 127 hours. Comes 37 Minutes!”
Maybe fify.
I don't see Brenda Tracy suing Tugger. I can't see what her cause of action would be, nor what her damages would be just based on reports of what had happened.
Nobody complained about him
I'm not sure if this was your intention, because the rest of your post talks exclusively about Tucker/Tracey, but for anyone else who didn't click the link, it' appears to be a different investigation than Tucker/Tracey:
Later in the article:
I'm not naive enough to believe that MSU is the only school at which this happens, including CU. But holy **** what the **** is wrong with them to (a) handle SA/SH complaints this way and (b) not learn from past mistakes?
As the saying goes: Once (Nasser) is happenstance. Twice (Tracey/Tucker) is coincidence. Three times (this latest complaint) is enemy action.
Although you could easily argue that Nasser was way more than three times.
