Trogdor
Soy Boy
Utah gonna curb stomp Oregon if they meet in the CCG.
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Other Games 10/24-10/26
- Thread starter MtnBuff
- Start date
Utah gonna curb stomp Oregon if they meet in the CCG.
Trogdor
Soy Boy
I think people who like Herbert don't know football, which is fine, it's hard to see the little things unless you've been educated by someone or really put in the work. He rarely if ever throws receivers open. This really can't be understated. His comp % and int % are excellent, but if you look behind the curtain you see that's largely a result of him basically only throwing screens and outs to wide open receivers. Something like 80% of his passes are within 5 yards of the LOS. You're gonna see ESPN and the westcoastfootball twitter account trot out "catchable pass %" and he'll be in the top 5. Shocking, he threw 15 screens in 29 attempts. Those stats are fluff for the people trying to sell advertising space and ignore the massive, massive issues he has as a *quarterback*, not as an athlete.
Look at the final "game winning" drive tonight that people will use to hype him up. Screen, out, out, screen. Nothing down the seams, no posts or crossing routes. 1st read throws to the sideline, and screens. That's what he can do for you. What does that tell you about how much the coaches trust his decision making process when they refuse to put his laser rocket arm to use more than a few times a game? He's a senior, yet they know he's going to miss reads, take a bad sack instead of throwing it away, bail from a perfect pocket(this will KILL him at the next level), or escape and then slide down 5-10 yards behind the LOS instead of just flicking it out of bounds.
Remember the play, I think in the 1st half, vs UW last week where he slid nine yards behind the los after being flushed out of the pocket? This wasn't DTR stepping out of bounds 3 yards behind the LOS last year as a freshman. This was a 4th year starter. Or how about against Auburn when he threw the final pass of the game 10 yards out of the back of the endzone.
You know how WSU's pedestrian front 7 got so much pressure on Oregon's vaunted OL tonight? Their staff recognized that it doesn't take Bill Belichick's defense to make Herbert "see ghosts". WSU took huge splits and didn't even try to bend the edge, because they knew once Herbert felt them get level with him in the pocket, regardless of how safe he actually was, he'd panic. Instead of stepping up and making a throw, he bails into pressure, misses open receivers and makes otherwise stupid decisions. He's a senior QB who plays like a freshman, but with NFL athleticism.
Darron Thomas was relegated to a similarly small playbook because his mechanics were so bad he couldn't be trusted to not over throw balls to the middle of the field. Mechanically Herbert is solid, but his decision making is so_bad, the playbook is limited like it was for a dude who couldn't hold his jock from an arm talent stand point. When your 4th year starter has to have the playbook limited for him, again, that's damning.
I hate going after guys, or pumping them up because of intangibles, because those things are hard to define and therefore easy to defend(or attack), but Herbert lacks all of them. Poise, moxie, gamer, whatever you want to call it, he ain't got "it". If it were on the hard court people would say he has a low basketball IQ. How is that suddenly going to get better in the NFL? People are going to look at the measureables, it's easy and you can move right on: 6'6 240, 4 sport HS athlete(high jumper even), 69%, 1 INT, massive arm, good overall movement abilities. But just watch him play the game, just watch him quarterback and think "is that the guy I want leading my team?". Don't watch him throw, watch him quarterback. I think he's as sure fire a bust as you'll ever see. It sucks too, because he's so close to being great, but actually astoundingly far away.
Look at the final "game winning" drive tonight that people will use to hype him up. Screen, out, out, screen. Nothing down the seams, no posts or crossing routes. 1st read throws to the sideline, and screens. That's what he can do for you. What does that tell you about how much the coaches trust his decision making process when they refuse to put his laser rocket arm to use more than a few times a game? He's a senior, yet they know he's going to miss reads, take a bad sack instead of throwing it away, bail from a perfect pocket(this will KILL him at the next level), or escape and then slide down 5-10 yards behind the LOS instead of just flicking it out of bounds.
Remember the play, I think in the 1st half, vs UW last week where he slid nine yards behind the los after being flushed out of the pocket? This wasn't DTR stepping out of bounds 3 yards behind the LOS last year as a freshman. This was a 4th year starter. Or how about against Auburn when he threw the final pass of the game 10 yards out of the back of the endzone.
You know how WSU's pedestrian front 7 got so much pressure on Oregon's vaunted OL tonight? Their staff recognized that it doesn't take Bill Belichick's defense to make Herbert "see ghosts". WSU took huge splits and didn't even try to bend the edge, because they knew once Herbert felt them get level with him in the pocket, regardless of how safe he actually was, he'd panic. Instead of stepping up and making a throw, he bails into pressure, misses open receivers and makes otherwise stupid decisions. He's a senior QB who plays like a freshman, but with NFL athleticism.
Darron Thomas was relegated to a similarly small playbook because his mechanics were so bad he couldn't be trusted to not over throw balls to the middle of the field. Mechanically Herbert is solid, but his decision making is so_bad, the playbook is limited like it was for a dude who couldn't hold his jock from an arm talent stand point. When your 4th year starter has to have the playbook limited for him, again, that's damning.
I hate going after guys, or pumping them up because of intangibles, because those things are hard to define and therefore easy to defend(or attack), but Herbert lacks all of them. Poise, moxie, gamer, whatever you want to call it, he ain't got "it". If it were on the hard court people would say he has a low basketball IQ. How is that suddenly going to get better in the NFL? People are going to look at the measureables, it's easy and you can move right on: 6'6 240, 4 sport HS athlete(high jumper even), 69%, 1 INT, massive arm, good overall movement abilities. But just watch him play the game, just watch him quarterback and think "is that the guy I want leading my team?". Don't watch him throw, watch him quarterback. I think he's as sure fire a bust as you'll ever see. It sucks too, because he's so close to being great, but actually astoundingly far away.
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hawg1
Well-Known Member
One loss PSU / OSU loser?
One loss Bama / LSU loser?
One loss OU loser?
One loss UGA / Florida loser?
At least 4 of those teams are better than Oregon. Two/three might have wins over Aub, a team 3rd/4th place SEC West team (?) that beat Oregon.
Oregon needs help In my opinion.
But it isn’t necessarily about who’s better but who has a better case and Oregon would be a conference champion unlike everyone on the list but OU.
Just gonna write off Utah?
Yep.
Trogdor
Soy Boy
Almost every year I would say it's abject loser talk to want to play a PSU in the Rose Bowl instead of a Clemson or Ohio St in the CFB playoff, but yikes, this season give me the shot at the RB all day long instead of a surefire brutal loss in the playoff.
Trogdor
Soy Boy
Utah >>>> Oregon. Ducks get their doors blown off in that potential matchup if they play like, well they have all season.
I mentioned this earlier but if Oregon and OU are both 1-loss conference champs I'd have to give the edge to Oregon in that one because OU's loss is far more worse than Oregon's and OU won't have any great wins since UT is falling apart and nobody is really sold on Baylor. As has been mentioned, Oregon's bigger problem will be a 1-loss LSU/Bama or even a 1-loss PSU/OSU.
And I think Oregon is better than Utah. Regardless I think Utah loses in Seattle this week. Wouldn't be surprised if Oregon loses to USC which make all this moot.
And I think Oregon is better than Utah. Regardless I think Utah loses in Seattle this week. Wouldn't be surprised if Oregon loses to USC which make all this moot.
hawg1
Well-Known Member
Charter says four best.
And in practice it usually works like
Are you a P5 team?
Are a you a P5 conference champion (does not apply to SEC)?
How many losses do you have?
How embarrassing are your losses? OR How good are your wins?
I think the term "best" has always been very relative (and A beats B, B beats C, C beats A scenarios are very common) and it's always been about the factors I mentioned above.
Charter can say a lot of things. If you think politics doesn't have a role in the decision then you are ignoring realities.
Ultimately the teams still have to win to get there but past an undefeated conference champion politics is going to go into it. The TV networks are going to be considered. Another consideration is going to be the relationship between the conferences. The fact that the PAC12 has been left out for a couple years isn't going to be ignored.
NewEra 2014
Well-Known Member
The committee has used number of losses as the #1 criterion in selecting the four CFP teams. There has never been a 2-loss team selected for the CFP. But there have been 1-loss teams chosen that did not win their conference.
As a result, there is no reason to play a tough non-conference schedule and risk a loss. Oregon would be better off having played CSU instead of Auburn this season.
We need a true playoff system that includes all conference champs.
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
Forget the UGA/UF loser-they both have a loss each already (Florida to LSU in BR, UGA with that ugly one at home to a 3-5 or whatever they are South Carolina), so that game is basically a playoff elimination game. Frankly, I think that game decides who represents the SEC in the Sugar Bowl. I'm picking Alabama (regardless of Tua or Jones at QB) and LSU over both Florida and Georgia on a neutral field. The committee isn't taking either of these two over a 12-1 Pac 12 champ.
Oklahoma's OOC is worse than Oregon's is-Houston and UCLA aren't going anywhere. Auburn probably finishes 3rd in the SEC West, but that's still a team that probably winds up worst case 9-3. Solid team, and losing to them on a neutral field isn't bad. Nevada PROBABLY gets to the 6 win mark-they're 4-4 right now with games against god-awful New Mexico and god-awful UNLV left. I'd honestly give the edge to Oregon and Utah for that matter over any Big 12 team except MAYBE a 13-0 **** Bailer if that somehow happens (I personally don't think it will-just including it to cover my bases).
As far as Alabama-LSU, I think Tua's injury is so big for whoever winds up losing that game. If he's good to go on 11/9, this is a non-issue. If he plays at less than 100% or doesn't play, I'd argue LSU looks worse and Alabama doesn't get punished as hard if they lose. Advantage to the Bama/LSU loser if its LSU-LSU has three wins that are better than anything Oregon can point to right now. I'm putting Oregon in over Alabama if they lose to LSU. Overall body of work is probably a wash-Alabama's best win in that hypothetical would be Auburn at JH, while Oregon's would either be at Washington or over Utah on a neutral field in the Pac 12 CCG. Alabama's OOC has gotta hurt them here, though. I'm going Ducks instead of Bama because they'd have a better OOC and a Conference championship.
Let's talk Big 10-This one's actually pretty easy to me. Their champ is going to the playoff. Minnesota beating PSU takes 2 Big 10 teams in the playoff out of play-so that's what you root for if you're a Pac 12 fan IMO.
hawg1
Well-Known Member
So far, the Committee as got it right each year IMO.
Medford M.
Well-Known Member
TCU should have been in over TOSH the first year. They would have stomped anyone.
L Buff
Commissar of the Albuffs Collective Left
ahoelsken
Well-Known Member
If OSU beat Wiscy 35-0 if that B1G title game instead of 59-0, they might have been.