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Rivalry Question

Bison

Bison

Buffalo to the core. Space Marine.
Club Member
Boy I missed the feeling of hating the Cornhuskers and it felt so good to beat them!

But it made me realize how much I miss the Big 8 and why that tension that was in the Big 8 appears to be missing in the PAC.

Could it be that we don't necessarily have the us against the world mentality that we had in our old conferences? It seems like we are just another school in the PAC.

Maybe it is from my family's Big 8 terrority links versus CU fans who came from the west coast who might have a better understanding of why USC & UCLA blows. There's some movement of the needle when it comes to both AZ schools and Utah but their fans can't even register 10 percent on the Husker hate meter. I believe we are understanding where Ute fans come from since they have to deal BYU and the rivalry really goes deeper in Utah due to the LDS church. That's why I don't really hate Utah despite trying to get it going in that regard.

Adding BYU or Nebraska to the PAC could potentially recreate that tension in the PAC. Or we could go to the Big Ten.
 
What we miss from the Big8 days are dedicated football fans. It’s as simple as that. There just are’t The same caliber of fans in the PAC, and certainly they don’t travel as well. Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas State, Iowa State even Missery. Entire states with not a ****ing thing going on between end of basketball season and beginning of basketball season besides watching corn grow, tractor pulls and cooking meth.

As much as we despise Husker fan, it is that blind, unbridled and eternally exuberant energy that we miss in other fan bases in the PAC. We just wasted two days vetting Frost’s douchebag claims of dirty play- not that CU fans give a ****, but Husker fan does!! Husker fan now has a rally cry, forgotten is th “L” to CU, it’s brilliant..... and it would never work with a PAC team because we really just don’t give a ****. Maybe unfortunately but we don’t live and die over football. I wish we did sometimes and that is what I miss about the Big8.
 
BuffHerd said:
What we miss from the Big8 days are dedicated football fans. It’s as simple as that. There just are’t The same caliber of fans in the PAC, and certainly they don’t travel as well. Nebraska, Oklahoma, Kansas State, Iowa State even Missery. Entire states with not a ****ing thing going on between end of basketball season and beginning of basketball season besides watching corn grow, tractor pulls and cooking meth.

As much as we despise Husker fan, it is that blind, unbridled and eternally exuberant energy that we miss in other fan bases in the PAC. We just wasted two days vetting Frost’s douchebag claims of dirty play- not that CU fans give a ****, but Husker fan does!! Husker fan now has a rally cry, forgotten is th “L” to CU, it’s brilliant..... and it would never work with a PAC team because we really just don’t give a ****. Maybe unfortunately but we don’t live and die over football. I wish we did sometimes and that is what I miss about the Big8.
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Exactly. I'm going to the Cal game this weekend for $3.75 via stub hub. They are playing Idaho State , but still...
 
Having loved in California and Arizona, prior to here, having an office and second home in Utah, and having only been a CU fan since about 1990, I feel opposite of the OP.

Good riddance to the hillbillies!
 
no to the big 10. too many assholes.

as for the hatred, it has a lot to do with time and experience and it is, as you suggest, partly due to the fact that we were outliers in our previous conference.

i can give you a good reason i hate every single b12 team (at different levels of intensity, of course). it built up over decades of us playing them. the fact that most of them have far ****tier academics, looser admission standards, and are completely culturally different than boulder did not help. even schools that i respected academically (texas, for example) were easy to hate.

with respect to the p12, i respect most of the member institutions. there are no wildly outlaw programs. sure, there are assholes, but even the trolls tend to be more interesting. really, the p12 breaks down like this for me (hate scale, most to least):

1. usc. they are good at football and they are arrogant. i took this one out of the Original Coach Mac's playbook. pick the program you need to beat to dominate the conference.
2. uw. i don't forget the **** they talked when skippy left to go there and then how they begged us to forgive their stupidity when skippy wrecked their program too. and, they think they have a far better historical record than they actually do.
3. oregon. nouveau riche and displays all the symptoms thereof.
4. america's stripper u. they are just douches with really ****ty academics and no history.
5. ucla. this is program that should be better but always manages to **** up. yet, they think they are better than they are. i enjoy ****ing with their dumb fans.
6. arizona. more douches. it must be something about the weather in the desert. no history, but they still think they are relevant.
7. stanford. mostly, just because they play it both ways. when they are good, they say "oh look at us, we are good despite our academic selectivity." and when they suck they say "oh, it is just football, but we are academically selective."
8. washington state. purely because i have a love-hate relationship with the pirate. this program could go full outlaw like kjuco state, but they somehow manage to stay just on the right side of the line.
9. utah. the forced rivalry thing annoys me and i hate that they have been at least as good as us overall in the conference.
10. cal. i forgive them a lot because they are very similar to us and their trolls are funny. although when they kicked our asses up and down the field right after we announced we were joining the pac, on that day, i had a great deal of rage.
11. oregon state. meh.
 
First off, I loved being in the Big 8. Yeah, every roadie was crap, but there was history and a feeling of familiarity that bred contempt but also fraternity. The Nubs thought they were better than everyone else because of football. OU thought they better than everyone else because of football. KU thought they were better than everyone else because of basketball. CU thought we were better than everyone else because, well, we were. But the entire Big 8 knew we were better than a bunch of the other conferences back then, especially those ****ups in the SWC.

The Big 12, though, sucked donkey dick. The Texas schools ripped apart the atmosphere and the traditions of the Big 8. Literally, in the case of the traditions. All of the history of the Big 8 was shelved so those snowflakes wouldn't feel like newcomers. Plus those turncoats OU and Okie Lite sold the rest of the Big 8 down the river when they decided to align themselves with the Texas schools. Plus, while they did bring in Austin, they also brought in Lubbock, College Station, and Waco. ****ing Waco. Good riddance to that ****-stained conference. No rivalry is worth that crap.

The Pac-12 has been disappointing in terms of fan intensity, which is why that feeling that came rushing back with the Nubs has been so elusive for us. Almost every Pac-12 fanbase, if what happened with the Nubs had happened to them would be like, "okay, well, that happened" and moved on by now, which is exactly what the vast majority of our fanbase would do, by the way. So that rivalry is hard to find, especially given our geographic location, and it might take years to show up, if ever.

But remember, we didn't leave the Big 8, we left the Big 12, and you could make the argument that the Big 12 left us well before then.
 
Culturally, we fit much better in the PAC, and can develop rivalries with time. Enthusiasm wise, no PAC fan base is ever going to reach the level of Nebraska or Oklahoma, maybe not even KSU or Mizzou. The closest are probably Oregon, Washington and Utah.
 
I'd like to say "give it time". A coach here, a controversy there, and a rivalry can develop. This is season number 8 in the Pac. The rivalry with Nebraska didn't reach its apex of animosity until the two teams had been playing each other for 40 seasons straight. Keep in mind that Coach Mac 1 had to effectively invent the Nebraska rivalry because CU didn't have a natural conference rival.

In basketball, CU and Arizona definitely had a "thing" for a few years right after we joined the conference. All it took was stealing their NCAA tournament bid and getting robbed by the officials the next season and we had a rivalry on our hands for a little while. I know I started to feel some pretty intense dislike for them and their fans after just a couple of seasons of them coming to Coors Events Center.

The reality is that on the football field the Buffs haven't been good enough to piss anyone off yet. I thought that winning the Pac-12 south in 2016 would create some more animosity towards CU among the other Pac-12 fanbases, but it seems like they mostly thought it was a cool story more than anything. USC football is probably the only program in the conference with the amount of history and following that Arizona basketball has. Beating them once would be a nice start.

However, I think the rivalries with Nebraska and, yes, Colorado State need to be preserved. The hate is natural there and, as we saw this week, doesn't fade with time. In one rivalry, CU is the big brother, and in the other one they're...not. I think it's healthy to have one of each. While you can't have 2 of your 3 non-conference games be against the same two teams every year, I think that these local, historical rivalries need to be kept up at least until the team has spent a solid generation in the Pac-12 and has some real new rivalries there.
 
Cal and Stanford hate each other (nerd fight!)
USC and UCLA hate each other
UA and ASU hate each other
I’m not sure anyone cares that much about WSU and OSU, but UO and UW hate each other

I get why the PAC thought we would become regional rivals with Utah, but it just isn’t there. At least not yet.
 
The rivalry with the corn is all because of the original Mac. Sure, corn fans are the most annoying of the old Big 8, but the corn would be just like Oklahoma to us if Mac hadn't decided to call them a rival.

After that **** Bachynski pulled with Jelly, I was positive we would have a white hot basketball rivalry with ASU. It didn't happen, probably because Tad isn't the kind of guy to gin up a rivalry. Neither is new Mac.
 
StormTrooper said:
USC football is probably the only program in the conference with the amount of history and following that Arizona basketball has. Beating them once would be a nice start.
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UCLA basketball is the greatest college basketball program of all-time, I think it's fair to say. They have 11 NCAA titles, UA has 1. Where its headed from here is an open debate, and I think it's tougher to play in McKale, but they deserve to be on that list

I grew up on the west coast and have friends who went to UO, Cal, USC, UCLA, UW and my wife went to grad school at Stanford, so for me, it has been a major win. Still, I know only two families that I would say are "die-hards" for the Pac-12, meaning they are closly following the team's every move and have the grandparents, parents, and kids as alumni all of the same school- one for Cal, the other for UCLA. Other Pac-12 alumni generally follow their own team and have an idea whats going on, but not too much more. Many, many families on the West Coast have alumni of 3 or 4 Pac-12 schools in the same family. It's just not the same animosity.

I think a big part of it is the more transitory nature of the West Coast population. Overwhelming numbers of people moved to the West Coast themselves, or their parents did. My great-grandfather played at Cal in the '20s, my wife's grandfather and brother played at Stanford in the '50s. Mention that to someone in Northern California, or any type of history, and they'll look at you like you're speaking pig-latin. That type of connection is uncommon. Compare that to Alabama or Georgia, where a family may have lived in the same area of 10 generations. They'll feel a very deep connection. How many people in Arizona's grandparents were from Arizona? Vanishingly few.
 
Highlander said:
Cal and Stanford hate each other (nerd fight!)
USC and UCLA hate each other
UA and ASU hate each other
I’m not sure anyone cares that much about WSU and OSU, but UO and UW hate each other

I get why the PAC thought we would become regional rivals with Utah, but it just isn’t there. At least not yet.
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I don't know if we'll ever get there with UU. They already have the white hot rivalry with BYU, and it would take a lot of time to build something there that wasn't artificial.

The best way to build a rivalry is to always have something bigger to be playing for than just the scoreboard. The only reason CU/NU even got set up as the post-Thanksgiving game in the Big 12 was because the Nubs and us had been deciding the Big 8 title between ourselves for the 8 years prior.

With the Utes, the best thing we'd need to build a rivalry on would be playing with division title claims on the line regularly. With SC standing there in the Pac-12 South, that would require a big increase in our competitiveness year in and year out, and, you know, beating SC. Utah has been much more stable in terms of being successful both in the South and vs SC, but they would probably have to step it up, too.
 
BuffsNYC said:
The rivalry with the corn is all because of the original Mac. Sure, corn fans are the most annoying of the old Big 8, but the corn would be just like Oklahoma to us if Mac hadn't decided to call them a rival.

After that **** Bachynski pulled with Jelly, I was positive we would have a white hot basketball rivalry with ASU. It didn't happen, probably because Tad isn't the kind of guy to gin up a rivalry. Neither is new Mac.
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This. You either need to have a coach that builds one up (re: Mac1) or you need to be damn good for a sustainable amount of time as others have said so others hate you. Right now we don't have either.
 
Liver said:
no to the big 10. too many assholes.

as for the hatred, it has a lot to do with time and experience and it is, as you suggest, partly due to the fact that we were outliers in our previous conference.

i can give you a good reason i hate every single b12 team (at different levels of intensity, of course). it built up over decades of us playing them. the fact that most of them have far ****tier academics, looser admission standards, and are completely culturally different than boulder did not help. even schools that i respected academically (texas, for example) were easy to hate.

with respect to the p12, i respect most of the member institutions. there are no wildly outlaw programs. sure, there are assholes, but even the trolls tend to be more interesting. really, the p12 breaks down like this for me (hate scale, most to least):

1. usc. they are good at football and they are arrogant. i took this one out of the Original Coach Mac's playbook. pick the program you need to beat to dominate the conference.
2. uw. i don't forget the **** they talked when skippy left to go there and then how they begged us to forgive their stupidity when skippy wrecked their program too. and, they think they have a far better historical record than they actually do.
3. oregon. nouveau riche and displays all the symptoms thereof.
4. america's stripper u. they are just douches with really ****ty academics and no history.
5. ucla. this is program that should be better but always manages to **** up. yet, they think they are better than they are. i enjoy ****ing with their dumb fans.
6. arizona. more douches. it must be something about the weather in the desert. no history, but they still think they are relevant.
7. stanford. mostly, just because they play it both ways. when they are good, they say "oh look at us, we are good despite our academic selectivity." and when they suck they say "oh, it is just football, but we are academically selective."
8. washington state. purely because i have a love-hate relationship with the pirate. this program could go full outlaw like kjuco state, but they somehow manage to stay just on the right side of the line.
9. utah. the forced rivalry thing annoys me and i hate that they have been at least as good as us overall in the conference.
10. cal. i forgive them a lot because they are very similar to us and their trolls are funny. although when they kicked our asses up and down the field right after we announced we were joining the pac, on that day, i had a great deal of rage.
11. oregon state. meh.
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Number 11 is exactly why we miss the Big 8. When you suck nobody hates you. When you lose big nobody hates you. There’s no fire and most teams had assumed a win vs CU.

Let’s see a few 9-11 wins seasons go by and see how we all feel about each other. I bet things will heat up when fans worry about a loss when they play CU.
 
Highlander said:
Cal and Stanford hate each other (nerd fight!)
USC and UCLA hate each other
UA and ASU hate each other
I’m not sure anyone cares that much about WSU and OSU, but UO and UW hate each other

I get why the PAC thought we would become regional rivals with Utah, but it just isn’t there. At least not yet.
Click to expand...
The problem with a rivalry with Utah is that I think most of us respect Utah too much. They came in from a lower level and have done a better job of being competitive than Colorado has. Maybe that will change with time but honestly I feel that if Colorado can’t win the division I would rather Utah win it than anyone else.
 
FlatironsBuff said:
The problem with a rivalry with Utah is that I think most of us respect Utah too much. They came in from a lower level and have done a better job of being competitive than Colorado has. Maybe that will change with time but honestly I feel that if Colorado can’t win the division I would rather Utah win it than anyone else.
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A rivalry doesn't have to be white hot hatred. It can be respectful.

We have one rivalry that is annoying, CSU. We have one that is full on hatred, Fuskers. Why can't we have one built on respect and good competition?

Think of it as our version of the Stanford vs ND rivalry.
 
Shldr2Shldr said:
I think one thing that may help with building a rivalry with Utah is the fact their fan base seems give a ****. They mirror us in a lot of ways.
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Other than the nut job who used to jump in the politics forum, has any Utah fan ever visited this board to talk trash before a game?
 
Alfred91 said:
First off, I loved being in the Big 8. Yeah, every roadie was crap, but there was history and a feeling of familiarity that bred contempt but also fraternity. The Nubs thought they were better than everyone else because of football. OU thought they better than everyone else because of football. KU thought they were better than everyone else because of basketball. CU thought we were better than everyone else because, well, we were. But the entire Big 8 knew we were better than a bunch of the other conferences back then, especially those ****ups in the SWC.

The Big 12, though, sucked donkey dick. The Texas schools ripped apart the atmosphere and the traditions of the Big 8. Literally, in the case of the traditions. All of the history of the Big 8 was shelved so those snowflakes wouldn't feel like newcomers. Plus those turncoats OU and Okie Lite sold the rest of the Big 8 down the river when they decided to align themselves with the Texas schools. Plus, while they did bring in Austin, they also brought in Lubbock, College Station, and Waco. ****ing Waco. Good riddance to that ****-stained conference. No rivalry is worth that crap.

The Pac-12 has been disappointing in terms of fan intensity, which is why that feeling that came rushing back with the Nubs has been so elusive for us. Almost every Pac-12 fanbase, if what happened with the Nubs had happened to them would be like, "okay, well, that happened" and moved on by now, which is exactly what the vast majority of our fanbase would do, by the way. So that rivalry is hard to find, especially given our geographic location, and it might take years to show up, if ever.

But remember, we didn't leave the Big 8, we left the Big 12, and you could make the argument that the Big 12 left us well before then.
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This. Truth.
 
The perfect storm came and went in 94, fresh off of a Heisman winner and a beat down of ND, Ricky taking over with the cupboard full of Mac's recruits, 2 wins over Udub previous, the best mascot, young up and coming coach with ties to the PAC & national exposure.
Probably rehashing but that's where we lost it, 95 & 96 CU would've been in a position to win the PAC in both and a new recruiting footprint based on success. CU could've played NYs day in the Rose Bowl, what a sight it would've been to see the big girl run in front of 103K with Keith Jackson calling the game.
I lament..24 yrs later how much different 2018 would be? CU has no identity in the P12 as it is today just a flash in the pan, coulda/shoulda but had the 94 scenario played out USC would be our rival today and instead of hating on red and white we'd hate on SC's colors < I don't know what they are because I lost interest in knowing after we left the B12.
The P12 will/can try and fail to create a natural rival for CU, rivalries are created on the field not in the media.
Personally I'd really enjoy one more game against the old guy in Manhattan because his teams became a pain in the bum. Shame we haven't been able to/or even tried to schedule OU again in a home and home....40K over 45s would attend...LOL I'd love to see that stupid wagon of theirs tip over again, I digress.
 
Always BUFF said:
The perfect storm came and went in 94, fresh off of a Heisman winner and a beat down of ND, Ricky taking over with the cupboard full of Mac's recruits, 2 wins over Udub previous, the best mascot, young up and coming coach with ties to the PAC & national exposure.
Probably rehashing but that's where we lost it, 95 & 96 CU would've been in a position to win the PAC in both and a new recruiting footprint based on success. CU could've played NYs day in the Rose Bowl, what a sight it would've been to see the big girl run in front of 103K with Keith Jackson calling the game.
I lament..24 yrs later how much different 2018 would be? CU has no identity in the P12 as it is today just a flash in the pan, coulda/shoulda but had the 94 scenario played out USC would be our rival today and instead of hating on red and white we'd hate on SC's colors < I don't know what they are because I lost interest in knowing after we left the B12.
The P12 will/can try and fail to create a natural rival for CU, rivalries are created on the field not in the media.
Personally I'd really enjoy one more game against the old guy in Manhattan because his teams became a pain in the bum. Shame we haven't been able to/or even tried to schedule OU again in a home and home....40K over 45s would attend...LOL I'd love to see that stupid wagon of theirs tip over again, I digress.
Click to expand...

Ever notice that KState has become much less a school of note since the NCAA standardized things in terms of jucos? Now that Snyder can't stack his teams full of guys of questionable literacy, they're middle of the pack.

Which, to Snyder's credit, is a lot better than they were when he got there.
 
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