Shedeur Sanders - 2023-25 Tracking History Thread - Drafted by the Cleveland Browns (NFL)

[#1 pick]

the O line protection when SS was playing reminded me of his 1st year at CU. He's great when he has a little time, but shifts into the wrong gear mentally, when there's heavy pressure.

When there was a weaker WR core and no Travis Hunter, he relied too much on BTTs. If teams take that away, they are getting pressure with 4 a 4 man rush in cover 3 and you can't run the ball effectively. This is where you have to kill plays, tip your hat to the defense and say damn, ya'll got me. Sometimes, you cant overcome the elements.

As far as what is fixable. The internal clock in your head has to kill a play dead. I know some will get mad and say, take a chance and force it. Huntley did it twice and the first time was a pick which was reversed to defensive holding and the 2nd got his WR put in the tent but got a favor of unnecessary roughness on the hit of the WR and gained 25 yards on the two plays. Plays 12 might not have gotten off based on his previous level of play.

Game management has always been an issue for Shedeur. We lost the Stanford game for it more than even Travis coverage on Ayomayor in my opinion and he just couldn't move the rock when Stanford forced him to dink and dunk. Obviously, that was more difficult to do when we had 4 NFL WRs last year but the year before, we had college jags like T. Dawson playing serious reps. I even think Kaleb was playing as well.

Game managing is about just moving the chains. Pocket passing has the big play element but a game manager is just about moving the chains and making the right play majority of the time. It's routine and mundane. Shedeur will have to improve on this. While he's a feel thrower like Payton, he needs to develop his anticipatory throws as well. Especially on short plays. This ain't CU, you can screen play teams to death with Wester, Horn, and Hunter. You gotta anticipate where the WR will be. This is an area he's flashed a little against Carolina. I know he doesn't like this as it's not natural to him. He mentioned to DNVR, he doesn't like choice routes which depend on anticipatory throws, KS offense requires it. You gotta get solid it at. I don't expect you to be as good as Kenny Pickett at it and I dann sure don't expect you to be elite like Gabriel at it. That's his super power. I am not expecting it to be yours, just be competent and functional. Cam Newton worked to become functional at it. You can get better at it, QBs are always developing.

 

[cu3x]

When there was a weaker WR core and no Travis Hunter, he relied too much on BTTs. If teams take that away, they are getting pressure with 4 a 4 man rush in cover 3 and you can't run the ball effectively. This is where you have to kill plays, tip your hat to the defense and say damn, ya'll got me. Sometimes, you cant overcome the elements.

As far as what is fixable. The internal clock in your head has to kill a play dead. I know some will get mad and say, take a chance and force it. Huntley did it twice and the first time was a pick which was reversed to defensive holding and the 2nd got his WR put in the tent but got a favor of unnecessary roughness on the hit of the WR and gained 25 yards on the two plays. Plays 12 might not have gotten off based on his previous level of play.

Game management has always been an issue for Shedeur. We lost the Stanford game for it more than even Travis coverage on Ayomayor in my opinion and he just couldn't move the rock when Stanford forced him to dink and dunk. Obviously, that was more difficult to do when we had 4 NFL WRs last year but the year before, we had college jags like T. Dawson playing serious reps. I even think Kaleb was playing as well.

Game managing is about just moving the chains. Pocket passing has the big play element but a game manager is just about moving the chains and making the right play majority of the time. It's routine and mundane. Shedeur will have to improve on this. While he's a feel thrower like Payton, he needs to develop his anticipatory throws as well. Especially on short plays. This ain't CU, you can screen play teams to death with Wester, Horn, and Hunter. You gotta anticipate where the WR will be. This is an area he's flashed a little against Carolina. I know he doesn't like this as it's not natural to him. He mentioned to DNVR, he doesn't like choice routes which depend on anticipatory throws, KS offense requires it. You gotta get solid it at. I don't expect you to be as good as Kenny Pickett at it and I dann sure don't expect you to be elite like Gabriel at it. That's his super power. I am not expecting it to be yours, just be competent and functional. Cam Newton worked to become functional at it. You can get better at it, QBs are always developing.

another good analysis.

 

[H.E. Pennypacker]

Shedeur played bad and did nothing to silence his critics

At the same time he was put in a terrible situation

They knew when they signed Huntley, they would cut him as well. Putting him in the last 2 minutes was a decision based on fear. God forbid Shedeur leads a game winning scoring drive with the practice squad. Shedeur was a reflection of who he was playing with.

The NFL is terrified of him.

 

[#1 pick]

They knew when they signed Huntley, they would cut him as well. Putting him in the last 2 minutes was a decision based on fear. God forbid Shedeur leads a game winning scoring drive with the practice squad. Shedeur was a reflection of who he was playing with.

The NFL is terrified of him.

He's not getting cut. This was to shut up the media. Get them to chill with the calls for Shedeur. They know his weaknesses. They know his competitive drive. This was a setup. Of course, you can't take the bait. Thats the purpose of a setup. That you are stupid enough to take the bait.

 

[H.E. Pennypacker]

He's not getting cut. This was to shut up the media. Get them to chill with the calls for Shedeur

That's basically what I said, except I didn’t say Shedeur was getting cut. I said when they signed Huntley they knew they were going to cut him (Huntley) the same day they signed him.

 

[#1 pick]

That's basically what I said, except I didn’t say Shedeur was getting cut. I said when they signed Huntley they knew they were going to cut him (Huntley) the same day they signed him.

I know, didn't mean to sound like a repeated record. My bad

 

[DBT]

What happened with Shedeur when they took him out? He started to walk to the locker room, turned around, and went back to the sideline. Looked like maybe he was frustrated at being taken out, started to leave, then realized it was a bad look and went back.

 

[Robert Sorell]

I'm interested to see how RK and the rest of the DNVR pod spin this one.

I'm also really interested to see how Prime, Leftwich, and Shurmur coach up Kaidon and Julian.

I can't see anyone other than Prime's son getting away with the same repeated mistakes, like Shedeur did. I feel like if it was Julian who kept checking out of run plays in really dumb situations, and kept drifting back to take 15+ yard sacks last year, it would have been addressed; but I don't know that.

 

[H.E. Pennypacker]

What happened with Shedeur when they took him out? He started to walk to the locker room, turned around, and went back to the sideline. Looked like maybe he was frustrated at being taken out, started to leave, then realized it was a bad look and went back.

It looked to me he just took a walk to collect his thoughts. I don’t think leaving for the locker room was on his mind.

 

[hawg1]

I like the Browns personnel (starting) for Shedeur but he got an uphill battle as his lack of game management and versatility isn't something I think KS likes. But Shedeur is a pure playmaking, excellent scrambler, and tremendous pocket passer so his upside is high. That said, being a poor game manager is an issue. Anticipation throws is an issue and likely always will be since he's like Peyton, he's a feel thrower but Peyton is a damn computer, knows what every defense is doing to an extremely high degree. Shedeur is very intelligent and has the pre snap vision but he would need to elevate his post snap reads to get to that level.

Shedeur has a clear path to superstardom but he also has a clear path to bustland.

I don't expect him to be versatile. I don't expect game manager to ever even get to an average level for him since he hates that ****.

I know he will never be a balanced, mobile or running QB because of his lack of acceleration and mediocre agility even if he's tremendous at COD and straight line speed.

Hes going to have to become elite by going from an elite PP prospect to an elite PP player. That's a lot of mental development. He needs to master KS scheme. He needs KS to coach Shedeur to win, not just bull**** with plays and personnel like he did today.

The Browns got the personnel. The defense is legit. They have the starting TEs. The have variety of WRs even if they aren't that good. The running game is wack right now but it has potential.

Shedeur has to lock in. Being a scout team QB is great. This is where Brady shined. He learned the mental side of the NFL. For Shedeur, it will be critical.

Shedeur can be elite. 4 elite traits. His negative traits only really show in terrible situations. It flash in blowouts but it rarely does when his situation is decent at best. I said it during the process I wanted him in the WCO. It's best him long term. What we saw was he paid a price for the feet today. We didn't see it two weeks ago. I think the feet will at times have issues but we need to continue to see playmaker Shedeur. Just limit hero ball Shedeur.

Who is going to provide the guidance he needs with reps? Even if he makes the cut at Cleveland, I just don’t see it happening there. Nobody there us going to take him under their wing and develop him.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Who is going to provide the guidance he needs with reps? Even if he makes the cut at Cleveland, I just don’t see it happening there. Nobody there us going to take him under their wing and develop him.

At this point, it may actually have been better for him to be drafted by the Eagles, like was rumored to be happening before Cleveland traded up. Going to a team where there’s no path to QB1, but where he can develop and potentially get an opportunity if there’s an injury.

On the other hand, if KS and AB are out in Cleveland after this year, I could see Haslem being intentional about hiring a coach who believes in Shedeur and is willing to work with him and develop. Haslem should understand that Shedeur is a monster business opportunity for the Browns if he can get the right coach

 

[cnbuff410]

the O line protection when SS was playing reminded me of his 1st year at CU. He's great when he has a little time, but shifts into the wrong gear mentally, when there's heavy pressure.

This is partly his fault. Constantly drifting back will make any OL look bad

 

[cu3x]

This is partly his fault. Constantly drifting back will make any OL look bad

I can understand that, but I thought on a number of plays there was almost no effective blocking. Is there a way to compare how long before a D player got into the backfield when SS was in, as opposed to when Flacco and dg were?

 

[Da Lama]

This is partly his fault. Constantly drifting back will make any OL look bad

Learn the sport. The OL looks bad in the first 2.5 seconds, not in the final 5 seconds. They've already blown it.

Christ, sometimes this place gives me migraines. I swear...

 

[BuffUp]

raiders are in need of a QB now

 

[Medford M.]

Since he doesn’t have his own thread, and I’m too lazy to check if posted on last page, Shilo was waved by the Bucs.

Was going to be hard for him to make the roster, but the ejection didn’t help.

 

[Creebuzz]

Yesterday’s outcome bummed me out. I want to see Shedeur succeed. But it is so hard when you are late draft pick because you get few or even no opportunities*. It’s funny because people cite someone like Brock Purdy as an example of the cream rising to the top, but I have no doubt that he would be buried on some depth chart or even out of the league altogether if it not for an historic wave of injuries for the 49ers.

Personally, I think Cleveland is already a dead end for Shedeur. He is #4 on the depth chart, and odds are favorable that the Browns will draft a QB in round 1 next year. So, even with Flacco (and Watson) moving on, he’d be QB4 again next fall camp.

*the list of modern era QBs drafted in rounds 3-7 that have gone on to be starters for 4 or more years is, like, five players (one of which is Tom Brady). Purdy will probably be number six. That’s a long term success rate around 7%.

 

[cnbuff410]

Learn the sport. The OL looks bad in the first 2.5 seconds, not in the final 5 seconds. They've already blown it.

Christ, sometimes this place gives me migraines. I swear...

Sign. Maybe you should check out the average release time DG has yesterday.

SS12 never takes check down, and doesn't have great anticipation. He also doesn't step up in the pocket most of the time. These are the same issues he had in Colorado.

DG is a very good QB with bad physical measures. A lot of his QB traits are better than SS12, believe it or not. His quick release and the willing to take yards when the big play is not available is better than SS12 because that's literally what he has been doing for 5 years in college.

Sometimes it's hard to have reasonable discussions here, every time SS12 makes mistakes it's his OL's fault. Sure.

 

[cnbuff410]

Learn the sport. The OL looks bad in the first 2.5 seconds, not in the final 5 seconds. They've already blown it.

Christ, sometimes this place gives me migraines. I swear...

Contextual stats.

Average time to throw:

Shedeur - 5.13 seconds

Gabriel - 2.62 seconds


Number of pressured dropbacks over total dropbacks

Shedeur - 9/11

Gabriel - 4/19

Percentage of pressures that were under 2.5 seconds

Shedeur - 44% (4)

Gabriel - 75% (3)

Percentage of pressures that were over 3 seconds

Shedeur - 56% (5)

Gabriel - 25% (1)

 

[hawg1]

Contextual stats.

Average time to throw:

Shedeur - 5.13 seconds

Gabriel - 2.62 seconds


Number of pressured dropbacks over total dropbacks

Shedeur - 9/11

Gabriel - 4/19

Percentage of pressures that were under 2.5 seconds

Shedeur - 44% (4)

Gabriel - 75% (3)

Percentage of pressures that were over 3 seconds

Shedeur - 56% (5)

Gabriel - 25% (1)

Thanks for data. Do you have completion percentages under the two different pressure scenarios?

 

[cnbuff410]

This is his 23 yards sack. A good QB would have stayed in the pocket and pass to the RB. Look at how much SS12 already drifted back.

Sometimes you should try to not be blind to the player you like.

 

[cnbuff410]

This is his 23 yards sack. A good QB would have stayed in the pocket and pass to the RB. Look at how much SS12 already drifted back.

Sometimes you should try to not be blind to the player you like.

I don't, I got that data from here

https://NOPE/BrettKollmann/status/1959684341455524147?s=19

 

[BigAppleBuff]

Sign. Maybe you should check out the average release time DG has yesterday.

SS12 never takes check down, and doesn't have great anticipation. He also doesn't step up in the pocket most of the time. These are the same issues he had in Colorado.

DG is a very good QB with bad physical measures. A lot of his QB traits are better than SS12, believe it or not. His quick release and the willing to take yards when the big play is not available is better than SS12 because that's literally what he has been doing for 5 years in college.

Sometimes it's hard to have reasonable discussions here, every time SS12 makes mistakes it's his OL's fault. Sure.

He has the same issues as Caleb Williams, and Williams is way more talented. Williams is still trying to unlearn his bad habits with the new HC/OC.

 

[MtnBuff]

Yesterday’s outcome bummed me out. I want to see Shedeur succeed. But it is so hard when you are late draft pick because you get few or even no opportunities*. It’s funny because people cite someone like Brock Purdy as an example of the cream rising to the top, but I have no doubt that he would be buried on some depth chart or even out of the league altogether if it not for an historic wave of injuries for the 49ers.

Personally, I think Cleveland is already a dead end for Shedeur. He is #4 on the depth chart, and odds are favorable that the Browns will draft a QB in round 1 next year. So, even with Flacco (and Watson) moving on, he’d be QB4 again next fall camp.

*the list of modern era QBs drafted in rounds 3-7 that have gone on to be starters for 4 or more years is, like, five players (one of which is Tom Brady). Purdy will probably be number six. That’s a long term success rate around 7%.

Purdy has turned into one of the leagues upper tier QBs, not elite but one step below elite. He fell into almost a perfect situation with a head coach and coaching staff that were very much tuned in to making their QBs successful. He came to a team with a quality offensive line. Having weapons like McCaffrey, Deebo, Kittle, Aiyuk, and more. When Trey Lance proved not to be what they expected and Jimmy G, as usual, got hurt Purdy was in an ideal situation.

Some teams have shown that they are a great place for QBs. Look at Green Bay. They bring in Farve who has a long successful run, they draft Rodgers who has to wait then has a long successful run. As Rodgers reaches the end they draft Jordan Love who many questioned. He hasn't reached the level of the other two yet but nobody questions that he belongs.

Contrast let's look at the Browns. Since 2004 they have drafted Luke McCown (4th) who became a solid backup elsewhere, 2005 Charlie Frye (3rd) low end backup, 2007 Brady Quinn (1st) bust, 2010 Colt McCoy career backup, part time starter elsewhere, 2012 Brandon Weeden (1st) bust, 2014 Johnny Manzeil (1st) bust, 2016 Cody Kessler (3rd) limited backup, 2017 DeShone Kizer (2nd) bust, 2018 Baker Mayfield (1st - 1st pick in draft) A couple of successful years in Cleveland before turned sour, now starting for a playoff level Tampa Bay team.

If you go back the prior 20 years with their drafts and it looks similar, pick after pick failed. You cannot convince me that every single one of these picks was a bad pick, a bad player. How many of these guys had they gone to a quality franchise would have had a solid career, even comparable to Brock Purdy. And had Purdy had the bad fortune to be picked by Cleveland would we even remember him?

In light of all this is what happens in Cleveland representative of what Shedeur is as a QB? Had he been drafted in the 5th round by the 49ers how different would it have been? A situation with quality coaching and clear reasonable expectations. In San Francisco he wouldn't have been looked at as a savior. Instead Purdy is clearly the starter and they would have said Shedeur is there to develop as a backup and potential future starter someplace.

 

[Da Lama]

Sign. Maybe you should check out the average release time DG has yesterday.

SS12 never takes check down, and doesn't have great anticipation. He also doesn't step up in the pocket most of the time. These are the same issues he had in Colorado.

DG is a very good QB with bad physical measures. A lot of his QB traits are better than SS12, believe it or not. His quick release and the willing to take yards when the big play is not available is better than SS12 because that's literally what he has been doing for 5 years in college.

Sometimes it's hard to have reasonable discussions here, every time SS12 makes mistakes it's his OL's fault. Sure.

My argument isn’t with what SS2 does when protection breaks down. That’s on him. You saying he makes the OLine look bad when he does that sh!t confirms you have no clue about how this all works. They are the cause of the situation. They are the ones making themselves look bad. Not their QB.

Off to get the Excedrin.

 

[#1 pick]

Yesterday’s outcome bummed me out. I want to see Shedeur succeed. But it is so hard when you are late draft pick because you get few or even no opportunities*. It’s funny because people cite someone like Brock Purdy as an example of the cream rising to the top, but I have no doubt that he would be buried on some depth chart or even out of the league altogether if it not for an historic wave of injuries for the 49ers.

Personally, I think Cleveland is already a dead end for Shedeur. He is #4 on the depth chart, and odds are favorable that the Browns will draft a QB in round 1 next year. So, even with Flacco (and Watson) moving on, he’d be QB4 again next fall camp.

*the list of modern era QBs drafted in rounds 3-7 that have gone on to be starters for 4 or more years is, like, five players (one of which is Tom Brady). Purdy will probably be number six. That’s a long term success rate around 7%.

It's hard to say. I believe it's a dead end. I believe yesterday was a sabotage and honestly, I understand why. That said, this is the situation he's in. They have truly made it impossible to be a Shedeur fan who supports the Browns and that's ashame.

 

[cu3x]

Cleveland waived 17, not SS.
4 other contracts terminated

Browns waive 17 players, terminate contracts of 4 players

 

[MtnBuff]

My argument isn’t with what SS2 does when protection breaks down. That’s on him. You saying he makes the OLine look bad when he does that sh!t confirms you have no clue about how this all works. They are the cause of the situation. They are the ones making themselves look bad. Not their QB.

Off to get the Excedrin.

Shedeur can and needs to learn to handle pressure better, pressure happens in the NFL.

That said blaming negative plays on him because the time to the end of the play is longer is not an accurate measure. Yesterday (similar to his first year at CU) Shedeur frequenly had initial pressure in 2.0 to 2.5 seconds. The only QBs in history I can think of that had much success getting the ball off faster that that were a couple of scrubs named Brady and Manning.

Shedeurs plays tend to extend longer because he does try to keep the play alive by scrambling, drifting, and often by retreating. A guy like Gabriel will just kill the play by throwing the ball away or running forward. The play for Gabriel has almost no chance of being positive but will likely end less negative. Shedeur extending the play provides a greater chance for a big positive but also for a more negative result.

Overall Gabriel had better results yesterday for one reason, he played with a group that gave him much more time with less immediate pressure. Had they been interchanged I'd expect the results to interchange as well except Gabriels drives would have ended with a bunch of incomplete passes or tackles near the LOS. Shedeur would have been able to have more success than he did with time and open receivers.

 

[Da Lama]

Cleveland waived 17, not SS.
4 other contracts terminated

Browns waive 17 players, terminate contracts of 4 players

Imagine that, every single Lineman that they threw out there in front of Sanders yesterday.

 

[Fight CU]

Imagine that, every single Lineman that they threw out there in front of Sanders yesterday.

Damn. Brutal