I was giving JT the benefit of the doubt...
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Who would you hire and why?
- Thread starter BuffClass90
- Start date
I posted this before on a similar thread: "to get the kind of coach we'd really want, we'd need to talk more like $1.75mm -- $2.5mm per year for the HC and another $2mm -- $2.5mm for the staff. Nearly every coach in that pay grade is a definite upgrade."
To break the bank, I see the entire staff as needing $3.75 -- $5mm per year to work here (probably more like $4.5mm -- $5mm+). I see our next HC making more like $1.25 -- $1.5mm per year and the staff getting another $1.5mm.
And yes, I get that we CAN spend the money to go after a big fish. My contention is that we WON'T spend the dough.
BTW, I base those comments based upon the compilations of USA Today:
Salaries for 2011 --
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colle...ise/51242232/1
Salary changes for some newly hired coaches for 2012 --
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colle...ion/52602734/1
Salaries for 2011 --
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colle...ise/51242232/1
Salary changes for some newly hired coaches for 2012 --
http://www.usatoday.com/sports/colle...ion/52602734/1
Walter White
Member
I would counter that it's hard to accuse him of being a dirty scoundrel because he ignored a few 19-year olds trading a practice jersey for a tatoo, or whatever it was.
Not to excuse JT (I don't even like tOSU) but there are degrees. Driving 60 in a 55 is not the same as assault and battery.
Yeah...I'm not buying the whole $1.25-$1.5M thing. Why exactly won't we spend more money? Because of Jon's current salary? Different situations in 2012 than there were in 2010. Our assistants, at the time of hiring, were or near the top in salary in the conference, and that was before PAC 12 money was set in stone if I recall correctly. I see $2M-$2.25M for the next coach.
I would counter that blatantly lying about what he knew after the **** hits the fan makes him look like a scumbag. If you want to excuse JT, have at it. Just accept that is exactly what you are doing.
Traditionally, we don't spend a ton on coaches. We've always been toward the middle of the conferences where we've played on HC salary, except when Mac was a top 5 coach in the US.
The assistants were being paid based upon the anticipation of PAC 12 money. That's why I say we should assess the totality of what the staff makes instead of just the HC. When we do that, we're only average in the PAC 12 as it is presently constituted.
Based upon what evidence do you see us paying $2-$2.5mm for the HC? I think the history of what we've paid coaches compared to the market, our outdated facilities, and slow movements on coaches all indicate that we'll be spending less than the market. We just gotta hope that the person we hire over performs.
BuffNut99
Club Member
The salary for the next head coach really doesn't have a ceiling. Even in the last go around, money was not an issue. Now with the Pac12 monies, it is even less an issue. We can afford literally anyone, and (gulp) are actually willing to spend what it takes for coaches. Money is a much bigger issue when we're talking about buyouts... much less money, but from a different pot, from a state that is giving CU less and less every year, during a recession, with Benson doing the thinking.
You just contradicted your whole point with this part. If we spend traditionally middle of the pack money, your pay frame would be way, way at the bottom of the PAC 12 and would be below CSU. My frame falls right into the middle of the PAC 12 pay scale, which, discounting USC and Stanford, is $2.1M, which would put my frame right in the middle.
Sure didn't. I said the whole staff will make about $2.75 -- $3mm, which is just about average in the PAC 12. That would mean we pay the HC $1.5mm and the staff $1.5mm at the top end.
If we pay the next HC $2 -- $2.5mm, that would put us closer to $4 -- $5mm in total staff comp, which would be "breaking the bank," IMHO.
Walter White
Member
Would you consider yourself to be a scumbag for the times you have been dishonest? I'm doubtful you've been totally honest in everythign for your whole life.
I kind of reserve "scumbag" for actual scumbags. In my book, JT is 100% wrong for lying, but I'm not sure that warrants the "scumbag". That's just my opinion. I think you could safely call him a liar.
I'm talking about a only head coaching salaries so yes you did and I only calculated the average head coaches salary
I haven't been saying much on this part of the thread... but, I kinda think it depends on the context of the lie. If you lie and it ends up getting the US embroiled in a ten year conflict in Iraq, that's pretty brutal. If you lie and end up getting your team banned from the post season for two seasons, that is on the bad part of the continuum. If you lie and tell your girl her fat ass doesn't look fat in too tight pants, that's probably an acceptable lie.
I WISH that we would pay more like $4mm to $5mm for our coaches. That's what programs who are consistently in the top 25 pay their people. We just haven't made that commitment based upon our history, ****** facilities, and demands of the greater university for the PAC 12 dough.
If I ever embarrass my family and others with a long, drawn-out lie that also adversely affect countless people, I would certainly consider it a scumbag move.
If people want to hire JT or Petrino, I just want them to acknowledge the full depth of their transgressions that has led to their current situations. Many posters on Allbuffs were shocked that Arky fired Petrino, which just amazes me. I am not being holier than thou here, I am trying to explain the issues are more complicated than tattoos and affairs.
Geez you are just not getting it. I did not calculate the average salary for the whole coaching staff, just the head coaches and my frame, for head coaches alone, would fall right in the middle. You argued that we typically pay middle of the pack, which supported my argument. If you calculate the average salary for the whole staff, and it matches up with your numbers I'd admit I'm wrong. We see with this staff that we pay the assistants well, which can be attributed to both Jon taking a cut and Bohn paying them more.
Walter White
Member
You are right. I get what you are saying. It's like if you lie about your mismanaged response to an attack on a U.S. Consulate that got people killed as a direct result of your mismanagement. Yes, you lie about that so you can get re-elected.
Got it.
I not only acknowledge it, I want to help him avoid getting caught the next time. Hence, the non-University owned phone.:lol: Perhaps a booster could buy a condo near campus for Petrino to use when he needs to get down and dirty. And no more motorcycles. That would need to be in the contract.
Walter White
Member
I hear you, but Chip Kelley came from New Hampshire. Is that right? I think so.
either way, i'd like to see CU move to a non-pro/nfl style and employ a running qb attack
Walter White
Member
sorry
All good. I realize everyone is a bit on edge this week and your response was somewhat natural. We just want to make sure it does not become an issue.:thumbsup:
THIS (all caps)
I honestly don't give a damn about his discretions. His life is his own. He got caught dipping his pen in the company well, and got fired for it. I don't think he was ever caught breaking any NCAA rules. He's a good coach with an eye for young, blond volleyball players. Hell, who doesn't?
Get him a driver. Get him a condo near campus. Hell, get him his own private hideaway in the Dal Ward. Get him whatever the hell he needs but for the love of God, get it done. I'm so tired of ****** football I can't take it any longer.
Touché
I am fairly certain Petrino will be shagging VB tail in the SEC again come December (Kentucky or Auburn).
Walter White
Member
You get right to the heart of my argument. What Petrino was doing was major scumbag material. JT was lying about freaking tatoos. That's all the difference in the world to me. It's not even close in my book.
What if he lied about his mistress' tattoo?
Walter White
Member
This is my opinion, but his personal integrity is deal killer. A dude who goes out of his way to cheat on his wife is a guy I don't want to be around. I could understand a one time lapse (sort of), but if you're not loyal to your own family, you are garbage. I put that over winning, but again, that's my view.
JT's transgressions are lesser in my book, but I probably wouldn't want him either. Plus, I don't like his "field position" style of football, even if it is effective.