2022 Myrtle Beach Invitational Tourney thread- (RV) MEN'S basketball (Conway, SC; 3rd CU game vs. Boise State, Sunday, 11/20,5:00 PM MT, ESPNNEWS)

[4BienemyTDs]

You definitely know better than Tad what Lawson brings to the table. Especially with the O'Brien at the 5 suggestion. Brilliant analysis.

Edit: Sorry, this post was needlessly snarky. But it does get frustrating that people watch this bi-polar team, and think the problem is that Lawson Lovering isn't Shaq.

I do not know **** compare to Tad, but it feels like he is going out of his way to help LL become Shaq by the minutes played and the praise given.
He was in for a long stretch of time in the second half and he did not do anything productive, and the one thing he is doing that drives me nuts is that he is not even a shooting threat at all when he catches the ball above the free throw line. In fact he is not even faking that he would shoot, and then stops looking at the basket while guys try to run screens around him. That allows his rim protector defender to sag into the lane and clog up space. I like LL's passion and effort and he has made improvements, but seriously we need a bigger stronger man in there.

 

[GoBuffs!!]

yeah, someone posted recently that Boyle made public comments about not being happy w/ the non-conf schedule. I'd be interested if a reporter did an in-depth piece on what happened with it this year.

I know about nine years ago, someone on a VT board found a link to what was then a private message board for college hoops coaching and AD staffs. it was kind of like a dating service for college teams. e.g.:

• "University of Colorado looking to book a home-and-home with a Big 6 school"
• "CU looking for a home game against a mid-major. will cover travel travel expenses"
• etc...

That board went private not long after, but it was really insightful seeing how schedules are put together. it also made the entire sport seem a lot smaller, TBH.

I dont think it is much of a secret, or story there.

Grambling was part of a Pac12 commitment, Tennessee was the back end of a commitment made 3 years ago, then you have a tournament. Sucks that it ended up this way, but I think the only one that Tad is upset about is going to Grambling, the others are just how it goes.

 

[Buffnik]

I dont think it is much of a secret, or story there.

Grambling was part of a Pac12 commitment, Tennessee was the back end of a commitment made 3 years ago, then you have a tournament. Sucks that it ended up this way, but I think the only one that Tad is upset about is going to Grambling, the others are just how it goes.

Yep. Tad would have liked another UC Riverside home game before the Tenn + MBI road trip instead of going to Grambling. He loses vital practice days in our gym during the early season with a road trip that was a no win situation since it had no opportunity to improve our resume regardless of result.

 

[cu3x]

I do not know **** compare to Tad, but it feels like he is going out of his way to help LL become Shaq by the minutes played and the praise given.
He was in for a long stretch of time in the second half and he did not do anything productive, and the one thing he is doing that drives me nuts is that he is not even a shooting threat at all when he catches the ball above the free throw line. In fact he is not even faking that he would shoot, and then stops looking at the basket while guys try to run screens around him. That allows his rim protector defender to sag into the lane and clog up space. I like LL's passion and effort and he has made improvements, but seriously we need a bigger stronger man in there.

I thought last night was LL's worst on this road trip. He's been very good defensively in the other games and he did intimidate A+M guys every time they tried to go inside.
He needs to gain confidence offensively as far as shooting, but his passing is great. I think he has good awareness of where the ball needs to go. Last night, Hadley was out and TDS had a migraine - Tad's options were limited some . Tad sees a very good center, at an early stage of his career.

And there is this, which I've posted twice, with no responses. IMO, it's not a comment on his athletic ability or his height, it's got to be a comment on his mindset. What makes LL "different"?

From October:
"He's a unique player and somebody who's different from anyone in our program," Boyle said. " He's much improved, much more confident, big and strong.".

 

[4BienemyTDs]

I thought last night was LL's worst on this road trip. He's been very good defensively in the other games and he did intimidate A+M guys every time they tried to go inside.
He needs to gain confidence offensively as far as shooting, but his passing is great. I think he has good awareness of where the ball needs to go. Last night, Hadley was out and TDS had a migraine - Tad's options were limited some . Tad sees a very good center, at an early stage of his career.

And there is this, which I've posted twice, with no responses. IMO, it's not a comment on his athletic ability or his height, it's got to be a comment on his mindset. What makes LL "different"?

From October:
"He's a unique player and somebody who's different from anyone in our program," Boyle said. " He's much improved, much more confident, big and strong.".

Fair assessment, and I do think it is all about confidence and development, but if Tad wants to use the word UNIQUE for LL, what are the adjectives for KJ, Williams, and Assane next year?

We are at our best when we have the floor spaced and we are whipping passes around the outside and then either shooting the 3 effectively or after a good pump fake going hard to the hoop.

Also, can we please get back to the really high Free Throw percentage

 

[Goose]

You definitely know better than Tad what Lawson brings to the table. Especially with the O'Brien at the 5 suggestion. Brilliant analysis.

Edit: Sorry, this post was needlessly snarky. But it does get frustrating that people watch this bi-polar team, and think the problem is that Lawson Lovering isn't Shaq.

Amen.

It. Is. Not. 1993. Anymore.

 

[Preston Slaughter]

I thought last night was LL's worst on this road trip. He's been very good defensively in the other games and he did intimidate A+M guys every time they tried to go inside.
He needs to gain confidence offensively as far as shooting, but his passing is great. I think he has good awareness of where the ball needs to go. Last night, Hadley was out and TDS had a migraine - Tad's options were limited some . Tad sees a very good center, at an early stage of his career.

And there is this, which I've posted twice, with no responses. IMO, it's not a comment on his athletic ability or his height, it's got to be a comment on his mindset. What makes LL "different"?

From October:
"He's a unique player and somebody who's different from anyone in our program," Boyle said. " He's much improved, much more confident, big and strong.".

Tad was referring to him being different than any player on the team due to his size. We have redundancy at all other positions on the floor but he is the only real interior defensive presence.

 

[cu3x]

Tad was referring to him being different than any player on the team due to his size. We have redundancy at all other positions on the floor but he is the only real interior defensive presence.

That may be what he meant, but I don't think so. If it was just his height Tad was referring to, I don't think he'd use unclear terms - he'd say "He's tall". It's obvious he's the tallest guy on the team - I don't think Tad's language goes to emphasizing that. The second part of Tad's comment is directed to his physical assets

 

[Da Lama]

The announcers went on and on about how good the Buffs are when LL touches the ball, and how much Tad himself says that over and over.

Is this true? Does Tad see our success on the skinny shoulders of Lovering? He got worked by every single guy he played against and while his passing has some pleasant moments, he barely rebounds or intimidates anyone.

This team is growing up together in a tough environment. Not having Hadley was huge, losing TDS in the second half put everything on KJ, and nobody else is dynamic enough to unlock a well-coached opponent no matter what conference they come from.

I love our role guys, and they are some of the best we have had in a long time, buttttttttttt

Allen should have taken minutes by now
Williams will take over Nique's role and provide another scorer
Assane would take over LL minutes or flex all over the place and provide another scorer

We need to get a big body rim protector with semi-decent passing to go with KJ, TDS, QA, CW, and AD next year and it is not LL or any of the other guys.

Honestly, I would love to have Tad ask Luke O'Brien to just play the 5 spot and just be who he is and bang as best he can for now until Allen or Hurlburt can join up with Lovering to be bigger and stronger. I just think that LL is a net negative right now and not the pivot guy that the announcers or even Tad see that he is.

Nique, O'Brien, Gabbidon, Wright, and even Ruffin are currently Role guys and cannot get their own shots if needed, but they all have their good moments

Lovering is doing his job and other's at this point, so I have no beef with him. It shouldn't be just him inside and working the offensive flow. Many of us were advocating grabbing a transfer PF this off season (yeah, I know - numbers). It just seemed like too big a hole not to address. Rebounding has suffered and so has toughness. I believe Tad thought he could fill the void by committee with Clifford, Hadley and LOB. The problem I don't think he expected was having 2 of those 3 barely show up this season so far. I think he also planned on having another decent size forward in the mix in Allen and that went sideways, too. Tad probably believed we'd be deep enough, athletic enough and dialed in enough to create good shots, get to the glass and score fairly well. Hence his frustration.

 

[torero]

Lovering is doing his job and other's at this point, so I have no beef with him. It shouldn't be just him inside and working the offensive flow. Many of us were advocating grabbing a transfer PF this off season (yeah, I know - numbers). It just seemed like too big a hole not to address. Rebounding has suffered and so has toughness. I believe Tad thought he could fill the void by committee with Clifford, Hadley and LOB. The problem I don't think he expected was having 2 of those 3 barely show up this season so far. I think he also planned on having another decent size forward in the mix in Allen and that went sideways, too. Tad probably believed we'd be deep enough, athletic enough and dialed in enough to create good shots, get to the glass and score fairly well. Hence his frustration.

We definitely missed Hadley yesterday. Hope it's just a 1-2 week deal on his shoulder, not a 1-2 months.

 

[4BienemyTDs]

Lovering is doing his job and other's at this point, so I have no beef with him. It shouldn't be just him inside and working the offensive flow. Many of us were advocating grabbing a transfer PF this off season (yeah, I know - numbers). It just seemed like too big a hole not to address. Rebounding has suffered and so has toughness. I believe Tad thought he could fill the void by committee with Clifford, Hadley and LOB. The problem I don't think he expected was having 2 of those 3 barely show up this season so far. I think he also planned on having another decent size forward in the mix in Allen and that went sideways, too. Tad probably believed we'd be deep enough, athletic enough and dialed in enough to create good shots, get to the glass and score fairly well. Hence his frustration.

Do you think he in any way thought that Hurlburt would be an option sometime this season?
I just want to see us have muscle inside since all the times when we played Arizona or UCLA and just got overpowered
LL would be a nice sub/2nd line player, but not a front-line P5 player right now.
I am so jacked about next season, and this season is all about finding out how well each player can fit into a championship-caliber team heading into next year. I think that Tad has to make some tough moves to keep chemistry, but to also move in a hard core way to keep the best, play the best, and push hard for having a couple of great seasons. KJ and TDS, along with some of our other guys, plus Williams and Diop, and hopefully a transfer Big would be a recipe for Championship. I am still pumped about this season, it is going to be challenging and rewarding, but it all fits into a 2-3 year sequence.

 

[torero]

LL would be a nice sub/2nd line player, but not a front-line P5 player right now.

You keep harping on this. I think you are completely off the mark.

That doesn't mean he's a dominant first team all conference player. He absolutely is a capable power conference player now. He really wasn't last year, but we still had Evan and Jabari last year.

 

[Da Lama]

Do you think he in any way thought that Hurlburt would be an option sometime this season?
I just want to see us have muscle inside since all the times when we played Arizona or UCLA and just got overpowered
LL would be a nice sub/2nd line player, but not a front-line P5 player right now.
I am so jacked about next season, and this season is all about finding out how well each player can fit into a championship-caliber team heading into next year. I think that Tad has to make some tough moves to keep chemistry, but to also move in a hard core way to keep the best, play the best, and push hard for having a couple of great seasons. KJ and TDS, along with some of our other guys, plus Williams and Diop, and hopefully a transfer Big would be a recipe for Championship. I am still pumped about this season, it is going to be challenging and rewarding, but it all fits into a 2-3 year sequence.

If Lovering maintains steady progress throughout this year, there's no way he doesn't start next year. Tad loves him and he does all the things coaches notice and fans don't. Hurlburt is more of a work in progress than LL was this time last year. I'm betting he won't play until next year. That means Hadley needs to be/stay healthy and TDS, LOB and Clifford need to step the fvck up and act and play like upperclassmen. Tad's absolutely right to say some of these guys (the ones that have been in the program the longest) are most assuredly emabarrasssing the name on the front. At least one is going to be politely asked to leave at season's end to make room for new talent. They should all be playing like their CBB career's on the line because it could be.

A starting and first off the bench lineup like this is more than adequate to be very successful next year.

Lovering
TDS
Williams
Hadley
Simpson

1st PF: Diop
1st SF: ?
1st SG: Ruffin
1st PG: Hammond

I believe we lose Allen and/or one of either Clifford or LOB in the offseason. Just my gut. Tad doesn't put up with not getting it done. Allen may be given the benefit of the doubt if he's going through some stuff though.

 

[4BienemyTDs]

If Lovering maintains steady progress throughout this year, there's no way he doesn't start next year. Tad loves him and he does all the things coaches notice and fans don't. Hurlburt is more of a work in progress than LL was this time last year. I'm betting he won't play until next year. That means Hadley needs to be/stay healthy and TDS, LOB and Clifford need to step the fvck up and act and play like upperclassmen. Tad's absolutely right to say some of these guys (the ones that have been in the program the longest) are most assuredly emabarrasssing the name on the front. At least one is going to be politely asked to leave at season's end to make room for new talent. They should all be playing like their CBB career's on the line because it could be.

A starting and first off the bench lineup like this is more than adequate to be very successful next year.

Lovering
TDS
Williams
Hadley
Simpson

1st PF: Diop
1st SF: ?
1st SG: Ruffin
1st PG: Hammond

I believe we lose Allen and/or one of either Clifford or LOB in the offseason. Just my gut. Tad doesn't put up with not getting it done. Allen may be given the benefit of the doubt if he's going through some stuff though.

If you look at that lineup and you think that LL can be a crisp part of the team, god I hope so. That team can be one of the best we have ever had, and I would HOPE that Tad considers getting a 6-11 Transfer Big guy to come in and start instead of LL, bumping LL to second-team Center.
Does Gabbidon have another season?
I think based on what is coming in, and based on his ability that Clifford would be the odd man out and he could likely go and get a ton of playing time in a more starring role in a lower conference. LOB is such a nice energy role player

 

['99]

Blah, blah blah Lovering and the bigs, blah, blah, blah. College basketball is and always be a guard-driven game. While folks spend pages complaining about Lovering, needing a transfer PF, needing more size, what about these numbers?

CU's 3 wins
Simpson 53/44/78 shooting splits
Gabbidon 43/30/62
Wright 63/64/na
Ruffin 56/50/83
Hammond 53/20/100

CU's 3 losses
Simpson 33/31/80 shooting splits
Gabbidon 40/29/55
Wright 40/0/50
Ruffin 21/30/75
Hammond 28/28/67

CU loses when the guards can't hit shots.

 

[4BienemyTDs]

Blah, blah blah Lovering and the bigs, blah, blah, blah. College basketball is and always be a guard-driven game. While folks spend pages complaining about Lovering, needing a transfer PF, needing more size, what about these numbers?

CU's 3 wins
Simpson 53/44/78 shooting splits
Gabbidon 43/30/62
Wright 63/64/na
Ruffin 56/50/83
Hammond 53/20/100

CU's 3 losses
Simpson 33/31/80 shooting splits
Gabbidon 40/29/55
Wright 40/0/50
Ruffin 21/30/75
Hammond 28/28/67

CU loses when the guards can't hit shots.

Or when they get stuffed at the rim, or when they do not get second-chance shots.
Yes, Guards and Wing Players is the magic bullet, and we are loaded with them now and into the future.
We have no intimidation at the rim, and I would love to see some kind of lob and dunk game someday
It is not that LL is garbage, and would be great in a second line role, but to see he is a starter on a PAC12 Championship team just seems a little iffy

 

[GoBuffs!!]

Or when they get stuffed at the rim, or when they do not get second-chance shots.
Yes, Guards and Wing Players is the magic bullet, and we are loaded with them now and into the future.
We have no intimidation at the rim, and I would love to see some kind of lob and dunk game someday
It is not that LL is garbage, and would be great in a second line role, but to see he is a starter on a PAC12 Championship team just seems a little iffy

Dude, it is not 1990 anymore. Or did LL steal your GF, or dump your daughter or something?

 

[Da Lama]

Or when they get stuffed at the rim, or when they do not get second-chance shots.
Yes, Guards and Wing Players is the magic bullet, and we are loaded with them now and into the future.
We have no intimidation at the rim, and I would love to see some kind of lob and dunk game someday
It is not that LL is garbage, and would be great in a second line role, but to see he is a starter on a PAC12 Championship team just seems a little iffy

Well, this team has no size inside other than LL. The Buffs have 3 dudes right now who go hard on the boards. THREE. One is Lovering, who honestly could be averaging 9-10 boards a game if it typically wasn't 1 on 3 everytime a shot goes up. Watch how he keeps the ball alive even though he's fighting by himself. He creates rebounds for others. Two is Hadley who is undersized, but scrappy and constantly battling. Three is our freakin' PG who reads the shot and positions himself for rebounds as good as anyone I've seen in a long time. The issue is not with LL at this point. For all his perceived shortcomings I'll take what he's giving us right now over some of the underachievers we have on the floor lately. As others have said, LL is not the problem with this team right now and won't be the problem for this team going forward.

 

[Da Lama]

If you look at that lineup and you think that LL can be a crisp part of the team, god I hope so. That team can be one of the best we have ever had, and I would HOPE that Tad considers getting a 6-11 Transfer Big guy to come in and start instead of LL, bumping LL to second-team Center.
Does Gabbidon have another season?
I think based on what is coming in, and based on his ability that Clifford would be the odd man out and he could likely go and get a ton of playing time in a more starring role in a lower conference. LOB is such a nice energy role player

There are not decent 6-11 transfer big guys out there. A perfect example of this is a guy like Qudus Wahab. 6-11, 250. Projected to be very good. Was decent on a terrible G'Town team. Thought he could blow up somewhere else. Transfered to Maryland. Sucked. Transferred back to G'Town for his Sr year. Is decent again on a terrible team. A 9ppg 6rpg guy for his career. I'll bet LL ends up a 9ppg 6rpg guy by his Sr year too. The game has changed.

I agree, Clifford would be smart to follow what Kountz did.

Gabbidon is a 5th year grad transfer who is done after this year.

I wouldn't call LOB high energy. He provides others a chance to get a blow at this point and not much else.