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MBB - Change & Commitment for 2023-24
- Thread starter Buffnik
- Start date
I had posted an article in another forum here about depression and suicide in young women, and it's relation to social media and selfies.
It's tough for many young people to deal with the fact they apparewntl;y don't measure up to "ideals".
Pat Rooney on LL leaving, repeats some comments here:
"A few things here. First, he very much DID meet with Tad. He held all his individual player meetings this week. So let's not have any misconception on that one. I'm not going to speculate on Lovering's reasons without speaking with him. Only he can answer how he felt about the coaching he received and I can't really speculate on that. But yes, he IS very hard on himself. That frustration happens at practice too. And I'm curious if how he was treated on social media played any role here, if at all. I understand it's a situation where a few bad apples/angry fans ruin it for everyone, but there was a faction of twitter tough guys that were brutal on the young man."
It's tough for many young people to deal with the fact they apparewntl;y don't measure up to "ideals".
Pat Rooney on LL leaving, repeats some comments here:
"A few things here. First, he very much DID meet with Tad. He held all his individual player meetings this week. So let's not have any misconception on that one. I'm not going to speculate on Lovering's reasons without speaking with him. Only he can answer how he felt about the coaching he received and I can't really speculate on that. But yes, he IS very hard on himself. That frustration happens at practice too. And I'm curious if how he was treated on social media played any role here, if at all. I understand it's a situation where a few bad apples/angry fans ruin it for everyone, but there was a faction of twitter tough guys that were brutal on the young man."
I'm not convinced of the accepted story that LL left because fans were mean to him. The only evidence of this are some reports of fans being mean and one tweet from his father about a breakfast dick. In the internet age, we're all too ready to accept these kind of half-assed theories as truth. Mostly I doubt the story because LL never seemed that soft to me . . . and because CU is far from a basketball hotbed. He will get the same from fans wherever he goes--worse at places where basketball is more important.
What's your explanation?
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??? I don't have one, because I don't have anything on which to base an opinion. I could make some **** up, but there's already plenty of that on the internet. I assume we'll hear something from inside the program or the Lovering family at some point. Something more reliable than Buffs223's "extremely well-connected poster on another site."
Could be as simple as he thinks maybe he can improve his game somewhere else better, who knows? Whatever the reason or reasons, appreciate what he did for CU. Good luck LL.
You obviously didn't peruse social media after games. It was brutal. FTR - We had a group of 50-somethings sitting behind us all year who couldn't tell you if we were winning or losing because all they did every game was scream obscenities at Lovering. We sit close enough, so you know he heard it. Someone reported them two different times and the cops had a chat with them, but they were back at it the next home series. Like I said, a very large portion of this fanbase is ignorant and repugnant. God help us all if Prime doesn't win his first 3 games by 50...
Rooney just published the same thing. I'm sure it was posted here. This isn't just some random poster.
With social media, I know I didn't see what the guys or gals now see, at least not at that level these days. The criticism was more up front and personal, you'd be surprised by who. Idk LL at all, other than the obvious. Just from experience, some embrace the haters and some don't, period. Whatever it was, hope he ends up in a good place for HIM.
I don’t begrudge any student who decides to transfer, including LL. I hope he transfers because he’s found a place that will up his game—maybe run the offense through him occasionally, etc. I would be disappointed and believe he made a mistake if his transfer was caused by fans’ criticism. Maybe that’s why I don’t want to buy into this narrative.
My feelings on the transfer portal are 100% correlated to whether CU is seen as a stepping stone or destination program in the given sport.
I sure didn't complain when Fortune and Horne joined our MBB program, when Miller, Sadler and Vonleh joined our WBB program, the current FB offseason, etc.
This,
I wish kids didn't transfer as much and I think for some kids the best thing they could do is to work through the adversity but that said it's their life, their education, and their right to make a decision and transfer to a place that they believe better fits their needs.
Fans can be absolute jerks and I can understand some players wanting to get away from them. These fans act towards and speak of players in a way that wouldn't be appropriate towards pro players much less young people in college.
Coaches frequently change schools for a better opportunity, most of us in our jobs can change employers relatively easily. Most students can change schools fairly easily.
That's a good way to look at it.
IMO It’s pretty chicken**** of the cops not to have thrown those “fans” out of the venue.
Seems more the responsibility of the AD.
Well yeah, anybody onsite with the authority to do so. Then if these guys were season ticket holders just refund their prorata $$ share based on the # of remaining home games and ban ‘em permanently.
My response was just based on Da Lama’s statement that the cops had given them a warning, and the cops were already onsite.
It's funny you said that. The cops actually were pretty cool, but told people around us that if they had been yelling repeatedly like that at the referees, they could've been tossed with consequences. But, yelling at a 19 year old kid = warning. I agree though, the AD should've been notified and done something. That is, if the AD cared about basketball.
Strange priorities for the cops, right? Thanks for this info.
It is on the AD.
When I used to work high school events (mostly wrestling but also basketball and occasionally some others) we almost always had a deputy sheriff there to lend a sense of authority.
They explained to us from the start though that unless a fan was clearly violating a law (physically assaulting somebody, making credible threats, being on school grounds under the influence, etc.) that it was on us to draw the line and initiate the interaction with the fan(s) involved. Making crude or unsportsmanlike comments, violating dress code, and similar things were violations of the rules of the venue but not the law.
It was on us as the school to initiate the removal of a fan for violation of our standards. This usually meant having the administrator on duty or one of our district security personnel inform the persons involved that they were in violation of the conduct expectations and had to leave, this would be done in the presence of the deputy.
If an official requested a person be removed the school representative would immediately go with the deputy to initiate the process.
If the person refused then it became a matter of trespassing which the deputy could and would use as legal justification to give a lawful order to leave. If this order was ignored or resisted it then became failure to comply with a lawful order which elevated the officers ability to respond.
Point is that the AD has the responsibility to determine what they will and will not accept and how they will respond be it a warning, a warning followed by expulsion from the arena, or immediate removal. These expectations need to be communicated to events staff in advance and supported by the AD staff at the event. The role of the cops is not to determine what the rules are or how to enforce them. They simply provide legal support for the implementation of the AD standards.
May have been posted, but Tad's comments on Clifford:
“There is not a finer young man, not a finer human being that I’ve ever coached than Nique Clifford,” Boyle said. “He’s given everything in his power to this program and to our coaching staff and to his teammates. Nique wasn’t a good teammate, he was a great teammate. I’ve got a lot of respect of him."
“There is not a finer young man, not a finer human being that I’ve ever coached than Nique Clifford,” Boyle said. “He’s given everything in his power to this program and to our coaching staff and to his teammates. Nique wasn’t a good teammate, he was a great teammate. I’ve got a lot of respect of him."
Thanks for the details Mtn. The AD folks need to get on the ball then. The small % of CU “fans” that are bums needs to be shunted and shut out.
Then his family burns him down on social media. SMH.
We might not like the suddenness and details of LL’s flip, but at least the family kept their mouths shut and went about their business quietly and respectfully.
If Nique and his family didn't want him to play a Jaylen Clark style game, then they should have been upfront with Tad so he didn't give a gift to an in-state recruit and tell Clark "no". Fvck them.
Fvck LL and his family, too. Program was incredibly supportive and so were the vast majority of fans as we endured his net negative play for 2 years (often times significantly negative) as we encouraged his development and praised his effort.
I don't care at this point how much they gave or how good they were as teammates. This is addition by subtraction so that we can fix program culture, bring this team together, and cut out the turnover machines who couldn't reliably make shots, rebound or be counted on not to go through periods of pouting & bad body language on the court which brought everyone down,
As far as Allen is concerned, I can't miss what we never had. Not sure if he never committed, was never fully healthy, simply isn't very good, or a mix of all that. Regardless, we're better without him.
I'm so ready to roll without them.
Fvck LL and his family, too. Program was incredibly supportive and so were the vast majority of fans as we endured his net negative play for 2 years (often times significantly negative) as we encouraged his development and praised his effort.
I don't care at this point how much they gave or how good they were as teammates. This is addition by subtraction so that we can fix program culture, bring this team together, and cut out the turnover machines who couldn't reliably make shots, rebound or be counted on not to go through periods of pouting & bad body language on the court which brought everyone down,
As far as Allen is concerned, I can't miss what we never had. Not sure if he never committed, was never fully healthy, simply isn't very good, or a mix of all that. Regardless, we're better without him.
I'm so ready to roll without them.
DAYUM! Somebody had himself some Bloody Marys at the all you can drink brunch this morning! Love it.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
I still can't believe Tad would tell Clark, hey we filled your spot, rather than just over sign by one. Maybe something flipped in Tad since that time because he's now shown a willingness to over sign and cut dead weight. I don't think he had that in him before.
Formerly_Medford
Well-Known Member
Also...I'm not on Twitter, so what exactly is coming out from their camps?
I can't say that towards LL. We speculate but don't know exactly why he is leaving and I give the benefit of a doubt to these young men.
LL has worked hard and had a good attitude. I wish he was staying but he isn't.
When Tad recruited him we all knew that it was going to take him some time to develop, it didn't work out, everyone moves on.
Nique on the other hand pouted, didn't do what he needed to do to fit in, then his family burns bridges on the way out. You are right, Tad doesn't lie to kids about what will be expected, if he didn't want to do that then he should have saved himself and Tad (and the fans) some frustration and gone elsewhere.
Is this the same poster who was blasting other members for criticizing football transfers?
Different reasons for transfer and different noise around it.