So forgetting your pedantic tangent about deserve vs want, what don’t you understand about my stance? If expectations are not met for many years, isn’t it realistic for fans to maybe want more (without feeling a sense of “deserving” or entitlement)?
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Tad Boyle is the Greatest Coach in CU Men’s Basketball History
- Thread starter Goose
- Start date
I don't really see how this aged poorly. Da Lama's message was Feb 11 when we were 16-8 just after the home Arizona loss. His point was that there were many attainable coaches at that point in time who would have been at least 19-5 or better with our team (at that point in time when we were 16-8). And at that point, the season was looking like it could come unraveled (jury is still out on that one, although we have rebounded well and have been 4-1 since that message).
Can't really age poorly on "looking like" and "right now." But I don't know.
Enough to keep him from going to Duke, if you believe the rumors.
Any estimates?
$50k, or other things, like a car?
I have not seen the TDS Super C Ads anywhere
NIL sucks when it is just inducement money
So if we go 0-2 on this road trip then stumble in the tournament and miss out on the Dance you'd still think it's a successful season?
No, based on not achieving realistic goals for this season which were aligned with the talent and experience of this squad.
Yes, if we're talking relatively on the results of CU compared to the other 361 D1 teams. A winning record in a power conference and notching 20 or more wins is something beyond what most programs will have achieved this season.
This is true, but without KJ, Tristan and Cody next year this team might win 10 games. Might.
Sounds like we can bank on you to give a sizeable NIL deal to secure some talent?
This is cool. I just find myself on the side of analyzing the season by who we put on the court, against who we played.
To that end the jury is still most definitely out for me.
I give plenty, chief.
50k, car, a few other perks like access to the property of donors (vail house, ranch, etc)
#3 has been looked at - the building basically can't support it without a massive amount of work, the sort of work that makes you ask, "Should we just start from scratch?"
The big thing the Keg has going for it is that it is loud, it is hot, the fans are on the court, and the students are on top of the opponents.
This is where the Rick/Cunit/Students stumble is so madly frustrating, he took the single most significant thing about the Keg that gives us an advantage, and can make the building special and he gutted it.
But other than that, SLEEPING GIANT!
Get ready for some dumbass to counter "But the Nugs won the title!"
Good point Jokic brothers both have 4 years of eligibility. Does Gordon have a brother?
I didn't respond to this yesterday, but meant to. I appreciate your insight here and have gathered over the years that you're somewhat close to the AD as a booster of sorts. I haven't been part of the MBB discussions over the years, so I only have surface level knowledge of things.
I guess I've just seen this board crush every football coach until Prime for their lackluster recruiting, poor staff hires, and poor on-field results for the better part of a decade, without much acknowledgement or excuse about resources and institutional support, relative to conference peers. Sure, they got the CC and IPF built, but in hindsight, that feels like the absolute bare minimum to have a D1/P5 AD, let alone a competitive P5 football program.
Tad has absolutely done more with less than his peers in the Pac 12 and I have acknowledged multiple times that he's a good coach who has turned a historically bad and irrelevant program into a respectable one. I simply understand if some people are tired of the plateau that he has seemingly hit. This season has to be tough for the die hard CU MBB supporters. It feels like if the 2024 football team had to scratch and claw to win 6 games. A major failure to meet expectations.
However, as I see how the team is trending down the stretch and that they have a real shot at making the tournament, a lot of this discussion might end up being moot and the tune could certainly change.
RE: Sleeping Giant/CUnit. You can't move the school to a more talent rich area, and you can't change the historical success of the program.
But as AD, you can, to an extent, control the fan base and the donor pool. It starts with cultivating a culture of support, and the easiest way to do that is to create lifelong fans who are students- you've got them as a captive audience for 4 years.
Honestly, the **** the Bohn did was working towards that end, and it could not have cost that much money in the budget which is why it's maddening that RG just let it fall apart.
I think that it's helpful to discuss this in terms of football success, because I think a lot of people ITT are more in tune with college football rather than college basketball, and removing the comparison even further might help people be more objective.
I also think a better way to frame it is that there's 68 teams that make the tournament out of ~350 teams, so roughly 19-20%. There's 128 FBS football teams, so 19-20% is 25. Making the tournament is roughly the equivalent of a top 25 finish.
I think a good analog here would be Mark Stoops at Kentucky- a good coach who has his team competitive in a good conference with less resources than his peers, and has the additional obstacles of a historically unsuccessful program and limited local talent to draw from.
I think most people on this board would also say that Kentucky would be crazy to run Stoops off, because who's going to do a better job? Yet, Stoops has only 2 top 25 finishes in 11 seasons.
The Guts of a Sleeping Giant are there, but yes, the full commitment to being a Top 48-64 program is what is holding back the program even with a healthy home market, community basketball momentum, a nice arena and practice facility, and the location of player talent for basketball does not matter as much since you do not need 85 players. If Arizona, Gonzaga, and Creighton can do it, anyone can.
Agree that a new level of commitment is on the Donors, the Institution, and the Fans aligning, but it can be done, and, sadly, it has not happened fully to this point due to new or old leadership not making the right moves, but the guts are still there.
Joining the best Basketball Conference/League in the country provides a new chance to figure it out. I am an optimist and still see potential greatness.
There’s a huge difference between being disappointed with the season and calling for Tads removal.
If you don’t win your conference tournament, then you’re fighting for one of 36 at-large bids to the tournament. And since the BIG10 automatically gets 10 of those, there’s really only 26 spots available for the remaining 300+ teams.
Below is the list of Power 6 teams. I'm curious where people think Colorado naturally ranks as a program based on historical prestige, recruiting grounds, facilities, university support and donor/fan engagement - so the stuff that's irrespective of who the current HC is.
Colorado
Arizona
Arizona State
Cal
Oregon
Oregon State
Stanford
UCLA
USC
Washington
Washington State
Baylor
BYU
Cincinnati
Houston
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Texas
TCU
Texas Tech
UCF
West Virginia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Maryland
Michigan
Michigan State
Minnesota
Nebraska
Northwestern
Ohio State
Penn State
Purdue
Rutgers
Wisconsin
Alabama
Arkansas
Auburn
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
LSU
Mississippi
Mississippi State
Missouri
South Carolina
Tennessee
Texas A&M
Vanderbilt
Boston College
Clemson
Duke
Florida State
Georgia Tech
Louisville
Miami
North Carolina
NC State
Notre Dame
Pitt
Syracuse
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Wake Forest
Butler
Connecticut
Creighton
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Providence
St. John's
Villanova
Xavier
Does anyone think that CU isn't in the bottom 20 or even bottom 10 of that list? And that's before we start looking at some great programs outside the Power 6 like SDSU and Gonzaga.
Colorado
Arizona
Arizona State
Cal
Oregon
Oregon State
Stanford
UCLA
USC
Washington
Washington State
Baylor
BYU
Cincinnati
Houston
Iowa State
Kansas
Kansas State
Oklahoma
Oklahoma State
Texas
TCU
Texas Tech
UCF
West Virginia
Illinois
Indiana
Iowa
Maryland
Michigan
Michigan State
Minnesota
Nebraska
Northwestern
Ohio State
Penn State
Purdue
Rutgers
Wisconsin
Alabama
Arkansas
Auburn
Florida
Georgia
Kentucky
LSU
Mississippi
Mississippi State
Missouri
South Carolina
Tennessee
Texas A&M
Vanderbilt
Boston College
Clemson
Duke
Florida State
Georgia Tech
Louisville
Miami
North Carolina
NC State
Notre Dame
Pitt
Syracuse
Virginia
Virginia Tech
Wake Forest
Butler
Connecticut
Creighton
DePaul
Georgetown
Marquette
Providence
St. John's
Villanova
Xavier
Does anyone think that CU isn't in the bottom 20 or even bottom 10 of that list? And that's before we start looking at some great programs outside the Power 6 like SDSU and Gonzaga.
Definitely bottom 3 in the current Pac. Hell, just in the western U.S. most of the Mountain West is better situated based on their arenas, historical success and fan support. As an example, UNM with The Pit (over 15k) or Nevada which got a $1B investment to replace Lawlor (12.5K) with a showpiece arena and event district in Reno.
KC is almost a 9 hour drive. Calling it close is more of an exaggeration than calling Washington DC and St. Louis within the Tennessee Vols' close recruiting grounds.
Like with football, CU basketball is in the center of the 5* desert. We have no geography like a Butler which can pull extremely well-coached local HS talent that has played against great competition their whole lives. There's enough in-state talent in CO for 1/3 of the roster to be locals who will contribute to a winning D1 program but these aren't stars. It's our relationships with certain AAUs in CA and TX which we need a war chest to leverage in order to be really good. Otherwise, we're reliant on high 3* recruits and transfers with needing to be better than most on talent evaluation. But even with that, we're now in a new era where there better be money in the NIL war chest to keep a guy like Kin here for 4 years when we hit. The CU program needs more resources in order to compete because we have to win bidding wars to have a competitive roster with the other teams in our conference.
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All I've said is it might be time to part ways. I don't see the same fire Tad used to have, we've underachieved too often the last few years and we're going into arguably the toughest conference in MBB. Might just be time. We'll see what happens down the stretch and in the offseason. These will be the two biggest moments in Tad's career here.
GRM
I'm a ****ty troll
That is exactly where I come across too. I do not see grounds to fire Tad. Even if the Buffs make the tourney and are 1&done, or even win 1 game (could be an 11 seed, so play-in +1), it could be time for Tad and RG to sit down and have a very candid discussion. Part of that discussion could be is it time to move on/transition. Tad may want more facilities, NIL, and new/renovated foam dome. RG may want a step-up in the program's performance. The C-Unit and gameday enjoyment would be discussed. CU's joining the B-12, what is the plan there to stay competitive?
I just think however the outcome of this season, it is probably time to internally reset somewhat and come up with whatever plan suits everyone. I'm much more football driven, so I'm generally happy with Tad, but those fans and boosters that want more out of this Hoops program have rights to be taken into consideration.
But why don't we just hire the basketball version of Prime! or Coach Mac!
(yea we are at that level of delusion)
I think Tad is very good at recruiting on a budget, finding talent, and developing talent. He does that at a far greater level than any of his predecessors. Just look at how many guys we have playing in the NBA or in high level leagues over seas. What he doesn't do well is in-game coaching. His record on the road is terrible given the level of talent. We often blow games because we are slow to adjust to the other team. This is the easy part of coaching and there are many coaches we could find who do this better than Tad. I think that is the source of frustration with Tad even if his results are better than we are likely to get from a different coach. It is easier to accept losing games because we don't have good enough talent versus losing because our talent is out-coached.
P.S. I am not arguing for firing Tad.
P.S. I am not arguing for firing Tad.