hawg1
Well-Known Member
Those that want a qualified HC and put more importance on that than they do on competitive draft picks, especially somebody in a different conference.
jeez.
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Eric Bien(i)emy's next job speculation, shut out again
- Thread starter 4BienemyTDs
- Start date
jeez.
People can argue about if EB will or won't be a good HC in the league, based on history we won't know until he gets his shot.
I will ask the question though based on his experience, his success at the positions he has held, the recommendations of those he works for and those who have worked with him, if he were white instead of Black would he have had a shot at a HC job already?
My answer is without questions yes.
When you are a coordinator with a SB win, high statistical rankings, and recommendations you get job offers. Look how many Patriots assistant coaches have gotten HC jobs in recent years and generally they have been lousy head coaches but the next guy up (white) keeps getting hired. Some of them get multiple opportunities.
I will ask the question though based on his experience, his success at the positions he has held, the recommendations of those he works for and those who have worked with him, if he were white instead of Black would he have had a shot at a HC job already?
My answer is without questions yes.
When you are a coordinator with a SB win, high statistical rankings, and recommendations you get job offers. Look how many Patriots assistant coaches have gotten HC jobs in recent years and generally they have been lousy head coaches but the next guy up (white) keeps getting hired. Some of them get multiple opportunities.
Let me get this straight: Because the half-wits that run a majority of NFL franchises haven't offered EB a head coaching position means he's "not HC material."
You have two types of hires that are being made in the NFL right now:
1. Traditional hire of a successful coordinator with the thought that that guy will be able to replicate the same success on that side of the ball for the new franchise
2. Making a more unknown/obscure hire based on the perceived ability to be a CEO-type and leader
The first option is a crap shoot for a number of reasons, but IMO, mostly because the job responsibilities are drastically different and what made them successful on Team X isn't what they are being asked to do for Team Y.
The second is less of a crap shoot, IMO, because the qualities you're looking for actually align with the job responsibilities of a Head Coach. Obviously, the two of these can overlap and the results are guys like Kyle Shanahan, Sean McVay, Matt LaFleur, Kevin Stefanski, Sean McDermott, Frank Reich, etc.
Clearly, the NFL isn't impressed with the OC part of EB's resume being under Andy Reid and having Mahomes as his QB, and to this point, he hasn't blown anyone away with his presence, plan, vision, and leadership to be a CEO. I also think the Chiefs success the past two years going to the Super Bowl and basically forcing teams that might have wanted to hire EB to wait 5-6 weeks has been a detriment.
1. Traditional hire of a successful coordinator with the thought that that guy will be able to replicate the same success on that side of the ball for the new franchise
2. Making a more unknown/obscure hire based on the perceived ability to be a CEO-type and leader
The first option is a crap shoot for a number of reasons, but IMO, mostly because the job responsibilities are drastically different and what made them successful on Team X isn't what they are being asked to do for Team Y.
The second is less of a crap shoot, IMO, because the qualities you're looking for actually align with the job responsibilities of a Head Coach. Obviously, the two of these can overlap and the results are guys like Kyle Shanahan, Sean McVay, Matt LaFleur, Kevin Stefanski, Sean McDermott, Frank Reich, etc.
Clearly, the NFL isn't impressed with the OC part of EB's resume being under Andy Reid and having Mahomes as his QB, and to this point, he hasn't blown anyone away with his presence, plan, vision, and leadership to be a CEO. I also think the Chiefs success the past two years going to the Super Bowl and basically forcing teams that might have wanted to hire EB to wait 5-6 weeks has been a detriment.
Super Bowl is 2/7. NFL league year begins 3/17. Takes a lot of time to secure an entire coaching staff, scouting department, personnel department, and get a plan together for Free Agency and the Draft. Most Head Coaches being hired want at least partial personnel control.
Unless an organization is fully convinced that a coach on one of the Super Bowl teams is their guy and there is no doubt that coach will agree to be their HC, there is good reason why they don't want to wait this long.
Again... arbitrary. NFL teams love to think within the box.
But it's not really that arbitrary. Maybe you can expound on why you think so and what it would look like thinking "outside the box".
"We just went 2-14 and we have the #1 pick. We just hired a new GM a few weeks and he is assembling a staff. We are taking our time in really building up our scouting department after years of mismanagement.
I just don't think we can afford to wait for the DC of the best defense in the league for a few more weeks as his team marches toward the Super Bowl when the DC of the #9 defense in the league is available right now after getting bounced in the Wild Card round 38-17."
While I do think race does play some role in this, something else bigger is at play and thinking that he just isn't HC material can be a good starting point.Let me get this straight: Because the half-wits that run a majority of NFL franchises haven't offered EB a head coaching position means he's "not HC material."
As been said, I think he needs to get out behind Reid's coattails because I think that is the biggest stickler right now from him getting a HC position. He probably doesn't sell himself as well as others, so teams are hesitant because they know Reid can run that offense himself if he wanted.
hawg1
Well-Known Member
Yes, both implicit and explicit race at play in NFL HC hirings. without doubt.
Just imagine the make-up of many front offices. And imagine how animation and high energy from a black man could be interpreted given cultural underpinnings and their age differences.
Some are trying to insulate themselves with consultants/former players on search committee. I heard such for Speilman and Iggles. No wonder he was attracted to a LB dude who would bite your kneecaps off.
hawg1
Well-Known Member
Half-wits (and racism) play a part. So do EB’s ability to hav and sell a vision for a club and his ability to lead via gravitas.Let me get this straight: Because the half-wits that run a majority of NFL franchises haven't offered EB a head coaching position means he's "not HC material."
it’s many factors, yes, including EB.
I mean, that's pretty much been SOP for NFL teams for decades now. Hire a GM first, he controls all personnel, scouting and front office departments, hires the HC and is basically the HC's boss.
Many NFL teams have broken away from that model and gone with HCs being equals or even superiors to the GM and having their finger prints in all those departments.
It completely depends on which coach is being targeted, and I stated that unless teams are blown away by a coach on a Super Bowl team, there's no reason to wait. Has EB blown anyone away? Obviously not.
hawg1
Well-Known Member
All interviees have a vision book these days, with staff composition and deployment being a huge point in their candidacy. There is so much you can tell via proposed staff composition.
Those factors only explain why he hasn't been offered a HC job. They say nothing about his ability to be a good NFL HC.
Most teams do not even want to wait for coaches involved in conference championship games. Seems pretty damn stupid to eliminate several candidates from your hiring pool based on a matter of weeks. You can dress it up in other terms, but this happens routinely. Does it really make that much sense?
I don't know why such a big deal is made about whether EB calls all the plays or has control over the game plan as OC.
NFL is a copycat league and what I've observed for decades is that when a HC has success, particularly when it's sustained, the top assistants are offered HC jobs in order to bring those successful systems & management philosophy into an organization that is struggling.
It's logical that EB would be offered a HC job for this reason alone.
NFL is a copycat league and what I've observed for decades is that when a HC has success, particularly when it's sustained, the top assistants are offered HC jobs in order to bring those successful systems & management philosophy into an organization that is struggling.
It's logical that EB would be offered a HC job for this reason alone.
hawg1
Well-Known Member
I outlined why I think he fails to land a job.
If they are passing on the “right” guy solely because they have to wait longer, then no, it makes zero sense. I just don’t think most teams operate that way and EB is really the only example of this the past couple years.
But if teams aren’t hiring him because they don’t believe he is the architect behind the offensive success, then they have to look at the CEO attributes and decide if he possesses them. To this point, half the league has decided that he doesn’t.
Is he?
Which is why this is so perplexing.
None of us question EB's ability as a leader, teacher and motivator. We used to question his maturity, but that's old news now. The only knock we have is on his playcalling, really.
I really think that what makes him hard to hire is that he is so strong willed of a personality. And while that's what you need in a HC, I think it makes a lot of owners uncomfortable when this brashness comes from a black guy.
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I guess Robert Saleh last year, too, although I feel like he kind of pulled his name out of the running for both college and NFL jobs, but maybe I'm wrong. Point is, teams don't want to take the risk of being left at the alter in February after the other 6-7 jobs have been filled.
Yeah, I buy that for a few of the interviews and organizations, but not all 13 of them over the last 3 years.
Rob DeVere
Well-Known Member
Oh, sorta like what happened to Dorrell in the college ranks: No second chances....until now!
CPVbuff
Well-Known Member
I think everyone’s is overthinking it. EB is an awesome guy, but for anyone who has met him he is an acquired taste. It’s just the right fit. The only jobs this year that I thought would be a fit were Philly and Houston. And Houston he may not have wanted.
he might very well takeover for a Reid as well.
he might very well takeover for a Reid as well.
NewEra 2014
Well-Known Member
Eagles fans already staging a boycott after this
Compare the number of white coaches who have had a second chance to the number of Black coaches and tell me there is no difference.
And Dorrell would still be an NFL assistant coach if CU wasn't desperate and cheap and he wasn't friends with Lance Karl who is one of the very few Black administrators at his level in P5 football.
Karl Dorrell at UCLA never had a losing season and took his teams to a bowl all five years he was there. He didn't have a recruiting or other scandal. Tell me that if he had been white that he would have had to wait 13 years to get another head coaching job.
If thinks racism isn't a big issue in hiring head coaches show me some evidence that proves otherwise. I've already posted in earlier post the numbers that easily support my position.
It's funny because racism no longer exists in America. Well, except from what the PC crowd creates when they force the issue, amirite?