I really love how much everyone hates us; it is truly the best feeling ever.

[Buffnik]

On Venables’ comment, was he responding to a question that mentioned Coach Prime? I could see someone asking something like, “Coach, Deion Sanders replaced almost all of Colorado’s roster, is that something you considered doing?”

Doesn't matter. The way to answer that question is, "I don't worry about about other programs. But I have the utmost respect for Coach Sanders and am sure he is doing what is right for his program and the university he represents. For my program, it was important to respect the tremendous success the players and their teams had previously achieved at Oklahoma while evolving the culture and systems, so my policy has been to give everyone a full year as long as they met their obligations and conduct standards before having conversations about whether it's the right fit for them and Oklahoma football."

That said, the way I understand it is that Venables went off script and started bringing up side topics on his own, including the attack on Coach Prime's method of rebuilding CU.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

Doesn't matter. The way to answer that question is, "I don't worry about about other programs. But I have the utmost respect for Coach Sanders and am sure he is doing what is right for his program and the university he represents. For my program, it was important to respect the tremendous success the players and their teams had previously achieved at Oklahoma while evolving the culture and systems, so my policy has been to give everyone a full year as long as they met their obligations and conduct standards before having conversations about whether it's the right fit for them and Oklahoma football."

That said, the way I understand it is that Venables went off script and started bringing up side topics on his own, including the attack on Coach Prime's method of rebuilding CU.

Im pretty sure they are all worried that this new paradigm might replace them. You can see how other black charismatic players like a Shannon Sharpe or a Michael Strahan type could copy what Prime is doing and steal the players that were traditionally recruited. Like the portal has done to MBB everyone in CFB is now at risk of losing their non starting players.

 

[DBT]

Im pretty sure they are all worried that this new paradigm might replace them. You can see how other black charismatic players like a Shannon Sharpe or a Michael Strahan type could copy what Prime is doing and steal the players that were traditionally recruited. Like the portal has done to MBB everyone in CFB is now at risk of losing their non starting players.

Mmm, I think Prime is pretty unique in that he has a mission. Guys don’t just become successful coaches because they want to. He certainly has broken the mold.

 

[Highlander]

Im pretty sure they are all worried that this new paradigm might replace them. You can see how other black charismatic players like a Shannon Sharpe or a Michael Strahan type could copy what Prime is doing and steal the players that were traditionally recruited. Like the portal has done to MBB everyone in CFB is now at risk of losing their non starting players.

I don't think many are willing to pay their dues the way Coach Prime has, though.

Instead of going the assistant coach route, he started with pee wee football, then HS x2 different programs, then Jackson St before getting to CU at least a season before anyone thought he'd get a shot at a P5 program.

 

[MtnBuff]

Mmm, I think Prime is pretty unique in that he has a mission. Guys don’t just become successful coaches because they want to. He certainly has broken the mold.

I would agree with this, Prime is an absolute one of a kind.

Also thinking about it even if other schools start hiring more Black coaches I doubt they are going to be hiring the Black coaches who are so out front in their personalities.

A ridiculously small number of Black men have been hired as D1 head coaches but then if you look at the guys have they tend to fit a certain profile, one that fits in with conservative white administrators and boosters. As an illustration of this is easy to find close to home looking at Dorrell.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

I don't think many are willing to pay their dues the way Coach Prime has, though.

Instead of going the assistant coach route, he started with pee wee football, then HS x2 different programs, then Jackson St before getting to CU at least a season before anyone thought he'd get a shot at a P5 program.

I would actually say most coaches view Prime as not paying his dues. Yes, he started at little league and high school, but that isn't really relevant to coaching in college. He tried going after the FSU job without any college experience. JSU hired him for his name and after two years, CU has hired him for similar reasons, but with a bit more body of work as a coach.

I think most traditional coaches view him as a threat to the typical career path in coaching.

 

[MiamiBuffs]

I would actually say most coaches view Prime as not paying his dues. Yes, he started at little league and high school, but that isn't really relevant to coaching in college. He tried going after the FSU job without any college experience. JSU hired him for his name and after two years, CU has hired him for similar reasons, but with a bit more body of work as a coach.

I think most traditional coaches view him as a threat to the typical career path in coaching.

This.

He bypassed all the decades spent at ****ty dusty corners for 2 years, knocking on kids doors, only to wait to finally get a crack at being a coordinator. Um no, Im not doing that. There are a lot of HCs that I think see him possibly turning the business on its ear.

Prime is a trail blazer. If hes truly letting his assistants run things while being the CEO and personality with a media presence I think there are a few former NFL guys that could copy that. He says ‘here is your ticket to the NFL from a guy that starred in the NFL’ without ever having to say it. Once you have the players the winning part usually follows.

 

[Bison]

Mmm, I think Prime is pretty unique in that he has a mission. Guys don’t just become successful coaches because they want to. He certainly has broken the mold.

Prime's work ethic is what got him into this situation and based on the seasons post 2016, this is what CU football players need. His worth ethic in the video rooms as a player was legendary.

 

[Leon Sandcastle]

Prime's work ethic is what got him into this situation and based on the seasons post 2016, this is what CU football players need. His worth ethic in the video rooms as a player was legendary.

I would say work ethic *and old school mentality towards discipline

 

[Buffnik]

I would actually say most coaches view Prime as not paying his dues. Yes, he started at little league and high school, but that isn't really relevant to coaching in college. He tried going after the FSU job without any college experience. JSU hired him for his name and after two years, CU has hired him for similar reasons, but with a bit more body of work as a coach.

I think most traditional coaches view him as a threat to the typical career path in coaching.

Guys who played at the highest level of the highest level absolutely paid their dues, just a different set of dues.

If you don't have that, you have a different path to be able to command the room and be the face of a program. Coach Prime doesn't have to spend a decade as an assistant and he shouldn't be expected to, nor is that reasonable to apply to his peers.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Guys who played at the highest level of the highest level absolutely paid their dues, just a different set of dues.

If you don't have that, you have a different path to be able to command the room and be the face of a program. Coach Prime doesn't have to spend a decade as an assistant and he shouldn't be expected to, nor is that reasonable to apply to his peers.

I don’t disagree with you. I just think there are probably a lot of coaches out there who view being a high level player and a high level coach as two entirely different things and CP rising to a P5 HC within 2 years is a threat if he’s successful.

 

[Buffnik]

I don’t disagree with you. I just think there are probably a lot of coaches out there who view being a high level player and a high level coach as two entirely different things and CP rising to a P5 HC within 2 years is a threat if he’s successful.

Of course they think that. If you spent 25 years working your way up the ladder after being a backup Safety, that's your frame of reference and ego defense. But it's bullsh!t. To use an NFL example, Belichick had a much more tortuous path to become a HC than Vrable. That's appropriate.

Notice no one says a word about legacies in coaching and sons of coaches getting fast tracked.

These are the types of things which aren't overtly racist or even intentionally so, but a great example of how a traditional way of conducting things favors one ethnic group while limiting doors from opening for others.

 

[96 Buff]

These are the types of things which aren't overtly racist or even intentionally so, but a great example of how a traditional way of conducting things favors one ethnic group while limiting doors from opening for others.

Disagree. Systemic racism (which is what is in play here) is absolutely intentionally racist. It's possibly the most American thing out there. The negative comments and uncomfortableness experienced by many is entirely driven by a Black man doing this. White America doesn't like those "uppity Blacks" doing things that only Whites used to be able to do like fast-tracked careers because of name/family/money and 'not paying their dues.'

 

[Buffnik]

Disagree. Systemic racism (which is what is in play here) is absolutely intentionally racist. It's possibly the most American thing out there. The negative comments and uncomfortableness experienced by many is entirely driven by a Black man doing this. White America doesn't like those "uppity Blacks" doing things that only Whites used to be able to do like fast-tracked careers because of name/family/money and 'not paying their dues.'

I agree that these things are racist in a general sense and intentionally so. What I don't believe is that everyone has that awareness or that everyone who thinks people should follow the path they did or was the norm has necessarily had a single race-based thought on the topic.

 

[MtnBuff]

I can see the old school coaches being concerned about Prime bypassing the traditional route into the profession but I doubt it is very repeatable.

We have all seen the star players in all sports who fail as coaches.

Prime is unique in that he is a guy who combined superior athletic gifts with far above normal work ethic and understanding of the game. His unique personality gives him advantages in recruiting that just being "famous" can't explain. He has motivation skills, management skills, communication skills, and coaching skills. That isn't just because he was a great player.

 

[Buffnik]

I can see the old school coaches being concerned about Prime bypassing the traditional route into the profession but I doubt it is very repeatable.

We have all seen the star players in all sports who fail as coaches.

Prime is unique in that he is a guy who combined superior athletic gifts with far above normal work ethic and understanding of the game. His unique personality gives him advantages in recruiting that just being "famous" can't explain. He has motivation skills, management skills, communication skills, and coaching skills. That isn't just because he was a great player.

It's absolutely repeatable. Look at the NBA. Former top players get HC jobs without having to work their way up from a low paying job cutting game film for scouting reports. And that's appropriate.

 

[MtnBuff]

It's absolutely repeatable. Look at the NBA. Former top players get HC jobs without having to work their way up from a low paying job cutting game film for scouting reports. And that's appropriate.

Two things,

One I would argue that the NBA is a completely different game than college or pro football. NBA doesn't involve the same level of management and control.

Would also argue the NBA stars who have gotten coaching jobs have had mixed success at best. More often the best coaches are guys who were role players or bench guys who had to work hard just to stay in the game as players.

Certainly not saying it couldn't be repeated but I would venture that having a high level of success is going to be rare at best.

 

[Buffnik]

Two things,

One I would argue that the NBA is a completely different game than college or pro football. NBA doesn't involve the same level of management and control.

Would also argue the NBA stars who have gotten coaching jobs have had mixed success at best. More often the best coaches are guys who were role players or bench guys who had to work hard just to stay in the game as players.

Certainly not saying it couldn't be repeated but I would venture that having a high level of success is going to be rare at best.

1. It's not that complex. They're promoting hotshot coordinators in their 30s to HC jobs and having tremendous success by surrounding them with experienced staff for all the stuff you're worried about. No difference in my mind with hiring a HC with a gold jacket or in your ring of honor as your football organization's leader and what personnel you surround him with. The key is the drive & passion for the job and commanding the respect of players & coaches. CEOs set culture and strategy, they don't do granular level tactics.

2. Every hiring profile you can come up with has had mixed success. It's about the guy and the timing. There is no tried and true hiring formula.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Who else do you think could step into a D1 coaching job and succeed like Prime?

I think Peyton Manning could easily do it. I struggle to think of someone else I’d be confident in.

 

[Buffnik]

Who else do you think could step into a D1 coaching job and succeed like Prime?

I think Peyton Manning could easily do it. I struggle to think of someone else I’d be confident in.

The hard part is that most of the elite players have a disconnect that makes them unsuited to coaching. It's hard to relate to people who are incapable of being driven like you were or physically capable of doing the things you did.

CP is rare because he wants to uplift and inspire while also being very much a realist on what he and others are capable of.

 

[Always BUFF]

The hard part is that most of the elite players have a disconnect that makes them unsuited to coaching. It's hard to relate to people who are incapable of being driven like you were or physically capable of doing the things you did.

CP is rare because he wants to uplift and inspire while also being very much a realist on what he and others are capable of.

Coach Mac did his recruiting in the before time...how many players came to Boulder based on who he was and stood for?

 

[SINKRATZ]

Who else do you think could step into a D1 coaching job and succeed like Prime?

I think Peyton Manning could easily do it. I struggle to think of someone else I’d be confident in.

Harbaugh did it at Stanford.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Harbaugh did it at Stanford.

Kind of? He was a QB coach for two years and then HC at SD for 3 years before Stanford.

 

[SINKRATZ]

Kind of? He was a QB coach for two years and then HC at SD for 3 years before Stanford.

Prime coached HS for 9 years then a HC for 3 years at JSU, is that meaningfully different?

 

[Buffnik]

Harbaugh did it at Stanford.

If you're white and the son of a coach it's a totally different and acceptable path to the top, apparently.

 

[SINKRATZ]

If you're white and the son of a coach it's a totally different and acceptable path to the top, apparently.

And look, I get it’s super rare for a former player to get a major HC job without “working his way up” in the traditional way, Harbaugh was just the other obvious example that came to mind. I remember when Stanford made that hire and a lot of people thinking that was waaay too fast based on success at a small school like USD. But like Colorado, Stanford was a dumpster fire, they were a little desperate and didn’t have much to lose and it worked for them. I do think in the modern age of recruiting where it seems to matter more than traditional coaching smarts, this model may be more common particularly if Prime is successful.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Prime coached HS for 9 years then a HC for 3 years at JSU, is that meaningfully different?

You’re right, I guess it’s not too far off, just the two years of NFL position coaching

 

[Buffnik]

And look, I get it’s super rare for a former player to get a major HC job without “working his way up” in the traditional way, Harbaugh was just the other obvious example that came to mind. I remember when Stanford made that hire and a lot of people thinking that was waaay too fast based on success at a small school like USD. But like Colorado, Stanford was a dumpster fire, they were a little desperate and didn’t have much to lose and it worked for them. I do think in the modern age of recruiting where it seems to matter more than traditional coaching smarts, this model may be more common particularly if Prime is successful.

Build elite infrastructure and resources. Then hire the best person to be the face of the program, set the culture, communicate a vision, and lead.

 

[BuffWarHog]

On Venables’ comment, was he responding to a question that mentioned Coach Prime? I could see someone asking something like, “Coach, Deion Sanders replaced almost all of Colorado’s roster, is that something you considered doing?”

Are you saying a sound bite may have been taken out of context in an interview that no one really watched and blown out of proportion. Something the Katie Hnida debacle??

 

[BuffWarHog]

It's absolutely repeatable. Look at the NBA. Former top players get HC jobs without having to work their way up from a low paying job cutting game film for scouting reports. And that's appropriate.

Isn’t there a college coach at Memphis that sorta maybe went this route?