CU has rejoined the Big 12 and broken college football - talking out asses continues

[Bison]

Given that the B1G commissioner or a source said that the B1G would be in four time zones, CU is almost certain to be moving to the B1G. Vic Victory talked about CU being the only MT school not to share television territory in its region with another school. Utah has BYU in its backyard and ditto for UA with ASU in its backyard.

I don’t care if it will take five years for CU to get a full B1G paycheck as long as CU is in the B1G kicking Nebraska up and down the field.

 

[Bison]

SEC could seriously be looking west at the four corners as well. You gotta think the 4 of us are b+ tier selections in the next wave.

That would be with the assumption that the ACC GOR keeps the ACC schools off limits until next decade.

 

[ahoelsken]

I think the SEC has an automatic escalator to their deal, so we'd be able to get a full share there immediately. If the B1G tries to lock the SEC out of the western time zones, an SEC move to snag Phoenix and Denver (ASU & CU) would not be all that shocking.

Even putting the obvious benefits to money and program relevance aside, I'd be pretty good being with ASU, Mizzou, OU, UT & aTm. Pretty damn strong 6-team group if the plan would be to finish it off at 24 total SEC members in 4 groupings for scheduling. Be a really nice 8-game schedule.

Watch UT continue to self-inflict mistakes even after they change leagues.

Steve Sarkisian is on the hot seat in Austin.

 

[FLounder]

Don’t forget fellas we get to schedule two cupcakes a year in the SEC.

 

[skibum]

That selection is laughable for many reasons, both for who it includes in both scenarios, and who it leaves out. I mean UVA as a lock in either scenario? ND left out in the second?

 

[manhattanbuff]

That selection is laughable for many reasons, both for who it includes in both scenarios, and who it leaves out. I mean UVA as a lock in either scenario? ND left out in the second?

Flounder posting this scenario from his Twitter account seems awfully brave.

 

[Goose]

Some of you put way too much weight into what random Twitter accounts are saying.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

That selection is laughable for many reasons, both for who it includes in both scenarios, and who it leaves out. I mean UVA as a lock in either scenario? ND left out in the second?

After listening to various national podcasts, I think UVA is a lock in any scenario and I assume he means ND remains Indy.

 

[hokiehead]

That selection is laughable for many reasons, both for who it includes in both scenarios, and who it leaves out. I mean UVA as a lock in either scenario? ND left out in the second?

edit: TS beat me to it. here's a picture of Garcia playing Deer Creek.

 

[skibum]

Some of you put way too much weight into what random Twitter accounts are saying.

Laughing at the /= putting weight into their theories.

After listening to various national podcasts, I think UVA is a lock in any scenario and I assume he means ND remains Indy.

I... don't get why. They don't get ratings, they don't deliver a meaningful market, they don't actually care about football. Their inclusion seems to me to be more based on an east coast media bias (which is a real thing) and basic assumption that of course they'd be in.

If you're just going to assume that UVA is in without applying the same metrics to them as you apply to the west coast schools then you should just assume that CU is in too, for many of the same assumptions. Either the metrics matter, or they don't.

 

[The Alabaster Yak]

Laughing at the /= putting weight into their theories.

I... don't get why. They don't get ratings, they don't deliver a meaningful market, they don't actually care about football. Their inclusion seems to me to be more based on an east coast media bias (which is a real thing) and basic assumption that of course they'd be in.

If you're just going to assume that UVA is in without applying the same metrics to them as you apply to the west coast schools then you should just assume that CU is in too, for many of the same assumptions. Either the metrics matter, or they don't.

UVA is the flagship university in the 12th most populous state in the country. I’d have to go back and find the pod where Andy Staples talked about it, but there seemed to be a consensus that the ACC locks to get a P2 invite were Clemson, FSU, UNC, Miami and UVA.

 

[hokiehead]

Laughing at the /= putting weight into their theories.

I... don't get why. They don't get ratings, they don't deliver a meaningful market, they don't actually care about football. Their inclusion seems to me to be more based on an east coast media bias (which is a real thing) and basic assumption that of course they'd be in.

If you're just going to assume that UVA is in without applying the same metrics to them as you apply to the west coast schools then you should just assume that CU is in too, for many of the same assumptions. Either the metrics matter, or they don't.

if either P2 conference wants the state of Virginia, UVA is a stronger contender than VT.

bigger presence in the WMA and Richmond (not sure how that impacts carrier money), longer tradition, AAU, flagship state school, more money (bigger endowment), stronger rivalry with most valuable program in the ACC, and Blacksburg is a PITA to travel to (Boeheim agreed to vote for VT's membership in the old Big East iff Syracuse basketball wouldn't be required to travel there).

 

[ahoelsken]

Vic Victory is a dumb****. Stop posting his tweets in here. If you look hard, guys, you'll find his "musings" in this thread already.

 

[onealcd]

Vic Victory is a dumb****. Stop posting his tweets in here. If you look hard, guys, you'll find his "musings" in this thread already.

Dude you literally talk **** about Wilner every other post despite him being the most reputable west coast college sports journalist. Just because someone doesn’t agree with your opinion doesn’t mean they have an agenda or they are wrong.

also I have no idea who Vic victory is.

 

[Liver]

Some of you put way too much weight into what random Twitter accounts are saying.

and not nearly enough weight on what random allbuffs pundits are saying!

wait.

scratch that.

no one knows **** but i am pretty sure we are going to end up screwed in some horrible way.

 

[chipwich]

 

[hokiehead]

Wilner broke the USC / UCLA story and his reporting was 100% accurate on that. I think that earns him some cred -- he clearly has knowledgeable sources.

 

[ahoelsken]

Dude you literally talk **** about Wilner every other post despite him being the most reputable west coast college sports journalist. Just because someone doesn’t agree with your opinion doesn’t mean they have an agenda or they are wrong.

also I have no idea who Vic victory is.

He has a pro-Pac 10 agenda and is wrong. Same with Canzano.

Vic Victory's moronic musings can be found earlier in this thread.

 

[onealcd]

He has a pro-Pac 10 agenda and is wrong.

Vic Victory's moronic musings can be found earlier in this thread.

That wasn’t a question about who he was, just that when you bash every journalist who doesn’t agree with you No one cares about your opinion about your opinion on any of them.

 

[ahoelsken]

That wasn’t a question about who he was, just that when you bash every journalist who doesn’t agree with you No one cares about your opinion about your opinion on any of them.

Same damn journalist who was all "why would anybody leave the Pac 10 for a few more million dollars?" the other day. He's got about as much insight into what's actually going on here as you and I do.....and a pro-Pac 12 bias that is silly. Almost like he's pissing his pants about having to cover the A's full time.

 

[FLounder]

I for one, believe everything I read, especially if it’s on twitter.

 

[skibum]

UVA is the flagship university in the 12th most populous state in the country. I’d have to go back and find the pod where Andy Staples talked about it, but there seemed to be a consensus that the ACC locks to get a P2 invite were Clemson, FSU, UNC, Miami and UVA.

Despite being the "12th most populous state," UVA is a pretty small school (smaller than CU) - which means surprisingly few alumni for being the supposed "flagship." Almost no one in DC gives a **** about UVA football - they have some basketball fans, but even that is limited, because the school is, well, small.

VT is remote as hell, but they put out 50% more graduates every single year than UVA - over time that really adds up. And yeah, there are definitely quite a few VT football fans around.

The public universities in Virginia are just different than in a lot of states. "Flagship" is kind of a pointless term. We're used to it meaning a certain set of things that just are not the case in VA (or in a few other east coast states). In VA, George Mason and VT are both much larger schools, and even VCU is a little bigger; ODU is the same size as UVA. I guess the thing to understand is that UVA / VT is *a lot* more similar to Penn/Penn State than it is to say CU / CSU.

 

[hokiehead]

... I guess the thing to understand is that UVA / VT is *a lot* more similar to Penn/Penn State than it is to say CU / CSU.

I so wish that was true, but I don't believe it is.

 

[Bison]

I... don't get why. They don't get ratings, they don't deliver a meaningful market, they don't actually care about football. Their inclusion seems to me to be more based on an east coast media bias (which is a real thing) and basic assumption that of course they'd be in.

If you're just going to assume that UVA is in without applying the same metrics to them as you apply to the west coast schools then you should just assume that CU is in too, for many of the same assumptions. Either the metrics matter, or they don't.

I believe both the SEC and B1G emphasize continuous states when it comes to expansion but you might have to toss that out the window for the B1G. UVA fits that in both the B1G & SEC just like CU does for both conferences. Not only the DC area is UVA TV terrority (in addition to UMD & VT) but Richmond and the Tidewater basin area of SE VA. That's a good recruiting region as well.

UVA would be a good addition despite their attitude towards football because if you have too many traditional powerhouses in the same conference, some people are going to be upset. It's not like the soccer relegation system where the better teams move up while struggling teams move down and that is a mistake that I think a big majority of CFB fans are making in their assumptions who should be added to the B1G and SEC.

The reason the B1G hasn't expanded further is that the B1G hasn't finalized the new media rights deal and the commissioner said that would be done next month. Smart of CU to hold on because it appears that they still have a shot at the B1G & SEC in this case. It might be crazy thinking but there's still a chance that happens. If that wasn't the case, CU would be in the Big 12 by now.

 

[Bison]

I so wish that was true, but I don't believe it is.

Agree with you. Penn/Penn State and CU/CSU are not good comparisons for VT/UVA at this point. I'd say UNC/NCSU, Clemson/USC, GT/UGA, Bama/Auburn, etc are better comparisons.

 

[hokiehead]

Agree with you. Penn/Penn State and CU/CSU are not good comparisons for VT/UVA at this point. I'd say UNC/NCSU, Clemson/USC, GT/UGA, Bama/Auburn, etc are better comparisons.

I'm mildly curious which you think is VT and which UVA in the 2nd and 4th examples

my main objection w/ the Penn/PSU analog was the private to public aspect.

 

[onealcd]

Same damn journalist who was all "why would anybody leave the Pac 10 for a few more million dollars?" the other day. He's got about as much insight into what's actually going on here as you and I do.....and a pro-Pac 12 bias that is silly. Almost like he's pissing his pants about having to cover the A's full time.

When the defections hit and the revenue shrinks there is not a big incentive for teams to jump conferences for 2 million extra when they have to ship ALL teams across the country and increase the cost of operating. Especially when you are oregon or Washington and that would include losing a huge money maker with their in state rivals. The Apple cup is regularly on national tv in a good time slot. Surely you are smart enough to understand that…..

Wilner knows his **** and actually broke the news of usc and ucla leaving for the big 10. He has been very critical of the conference and always been truthful.

 

[hokiehead]

When the defections hit and the revenue shrinks there is not a big incentive for teams to jump conferences for 2 million extra when they have to ship ALL teams across the country and increase the cost of operating. Especially when you are oregon or Washington and that would include losing a huge money maker with their in state rivals. The Apple cup is regularly on national tv in a good time slot. Surely you are smart enough to understand that…..

Wilner knows his **** and actually broke the news of usc and ucla leaving for the big 10. He has been very critical of the conference and always been truthful.

agree with everything but the "all teams". I think we're really really close to seeing football separate from all other sports which will fall into regional conferences. Hell, even today, I don't think it makes sense for Miami to be traveling to Syracuse for a volleyball match, or Rutgers to Nebraska for a softball game, etc...

 

[skibum]

I'm mildly curious which you think is VT and which UVA in the 2nd and 4th examples

my main objection w/ the Penn/PSU analog was the private to public aspect.

My main reason for making the analog is due to the substantial academic disparity between the schools.

This isn't actually that big of a knock on VT - it's more about how high up UVA is. Excluding the small state engineering schools, I'm pretty sure that UVA has the highest average SAT/GPA/etc score of any public university in the country. Yes - it's higher than Cal. And we all know how serious Cal alumni are about their football team.

If it's all about revenue and markets VT is going to win out, and it's not even really going to be all that close.

And that's what's driving my skepticism about UVA "obviously" being in.

If it's "obvious," then some other criteria are being used, and you need to use those same criteria to evaluate the western schools.

It can't all be about revenue and markets when you talk about, I don't know, say a school like CU, but then be about some other criteria when it comes to UVA.

 

[MarkW]

agree with everything but the "all teams". I think we're really really close to seeing football separate from all other sports which will fall into regional conferences. Hell, even today, I don't think it makes sense for Miami to be traveling to Syracuse for a volleyball match, or Rutgers to Nebraska for a softball game, etc...

It really doesn't make sense at all for soccer, volleyball, etc., to have to fly 3, 4 hrs., etc., for matches. I am all for separating football conferences from thee conference all the other sports participate in. I would include basketball as well as they travel much more than football.