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Official 2019/20 CFB Coaching Carousel

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hokiehead said:
I know this is just semantics.

I expect it from NFL fans, but I'm a bit surprised at the number of posters ITT making a distinction between 'coaching' and 'recruiting' in college football.

My perspective is that I very much view recruiting as an element of college coaching, arguably the most important element of the job description, and not as a distinct role.
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Agree, it’s all ultimately coaching but, to me at least, there are distinct elements:

1.Recruiting
2. Deployment
3. Development
4. Motivation
5. Strategy (scheming)

Not that different that any other managerial role.
 
Buffnik said:
I agree with you if we're talking about position coaches. Recruiting is the majority of the job, so I'm very comfortable saying that it's inseparable. If a position coach isn't a good recruiter, he isn't a good college coach. Period.

With coordinators, we can separate recruiting as a separate job function. Someone can still be a great college DC and position coach without being a great recruiter.

I'm glad you brought this up because it's something I'd like to see change with the way a lot of CU fans look at things. We've had way too many position coaches under GB, DH, JE and MM (we'll find out about MT) who were sold to us as great "coaches on the field" but didn't recruit worth a lick. Screw that noise. We shouldn't buy it or defend it. If a position coach isn't a good recruiter, he can't be a good coach on the college level.
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I agree in the context of this program, and I'd take your line of thinking to another level-when you're trying to take a program from below average to good/great like Mel is here, the entire staff needs to make recruiting a priority. Second, you've gotta know the areas where you have to pull talent out of and hit them as hard as you can. Bill McCartney got this. Mike MacIntyre didn't until Chev got here-Texas and Louisiana aren't areas where we can go beat out (Insert name of Group of 5 program(s) here) for a couple kids a class. We need impact talent coming out of there-Chev got Viska and Nixon here. I have no doubt he's pretty heavily involved in the recruitment of Ashaad Clayton.
 
hawg1 said:
Agree, it’s all ultimately coaching but, to me at least, there are distinct, yet interwoven elements:

1.Recruiting
2. Deployment
3. Development
4. Motivation
5. Strategy (scheming)

Not that different that any other managerial role.
Click to expand...
FIFY! Those elements are not "boxes", but rather more like strands of a rope!
 
onealcd said:
Scheme matters more than people want to admit, a great example is Brady from LSU. He hates recruiting but he did and amazing job with the offense.
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Yep, indeed. Better suited for pros, where match ups and mismatches make even more difference than in college. He also had an OC mind playing QB.
 
onealcd said:
Scheme matters more than people want to admit, a great example is Brady from LSU. He hates recruiting but he did and amazing job with the offense.
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Agreed. Mike Leach is a perfect example of this, but in college, I think that is exception, not the rule.

Guys that hate recruiting don't stick around in college for very long. If they stay, they typically stay in a coordinator role that doesn't require as much recruiting as the position coach or HC.
 
onealcd said:
Scheme matters more than people want to admit, a great example is Brady from LSU. He hates recruiting but he did and amazing job with the offense.
Click to expand...

Comparing CU and LSU doesn't work because they're in very different situations-Mel took over a below average program. He also hasn't had to sit in the big chair since that stint as the interim with the Jags in 2011 or whenever. I'm not sure how valuable that experience was in this context for that matter-you're taking over for a guy like he did your main goal is to just get through the rest of that season. There were going to be growing pains-We saw some of that in the 4th quarter against USC. If the 2020 Buffs find themselves in that situation again, I don't think Mel punts twice in USC territory and prays his defense can get a stop.....which maybe gets you another win. Any way you swing it, we need to upgrade the talent level on this team. Thus, Mel needs 10 guys who are going to bust their asses on the trail. As smart a guy as Joe Brady is from all accounts, he wouldn't have done well here because he hates to recruit. Same thing with Chip Kelly (who admitted to Oregon boosters he hates recruiting). You can joke about him all you want and question the approach he took/is taking at UCLA, but he knows offensive football.

LSU has had the talent to compete with Alabama and every single other program in the country for a number of years-They've won at least 8 games for 20 consecutive years. Their schemes (in particular offensively) were what was holding them back-Compare their 2019 game with Alabama to that hideous 29-0 loss they took to Alabama in 2018. Ed Orgeron didn't hire Joe Brady because he was an excellent recruiter-he needed somebody who understood how to revamp what they were doing offensively to consistently compete with and overtake Alabama.
 
patebuff said:
Agreed. Mike Leach is a perfect example of this, but in college, I think that is exception, not the rule.

Guys that hate recruiting don't stick around in college for very long. If they stay, they typically stay in a coordinator role that doesn't require as much recruiting as the position coach or HC.
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He's also never put himself in a situation where he's expected to compete for a title yearly-and he's not at one in Starkville. If he's bowling every year, his AD gets out of his way.
 
Orlando is a good coach. He knows the 3-4 and seems to keep things simpler than Pendergast on the overall scheme to let the athletes play loose and get on the field faster -- which I'd normally say is ideal for USC, but I don't know if that's the case if they're bringing in recruiting classes like they did this year.
 
USC is probably in a tough spot for the next couple years, but Orlando is a definite upgrade to Pendergast IMO. They lose a lot at WR, but should still have plenty of 5* WRs hanging around and a good QB.

If they lose Harrell though..
 
White_Rabbit said:
USC is probably in a tough spot for the next couple years, but Orlando is a definite upgrade to Pendergast IMO. They lose a lot at WR, but should still have plenty of 5* WRs hanging around and a good QB.

If they lose Harrell though..
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Keep an eye on their DL recruiting this year. 2021 could get ugly if draft eligible guys declare.
 
Rob DeVere said:
WHY? If he couldn't get it done in Texas with their HS talent base.....

Still not convinced he's top notch DC. And what happened to Pendergast, anyway? He was a sought-after commodiy for quite awhile.
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Because he's a well thought of coach and one bad year at Texas doesn't make a coach? He obviously has to right the ship, but he was pretty desired when Texas got him. Herman needed a sacrifice at the altar and since he's an offense guy, it makes sense to throw the defense guy to the wolves.

Pendergast has never been overly highly thought of in college football afaik. His career is trending downwards big time. He's a NFL guy wandering the college football land probably because he can't get a NFL DC job. He doesn't recruit and doesn't make up for it with his coordinating.
 
White_Rabbit said:
Because he's a well thought of coach and one bad year at Texas doesn't make a coach? He obviously has to right the ship, but he was pretty desired when Texas got him. Herman needed a sacrifice at the altar and since he's an offense guy, it makes sense to throw the defense guy to the wolves.

Pendergast has never been overly highly thought of in college football afaik. His career is trending downwards big time. He's a NFL guy wandering the college football land probably because he can't get a NFL DC job. He doesn't recruit and doesn't make up for it with his coordinating.
Click to expand...

When you start firing coordinators (See Derek Mason at Vandy and Kevin Sumlin at UA for even more obvious examples of this), you're more often than not in a spot where its win or else. Helton needs a New Year's Six appearance (saying it this way because the Rose and Sugar are the 2021 CFP semis) at minimum to stay beyond this year. If he doesn't get there and Mike Bohn/Carol Folt (because we all know Bohnhead doesn't do anything until his boss says he can) aren't willing to make a change, I'm not sure those two survive. Nothing pisses boosters off like the nonsense he spewed in his statements announcing USC's decision to retain Helton. That being said, I don't see USC doing better than Todd Orlando. If I'm Morgan Scalley at Utah or (insert name of other hot DC candidate here), I'm not even picking up the phone if I get a call from USC-that situation is that ****ing toxic right now. Orlando has a track record that shows he's a capable DC (he's not ever going to be the type who runs top 10 defenses every year), and his last two defenses at Texas got bit hard by the injury bug-but that line only does so much to explain away the struggles they had in particular this past year.
 
I dunno. If they can coexist on the same campus this could be a really good hire. Pelini knows defense and with the athetes lsu can recruit, look out.
 
If Pelini goes back to LSU. I hope they put the sputtering Nubs on their OOC schedule. The Fuskers need to pay for those facility upgrades somehow...
 
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